Ron Paul

[TelecasterLPGTop]

Electoral fraud is rife in the US. Ron Paul is way ahead in all the straw polls yet the corporate controlled media are ignoring him. It's bizarre and criminal yet the sleeping mainstream simply believe their corrupt media which is controlled by a corrupt State which is leading the US down the road to Fascism. They are terrified of Ron Paul and his followers for they have woken up to a system that was infiltrated by foreign banking/corporate interests over the last 50 years with the purpose of bringing down the USA, destroying the constitution and replacing it all with a Fascist State.

[Švejk]

cite?

[Kolga]

Ron Paul is a nutjob, and his followers are deluded.

[Frank]

Originally Posted by TelecasterLPGTop

Electoral fraud is rife in the US. Ron Paul is way ahead in all the straw polls yet the corporate controlled media are ignoring him.

Huh. How's he doing in the primaries and caucuses?

[Robot Arm]

Originally Posted by TelecasterLPGTop

They are terrified of Ron Paul and his followers for they have woken up to a system that was infiltrated by foreign banking/corporate interests over the last 50 years with the purpose of bringing down the USA, destroying the constitution and replacing it all with a Fascist State.

Why would foreign banking and corporate interests want to do that? Seems to me they make a lot more money from a nation of capitalist consumers than they would if our government collapsed and we became fascist.

[Algorithm]

Originally Posted by Frank

Huh. How's he doing in the primaries and caucuses?

He'd be doing a lot better if it weren't for all the electoral fraud, obviously.

[Frank]

Originally Posted by Algorithm

He'd be doing a lot better if it weren't for all the electoral fraud, obviously.

Of course. Obviously I didn't think this all the way through.

I'm still mildly confused as to how the corporate controlled and corrupt media is committing electoral fraud, but I suppose I just have to think some more.

[kunilou]

Funny, here's a story on Ron Paul that was published today by the mainstream media.

Despite Mitt Romney winning Washington state's straw poll at the precinct caucuses in early March, the fight for the state's 43 delegates is still brewing.

The Rick Santorum and Ron Paul camps are teaming up to deny Romney delegates at the state convention, seemingly channeling those delegates to Santorum's turf, The Seattle Times reported Saturday (http://bit.ly/H5bnjf).

So is Ron Paul's campaign actively working to steal delegates from Mitt Romeny, despite Romney winning straw polls and caucases? Sounds like Paul is trying to destroy the Constitution!

[Frank]

Originally Posted by kunilou

Funny, here's a story on Ron Paul that was published today by the mainstream media.

So is Ron Paul's campaign actively working to steal delegates from Mitt Romeny, despite Romney winning straw polls and caucases? Sounds like Paul is trying to destroy the Constitution!

I wondered about that, and mentioned it the in thread on the Colorado caucus. That caucus had a straw poll (which Santorum won), but also selected officially uncommitted delegates to the next (regional) level. Those delegates can support any delegate they like to state level (and those delegates will be committed), and that could include Paul, Romney, and Gingrich; and commit no delegates at all to the winner of the straw poll.

This whole Republican system this year is just weird.

[njtt]

Originally Posted by Robot Arm

Why would foreign banking and corporate interests want to do that? Seems to me they make a lot more money from a nation of capitalist consumers than they would if our government collapsed and we became fascist.

Are you under the impression that there is some sort of incompatibility between capitalism and fascism? Quite the contrary. Fascism is the combination of a totalitarian, dictatorial political system with a capitalist economic system. It does not involve a "collapsed" government either, but a very strong one.

(I am not supporting the OP here. Ron Paul is a loon and I doubt whether America is really on the brink of falling into fascism, but please get your terms right. To imply that fascism means the end of capitalism is on a par with calling Obama a socialist.)

[bdgr]

Even if the evil corporate controlled media never existed and I had lived in a cave for the last 10 years, and I based my opinion on just the words coming out of Ron Pauls own mouth, I would want anyone elected but him. i think his ideas are terrible. I think his grasp of ecconomics is beyond poor.

He will not be president, not because of some corporate conspiracy but because he wouldn't be very good at it.

[Measure for Measure]

FTR, Ron Paul bought the mailing list of an anti-Holocaust group, because he thought those personalities might enjoy his newsletter. So claims that he opposes a Fascist state are a little rich. Besides, the guy is working hand in glove with Romney anyway. Discussion.

[Exapno Mapcase]

Originally Posted by TelecasterLPGTop

They are terrified of Ron Paul and his followers

Well, I certainly am! Holy smoke, look at the stuff they'll post on a public message board!

[emcee2k]

Originally Posted by Measure for Measure

FTR, Ron Paul bought the mailing list of an anti-Holocaust group, because he thought those personalities might enjoy his newsletter. So claims that he opposes a Fascist state are a little rich. Besides, the guy is working hand in glove with Romney anyway. Discussion.

Anti-Holocaust means Holocaust denier, right? Because, I know I probably wouldn't join a group over it, but I consider myself pretty anti-Holocaust.

[Robot Arm]

Originally Posted by njtt

Are you under the impression that there is some sort of incompatibility between capitalism and fascism? Quite the contrary. Fascism is the combination of a totalitarian, dictatorial political system with a capitalist economic system. It does not involve a "collapsed" government either, but a very strong one.

Fascism and capitalism can exist together, certainly, but I was questioning the OP, which said:

...with the purpose of bringing down the USA, destroying the constitution and replacing it all with a Fascist State.

I do consider that to be a collapse of the government, and such a turn of events would probably bring about sufficient economic turmoil as to lower the profits of those "foreign banking/corporate interests" that are allegedly trying to cause such a collapse.

[Lord Feldon]

Well, I've never seen someone argue on the internet for Ron Paul before, especially while spouting conspiracy theories too. I'm sold.

[Miller]

Originally Posted by TelecasterLPGTop

They are terrified of Ron Paul and his followers for they have woken up to a system that was infiltrated by foreign banking/corporate interests over the last 50 years with the purpose of bringing down the USA, destroying the constitution and replacing it all with a Fascist State.

"Foreign bankers," eh? Why not just go ahead and say, "Jews?" It's not like there's anyone out there who doesn't know what you're trying to say, anyway.

[gamerunknown]

That caucus had a straw poll (which Santorum won)

Santorum all over the straw poll? Must be the lamestream media conducting it!

[Der Trihs]

Originally Posted by General Mills

"Foreign bankers," eh? Why not just go ahead and say, "Jews?"

Well, he might be referring to the alien lizard people. Which would be much more interesting; paranoia over Jewish conspiracies is so dated. "The banks are being taken over by the lizard people" would be far more entertaining than yet more ranting about the Jews.

[Jasper Kent]

Aren't the lizard people controlled by The Illuminati? Or am I thinking of the Freemasons?

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Jasper Kent

Aren't the lizard people controlled by The Illuminati? Or am I thinking of the Freemasons?

You are thinking whatever our Illizardati Jewmason overlords want you to think.

Keep it up.

[Finagle]

Originally Posted by TelecasterLPGTop

Electoral fraud is rife in the US. Ron Paul is way ahead in all the straw polls yet the corporate controlled media are ignoring him. It's bizarre and criminal yet the sleeping mainstream simply believe their corrupt media which is controlled by a corrupt State which is leading the US down the road to Fascism. They are terrified of Ron Paul and his followers for they have woken up to a system that was infiltrated by foreign banking/corporate interests over the last 50 years with the purpose of bringing down the USA, destroying the constitution and replacing it all with a Fascist State.

On one hand, we have the theory that there's a massive conspiracy to prevent Ron Paul from being elected President.

On the other hand, we could maybe propose a theory that it's easy for a small but enthusiastic fan base to influence a straw poll that no one cares much about anyway, but it's a heck of a lot harder to get more than that small fan base to vote for your wacky candidate in a more general election.

I'm going to have to ponder which of those theories makes more sense to me.

[John Mace]

It's the corn, I tell you. It's the corn!!

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by John Mace

It's the corn, I tell you. It's the corn!!

Cogito ergot sum trip . . .

[newcomer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHh4_fFtIns

Simple question for hollier-than-thou: is embassy in Baghdad a defence spending or a waste?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embassy...tates,_Baghdad

Notables: $0.75 Billion to build and employs 16,000 people.

However, something tells me it's all water under Tigris River bridge now

[Fear Itself]

Originally Posted by TelecasterLPGTop

Ron Paul is way ahead in all the straw polls yet the corporate controlled media are ignoring him.

How is it that the Fascists have been unable to control the straw polls?

[Exapno Mapcase]

Originally Posted by Fear Itself

How is it that the Fascists have been unable to control the straw polls?

Fascists are allergic to straw. It's their one weakness. The Russians built tanks out of straw and won WWII in the wheat fields of the Ukraine.

Don't you remember their stirring slogan: Победите соломенных мужчин

Or, Defeat the straw men!

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by TelecasterLPGTop

They are terrified of Ron Paul and his followers for they have woken up to a system that was infiltrated by foreign banking/corporate interests over the last 50 years with the purpose of bringing down the USA, destroying the constitution and replacing it all with a Fascist State.

Originally Posted by General Mills

"Foreign bankers," eh? Why not just go ahead and say, "Jews?" It's not like there's anyone out there who doesn't know what you're trying to say, anyway.

So, a Jewish Fascist State. Interesting concept. Heil Momma!

[WillFarnaby]

Originally Posted by Measure for Measure

Besides, the guy is working hand in glove with Romney anyway. Discussion.

Oh a discussion on SDMB is your cite? Powerful stuff considering not a single piece of evidence is provided in that thread to support your theory. Maybe you also failed to read the post in this very thread that suggests supporters of Santorum and supporters of Paul are cooperating in WA to deny Romney delegates. If half-baked conspiracy theories are your style, I wonder if you and the OP could find some common interests.

[Der Trihs]

Originally Posted by Jasper Kent

Aren't the lizard people controlled by The Illuminati? Or am I thinking of the Freemasons?

It's lizards all the way down.

[WillFarnaby]

Originally Posted by TelecasterLPGTop

Electoral fraud is rife in the US. Ron Paul is way ahead in all the straw polls yet the corporate controlled media are ignoring him. It's bizarre and criminal yet the sleeping mainstream simply believe their corrupt media which is controlled by a corrupt State which is leading the US down the road to Fascism. They are terrified of Ron Paul and his followers for they have woken up to a system that was infiltrated by foreign banking/corporate interests over the last 50 years with the purpose of bringing down the USA, destroying the constitution and replacing it all with a Fascist State.

What evidence do you have that "foreign banking/corporate interests" have any objective other than improving their net worth? Do you think Ron Paul believes the corporate jnterests' pursuit of this objective is damaging to society or helpful?

[Marley23]

Ron Paul has indeed won more straw polls than any other candidate, but the fact that Herman Cain has won the second-most should tell you all you need to know: there have not been that many straw polls lately. Most of them were held long before the Iowa caucuses and the start of actual voting and delegate-committing. The early straw polls were good for Paul- not that many people cared to participate, but his supporters were motivated and they did. It actually costs money to vote in the Ames straw poll, for example, so Ron Paul supporters will do that and a lot of other people won't. In the primaries and caucuses, Ron Paul is a very distant fourth. In some primaries he's finishing third, ahead of Newt Gingrich, but that says more about how poorly Gingrich is doing. Neither one of them is close to Romney or Santorum.

[Chronos]

Quoth Der Trihs:

Well, he might be referring to the alien lizard people. Which would be much more interesting; paranoia over Jewish conspiracies is so dated. "The banks are being taken over by the lizard people" would be far more entertaining than yet more ranting about the Jews.

I think the subtext of the whole "alien lizard people" thing is supposed to be that Jews are all alien lizard people. How else can one explain how successful they've been (aside from that whole unpleasantness in the '30s and '40s, of course)?

[Measure for Measure]

Originally Posted by emcee2k

Anti-Holocaust means Holocaust denier, right? Because, I know I probably wouldn't join a group over it, but I consider myself pretty anti-Holocaust.

Ouch! I was referring to Ron Paul's purchase of the mailing list of the holocaust denying Liberty Lobby.

Originally Posted by WillFarnaby

Oh a discussion on SDMB is your cite? Powerful stuff considering not a single piece of evidence is provided in that thread to support your theory. Maybe you also failed to read the post in this very thread that suggests supporters of Santorum and supporters of Paul are cooperating in WA to deny Romney delegates. If half-baked conspiracy theories are your style, I wonder if you and the OP could find some common interests.

In that thread, you claimed that Ron Paul had aired anti-Romney ads. I asked for a citation. I'm still waiting. Please place your answer or retraction in the other thread.

And, um, it's not surprising that Ron Paul wants to take delegates away from Romney. What's odd is that Ron Paul never attacked Mitt Romney during the 20 debates that he attended -- yet he attacked Santorum 22 times. Since our discussion though, I recall a few mild anti-Romney words released by the Ron Paul campaign, FTR. "Hand in glove" was hyperbole.

[gamerunknown]

Do you think Ron Paul believes the corporate jnterests' pursuit of this objective is damaging to society or helpful?

Damaging. He called corporatism "soft fascism". Unfortunately (perhaps due to his adulation of Rand and freshwater leanings) he didn't propose that a hierarchical economic model is soft feudalism and endorse democracy in the workplace.

[Švejk]

Originally Posted by Chronos

I think the subtext of the whole "alien lizard people" thing is supposed to be that Jews are all alien lizard people. How else can one explain how successful they've been (aside from that whole unpleasantness in the '30s and '40s, of course)?

Yeah, for a race of shadowy overlords secretly controlling all that goes on in the world behind the scenes, those Jews are doing a pretty piss-poor job.

OT: what's the deal with Ron Paul being considered a libertarian but at the same time not being pro-choice and also opposing SSM? How did this guy end up being associated with the Libertarian party, that makes no sense to me.

[gamerunknown]

Here's Chomsky on Anarchocapitalism (there are many different, nuanced varieties: minarchism, agorism, paleolibertarianism... Strict Constitutionalism tends to edge this way too).

As I'm an anarcho-syndicalist (European, classical libertarian), they tend to hold opposing views to me, though not diametrically opposed as state capitalists often are.

[Measure for Measure]

Originally Posted by Švejk

OT: what's the deal with Ron Paul being considered a libertarian but at the same time not being pro-choice and also opposing SSM? How did this guy end up being associated with the Libertarian party, that makes no sense to me.

In the US, Libertarianism is a code-word for reactionaries who like smoking pot. There is ample scope for true libertarian cooperation with liberals. But mostly speaking, Cato et al haven't pursued such opportunities: instead they get snuggly with the Koch Bros., plutocrats who excel in turning campaign contributions into government subsidies and back again.

[WillFarnaby]

Originally Posted by gamerunknown

Damaging. He called corporatism "soft fascism". Unfortunately (perhaps due to his adulation of Rand and freshwater leanings) he didn't propose that a hierarchical economic model is soft feudalism and endorse democracy in the workplace.

Not necessarily. Yes of course corporatism is soft fascism, but that doesn't mean he thinks a business' desire to increase its net worth is damaging.

[Voyager]

Originally Posted by gamerunknown

Santorum all over the straw poll?

Ewww! Get some disinfectant for that straw!

[Really Not All That Bright]

Whoah. The OP has more than one post!

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by gamerunknown

Damaging. He called corporatism "soft fascism".

Corporatism (which does not mean what you or Paul thinks it does) is an element of some forms of fascism.

[gamerunknown]

You're right, I wasn't aware of that term. I suppose corporatism is still a useful descriptor of the philosophy underlying the legal obligation of corporations though.

Also, funnily enough, corporatism in its original form was hierarchical too.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by gamerunknown

You're right, I wasn't aware of that term. I suppose corporatism is still a useful descriptor of the philosophy underlying the legal obligation of corporations though.

Also, funnily enough, corporatism in its original form was hierarchical too.

The word you're probably looking for -- meaning, business influence in politics -- is "corporatocracy." Which is not fascism, but is what the German capitalists foolishly thought they were buying when they backed Hitler.

The key difference between businesscritters and fascists is that businesscritters, as such, are concerned only with profit, while fascists are a kind of artistic romantics whose concerns are more complex. (It has been said of Franco that he was no fascist because he was "a cop, not an artist.")

[Exapno Mapcase]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

Corporatism (which does not mean what you or Paul thinks it does) is an element of some forms of fascism.

Just because a word once meant one thing doesn't stop its meaning from changing over time.

corporatism

1890, from corporate + -ism. Used over the years in various senses of corporate, in 1920s-30s often with reference to fascist collectivism.

[Jackmannii]

Originally Posted by TelecasterLPGTop

Electoral fraud is rife in the US. Ron Paul is way ahead in all the straw polls yet the corporate controlled media are ignoring him. It's bizarre and criminal yet the sleeping mainstream simply believe their corrupt media which is controlled by a corrupt State which is leading the US down the road to Fascism. They are terrified of Ron Paul and his followers for they have woken up to a system that was infiltrated by foreign banking/corporate interests over the last 50 years with the purpose of bringing down the USA, destroying the constitution and replacing it all with a Fascist State.

Yes, but we're all having a good time.

But really - Ron Paul does so well in straw polls, has his gremlins spamming message boards and letters to the editor sections in newspapers complaining about how popular and yet obscure he is, gets plenty of media stories done about him (especially considering his lack of primary wins), and he can't get elected because of a fascist banker conspiracy? Have you considered the possibility that he's a fringe candidate with a powerful appeal, but only to a small and disproportionately loud gaggle of devotees who've read a book on economics?

Another thought...is Ron going to keep on running for President in future elections, gradually becoming the Lyndon Larouche of the Republican Party? Will the scatterbrained youth of America still worship him when he's in his late nineties?

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Jackmannii

But really - Ron Paul does so well in straw polls, has his gremlins spamming message boards and letters to the editor sections in newspapers complaining about how popular and yet obscure he is, gets plenty of media stories done about him (especially considering his lack of primary wins), and he can't get elected because of a fascist banker conspiracy? Have you considered the possibility that he's a fringe candidate with a powerful appeal, but only to a small and disproportionately loud gaggle of devotees who've read a book on economics?

Oh, come on, you really think they've read a book on economics?

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Exapno Mapcase

Just because a word once meant one thing doesn't stop its meaning from changing over time.

corporatism

Still, I think "corporatocracy" should be the preferred term, to avoid confusion with the original sense of "corporatism" (referring to a thing which has not quite gone away and therefore remains relevant).

[E-Sabbath]

And here I thought the Op would be a big Thaddeus McCotter fan.
http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2011/0...plans-his-own/

[Really Not All That Bright]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

Oh, come on, you really think they've read a book on economics?

He didn't say it was a good book.