Even More Baseball Questions

[pianodave]

Hi SD, here’s my batch of questions for the day.

1. What does a first-baseman talk about to a player on first base? Or any fielder to an opposing baserunner. Is it exchanging pleasantries, or is there some friendly competition involved? Knowing how the exchange of a few choice words can lead to bench-clearing brawls, is there some rule of etiquette regarding what can be talked about? Do players bring either their longstanding enmity or friendship into the actual game itself…? In other words, are there instances in which players’ relationships lead to a change in how they pitch, field, or hit? You know, trying to hit someone you don’t like, etc.

2. How do baseball players view each other financially? According to Baseball-reference, the minimum salary for a player is $300,000. Is there any competition or camaraderie that comes from knowing that the next player over is making a lot of money as well, possibly more than you are?

3. How do players react being traded from a winning team to a losing team? Even if the money is good, doesn’t it cause resentment that the whole year might be wasted if you know you don’t have a shot? Yes you’re making more money, but you’re going to be playing another 80 games with a crap team that’s in the cellar. All that work and you know you’re not going to the playoffs.

4. Are players banned from swearing in the dugout? I ask this because whenever the TV station goes to the dugout congratulating a batter for a home run, you never hear “Fuck yeah” or “Nice fucking job” or equivalent.

5. Similarly, how do other players react to pitchers coming in and slamming bats down in frustration or kicking chairs and benches? You would think such a display is tantamount to a tantrum, and embarrassing, but do other players console the upset player?

6. Finally, can a manager ever come out just to talk to a pitcher or is it always taking the ball from him and inserting a new one? Maybe in a tough spot the pitcher would feel more comfortable hearing from his manager and not his pitching coach.

[Pixel_Dent]

@pianodave

6. Finally, can a manager ever come out just to talk to a pitcher or is it always taking the ball from him and inserting a new one? Maybe in a tough spot the pitcher would feel more comfortable hearing from his manager and not his pitching coach.

The manager is allowed one freebie per inning. The second time he visits the mound in the same inning he has to change the pitcher.

[Barkis_is_Willin]

@pianodave

Hi SD, here’s my batch of questions for the day.

1. What does a first-baseman talk about to a player on first base? Or any fielder to an opposing baserunner. Is it exchanging pleasantries, or is there some friendly competition involved? Knowing how the exchange of a few choice words can lead to bench-clearing brawls, is there some rule of etiquette regarding what can be talked about? Do players bring either their longstanding enmity or friendship into the actual game itself…? In other words, are there instances in which players’ relationships lead to a change in how they pitch, field, or hit? You know, trying to hit someone you don’t like, etc.

That’s like asking what 2 people in a park are talking about. It could be anything and it varies by each player’s personality.

2. How do baseball players view each other financially? According to Baseball-reference, the minimum salary for a player is $300,000. Is there any competition or camaraderie that comes from knowing that the next player over is making a lot of money as well, possibly more than you are?

Well, I know Brandon Phillips was pretty outspoken about being paid much less than his teammate Joey Votto. But typically baseball players are less vocal about their money than NFL players, for example, with all their holdouts and stuff.
I’m sure they’re like you and me, though, except they know their coworkers’ salaries.

3. How do players react being traded from a winning team to a losing team? Even if the money is good, doesn’t it cause resentment that the whole year might be wasted if you know you don’t have a shot? Yes you’re making more money, but you’re going to be playing another 80 games with a crap team that’s in the cellar. All that work and you know you’re not going to the playoffs.

Unless the player was in a miserable situation, they generally don’t like to be moved to losing teams. Usually when midseason trades happen, the bad teams are giving up their good players for young prospects who are probably not even in MLB.

4. Are players banned from swearing in the dugout? I ask this because whenever the TV station goes to the dugout congratulating a batter for a home run, you never hear “Fuck yeah” or “Nice fucking job” or equivalent.

Swearing like you describe is not banned.

5. Similarly, how do other players react to pitchers coming in and slamming bats down in frustration or kicking chairs and benches? You would think such a display is tantamount to a tantrum, and embarrassing, but do other players console the upset player?

No, they typically leave that guy alone.

6. Finally, can a manager ever come out just to talk to a pitcher or is it always taking the ball from him and inserting a new one? Maybe in a tough spot the pitcher would feel more comfortable hearing from his manager and not his pitching coach.

Yes, the rule is that the 2nd visit to the mound by any coach must result in a pitching change. It doesn’t matter what coach goes out there. You will in some cases see the manager go out to discuss something more defensive strategy related than pitching specific.

[Freddy_the_Pig]

@pianodave

6. Finally, can a manager ever come out just to talk to a pitcher or is it always taking the ball from him and inserting a new one? Maybe in a tough spot the pitcher would feel more comfortable hearing from his manager and not his pitching coach.

For visits that do not involve the removal of the pitcher:

If the topic is anything concerning mechanics, the manager will almost invariably prefer that the pitching coach conduct the visit. That’s the pitching coach’s job. Both pitchers and coaches prefer a single point of contact, and you don’t want a guy getting conflicting advice from different sources.

If the topic is strategy-related, as in “should we pitch around this guy” or “do you feel strong enough to get one more out?”, the manager will sometimes make the visit. Some managers will do this more often than others.

[Jas09]

@Barkis_is_Willin

But typically baseball players are less vocal about their money than NFL players, for example, with all their holdouts and stuff.

I think a lot of that difference is due to NFL contracts not being guaranteed to the same extent MLB contracts are. I’d be much more likely to hold out for more money knowing it’s quite likely my only chance to make big money and if I get hurt I will get unceremoniously cut and lose most of my compensation. MLB players just aren’t under the same type of pressure.

Also the lack of a salary cap and things like “franchise tags” makes relations between teams and players a lot more amicable in general in MLB, I think.

[Saint_Cad]

@pianodave

Hi SD, here’s my batch of questions for the day.

1. What does a first-baseman talk about to a player on first base? Or any fielder to an opposing baserunner. Is it exchanging pleasantries, or is there some friendly competition involved? Knowing how the exchange of a few choice words can lead to bench-clearing brawls, is there some rule of etiquette regarding what can be talked about? Do players bring either their longstanding enmity or friendship into the actual game itself…? In other words, are there instances in which players’ relationships lead to a change in how they pitch, field, or hit? You know, trying to hit someone you don’t like, etc.

They shouldn’t be talking about anything.
Rule 4.06

[Barkis_is_Willin]

@Jas09

I think a lot of that difference is due to NFL contracts not being guaranteed to the same extent MLB contracts are. I’d be much more likely to hold out for more money knowing it’s quite likely my only chance to make big money and if I get hurt I will get unceremoniously cut and lose most of my compensation. MLB players just aren’t under the same type of pressure.

Also the lack of a salary cap and things like “franchise tags” makes relations between teams and players a lot more amicable in general in MLB, I think.

Oh, absolutely. NFL players have a shorter career span, non-guaranteed contracts and a weaker union. All of that leads to players being more public about handling their own business.

[Munch]

@Saint_Cad

They shouldn’t be talking about anything.
Rule 4.06

That doesn’t address idle chit-chat - it’s meant to prevent players from inciting other players, or to distract them (specifically, preventing a fielder from distracting a baserunner). If it’s mutual, it’s hardly unsportsmanlike.

[TriPolar]

@pianodave

1. What does a first-baseman talk about to a player on first base? Or any fielder to an opposing baserunner. Is it exchanging pleasantries, or is there some friendly competition involved? Knowing how the exchange of a few choice words can lead to bench-clearing brawls, is there some rule of etiquette regarding what can be talked about? Do players bring either their longstanding enmity or friendship into the actual game itself…? In other words, are there instances in which players’ relationships lead to a change in how they pitch, field, or hit? You know, trying to hit someone you don’t like, etc.

The first baseman will do his best to distract the runner on base, or even mislead him about the play. MLB players get there because they don’t fall for stuff like that easily, but it still works once in a while.

[Saint_Cad]

@Munch

That doesn’t address idle chit-chat - it’s meant to prevent players from inciting other players, or to distract them (specifically, preventing a fielder from distracting a baserunner). If it’s mutual, it’s hardly unsportsmanlike.

That’s not what it says. It says “fraternize”. Doesn’t idle chit-chat fall under the definition of “fraternize”. Second, it does not say do not fraternize if you are active in the game or even while the game is being played. It says while in uniform. Two opposing players chatting during warm-ups would violate Rule 4.06.

[Saint_Cad]

Too late to edit.
In previous years, the “no-fraternization” rule was 3.09. Google ‘MLB “no fraternization” rule’ and see quotes like

Whatever, as the Tribune’s Paul Sullivan reported, the White Sox last week in Cleveland saw a bulletin-board item from baseball’s new bigfoot of discipline, Bob Watson, who replaced Frank Robinson, who replaced the previous manager in Montreal, Jeff Torborg, who replaced the previous manager in Florida, where part of the Expos moved this year before the rest of the Expos move elsewhere next year. Watson’s memorandum dealt with Rule 3:09 stating that players in uniform are not supposed to chat it up with opponents, primarily when our heroes should be preparing for a game.

Or read about it being enforced during the 50’s during pre-game.

But ultimately, I’ll take Joe Torres view on what 4.06 means

One of Joe Torre’s first goals when he became Major League Baseball’s vice president of baseball operations was to reduce the amount of fraternization between opponents on the field when the gates were opened and fans were in the seats.

Prior to Game 2, in full view of the crowd at a packed Busch Stadium, the Rangers’ Nelson Cruz and the Cardinals’ Albert Pujols conversed in short center field as a pregame ceremony was about to start.

Torre said he didn’t see it, but starting next year there will be a price to pay if players are caught chatting with each other after the home team takes batting practice.

“It sends the wrong message,” Torre said.

So what can be done?

“We are going to find out,” said Torre, who explained this year served as a warning.

[madmonk28]

For question 1, here is an article from a couple years ago:

It depends: If we’re close friends, usually it’s about hunting, families or something,” said Nationals’ Adam LaRoche, who as a first baseman gets the most visitors and is an avid hunter. “The majority of the time, what’s going on with their team. The pulse of the team, the pitcher they’re facing, what he just saw, umpires.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/nationals-journal/post/what-are-players-talking-about-on-the-base-paths/2012/08/07/ab63fdd0-dfeb-11e1-a19c-fcfa365396c8_blog.html

[madmonk28]

Missed the edit, but here’s another article on the topic:

There are small courtesies. If a player gets a hit or works a pitcher for a walk, it’s within understood etiquette to compliment him. It’s also okay to tell the opponent how clean the hit was or if it was a borderline error. But if the hit put the opposing team up or it’s a close game, players don’t often talk. They also do not share batting tips.
At the heart of the practice is a basic question of sportsmanship: Doesn’t it look a little strange to see opponents yukking it up on the bases during the games?

“I think in people’s minds that means you’re not focused on the game, or not really wanting to beat this team,” LaRoche said. “If you play every day that couldn’t be further from the truth. You can separate the two. When I’m facing Tim Hudson, and he gets on first, we’re going to be joking around together. He’s a friend of mine. That doesn’t mean that when I come to the plate the next at-bat, that he’s going to take it easy on me or I’m not going to be serious. We know when it’s time that we got a job to do. . . .

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/nationals/nationals-other-players-find-something-to-talk-about-on-the-base-paths/2012/08/23/941b0db4-ed45-11e1-9ddc-340d5efb1e9c_story.html

[BobLibDem]

Normally you only get one free visit to the mound per pitcher per inning, but if you bring the trainer and tell the umpire that you’re checking on the pitcher’s physical condition, that visit doesn’t count.

First basemen seem to be naturally chatty. I’ve always thought it was just things like “hey, good job catching up to that fastball” type of thing.

[Barkis_is_Willin]

The fraternization rule is stupid and I don’t know what message is being sent that Joe Torre disagrees with so much. It also prohibits players in uniform from mingling with spectators before, during or after the game, which means no pregame autographs or pictures. MLB actually considered eliminating the rule after Torre’s comments.

[DCnDC]

@pianodave

3. How do players react being traded from a winning team to a losing team? Even if the money is good, doesn’t it cause resentment that the whole year might be wasted if you know you don’t have a shot? Yes you’re making more money, but you’re going to be playing another 80 games with a crap team that’s in the cellar. All that work and you know you’re not going to the playoffs.

Players will be much more concerned and upset with getting sent down to the minor leagues. As long as they’re still in “The Show,” I can’t imagine the great majority of them really care that much who they play for.

[madmonk28]

@DCnDC

Players will be much more concerned and upset with getting sent down to the minor leagues. As long as they’re still in “The Show,” I can’t imagine the great majority of them really care that much who they play for.

Wilmer Flores disagrees.

Mets’ Wilmer Flores weeps on field amid trade rumors – that appear false | CNN

[RickJay]

@pianodave

1. What does a first-baseman talk about to a player on first base?

It really depends entirely on the people involved. There is no single answer to this and probably not a hundred answers.

2. How do baseball players view each other financially? According to Baseball-reference, the minimum salary for a player is $300,000. Is there any competition or camaraderie that comes from knowing that the next player over is making a lot of money as well, possibly more than you are?

It’s much higher than that now, I believe $500,000.

From what I have read and known from people in the know, players are certainly very conscious of what they’re making relative to one another but don’t tend to get personal with each other about it. If a player feels underpaid, their frustration or ambition is directed towards the teams from which he wants to get more money.

3. How do players react being traded from a winning team to a losing team? Even if the money is good, doesn’t it cause resentment that the whole year might be wasted if you know you don’t have a shot?

Again, it depends on the person.

MLB players care about winning but probably not always as much as the fans do, which isn’t necessarily a bad thing; they have to perform day in and day out, even if the team is 52-77 and a mile out of first place, to keep their jobs, and anyway they tend to be competitive by nature; you may be 52-77 but my Christ you wanna win TODAY.

Players who are breaking in or lack guarantee contracts are really mostly concerned about playing well enough to get a contract. Being traded to a losing team sucks if you’re Jose Reyes, who makes $22,000,000 a year and really has little to play for except pride and a World Series ring. But for another player it may mean they get to play full time instead of riding the bench, which means a chance at big money. It may mean playing in a more or less desirable city. Being traded sucks far more if you have an established home and family in a city than if you do not, and hell, maybe you’re traded to your home city. And of course this year’s loser could be next year’s champion.

The thing about baseball is you get a LOT of practice losing. For almost all players the season ends in defeat; of all MLB’s players, 94% will be watching the World Series on TV this fall, and half of the ones that aren’t will lose the World Series. If you can’t handle losing you won’t be a baseball player for long.

4. Are players banned from swearing in the dugout?

No.

5. Similarly, how do other players react to pitchers coming in and slamming bats down in frustration or kicking chairs and benches? You would think such a display is tantamount to a tantrum, and embarrassing, but do other players console the upset player?

You generally should stay away from a player in the initial parts of a temper tantrum.

6. Finally, can a manager ever come out just to talk to a pitcher or is it always taking the ball from him and inserting a new one? Maybe in a tough spot the pitcher would feel more comfortable hearing from his manager and not his pitching coach.

Just to clarify the rule, because Pixel and Barkis kind of said different things; you get one free visit per pitcher for inning, not just one free visit in the whole inning.

[Clawdio]

Something I’ve always wondered: they make a big show of pitchers getting ready in the bullpen, what would the penalty be if the fielding team just stalled until the relief pitcher was ready? Could the umpire deny/postpone the substitution?

[Telemark]

@Clawdio

Something I’ve always wondered: they make a big show of pitchers getting ready in the bullpen, what would the penalty be if the fielding team just stalled until the relief pitcher was ready? Could the umpire deny/postpone the substitution?

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/pitcher_8.jsp

When the bases are unoccupied, the pitcher shall deliver the ball to the batter within 12 seconds after he receives the ball. Each time the pitcher delays the game by violating this rule, the umpire shall call “Ball.” The 12-second timing starts when the pitcher is in possession of the ball and the batter is in the box, alert to the pitcher. The timing stops when the pitcher releases the ball.

If the pitcher doesn’t pitch the ball, he’ll walk the batter. Once there’s a base runner it becomes a balk.