Leavy should be done officiating playoff games. That was one of the more dismal Zebra games I’ve seen. I am just happy the Giants were able to beat Green Bay and the Zebras.
After checking the tape, I think this one was a good call based on the fact that the rules are different for the goal line.
Defender grabs Ware’s feet about 2 yards shy of the line, Ware falls forward extending the ball beyond the line to gain. The first part of his body to touch the ground was his knee, a yard and half behind the line. When that knee first touched, the ball was already extended past the first down line, meaning it would have been a clear touchdown in a goal line situation. But because it wasn’t the goal line, the spot was (accurately) placed where the knee came down, not where the ball was when the knee came down.
Do I have that rule right? If so, looks like it was a good call to me.
No. You have it wrong. The spot is ALWAYS where the ball is when the knee (read: non-foot) goes down. Officials screw this up multiple times a game, but that’s the rule. You’d be amazed how often officials spot the ball where the player sets it down as opposed to where he was actually down if you paid close attention.
You are indeed correct.
Rule 7, Section 3, Article 3 (pdf) of the official rulebook:
Which makes that another terrible call, one that immediately forced a punt instead of the first down it should have been. Bad job, there.
This has always seemed to me to be an exceedingly difficult task on plays at the line of scrimmage - to pinpoint a spot from nearly 60 feet away, and the view is likely to be obscured by a mash up of massive men. As apparently the famed leg puller garygnu might have some experience with this, perhaps he might be able to shed some light on this.
Ah, yes. Spotting the ball. That is currently the most important task for me as an official on the sideline. It is both very easy and exceedingly difficult.
In the open field with ordinary sightlines, the marks on the field provide reliable reference points to spot a ball. Easy, as long as you’re in position.
In the middle of a scrum, like on a third-and-short, it can be anything from a educated guess to a hope-and-pray. Generally, though, the ball is easy to spot; it’s the knees that are often obscured. “Crashing in,” running in from the sidelines where you start a play, makes it easier.
I see questionable spots fairly often, but I can’t get too upset about it.
In the NFL, the ball spot is reviewable. Multiple angles can be synched to see where the ball is when the runner is down. I would expect the head linesman and line judge would love to be able to use those angles to get a good spot, if better technology was available.
Don’t they chip soccer balls? There has got to be a way to hide a very miniature transmitter in a football.
Speaking of refs, I thought some helmet-to-helmet slipped by in the 49ers game, but maybe the rules are technical in a way I don’t understand. Both teams seemed to do it so the outcome probably didn’t change, but I don’t like it if it can be helped.
Wah wah wah taking the human element out of the game!
It’ll happen. People rail against the idea, but considering A) how ridiculously simple it would be to put a chip near each tip of the ball and sensor the field, and B) how hair-rippingly wrong the officials get it time and time again, it’s an inevitability.
And don’t give me the “But but but they can’t do that for every college and high school game!” line of crap. This is supposed to be at a professional level – get the damn calls right.
No chips in soccer balls…yet. I hope they do it soon, though, and obviously with football, too. I can understand it in soccer a bit more because, using England as an example, it’s possible for top clubs to play lower league clubs in the FA Cup, and it wouldn’t necessarily be reasonable to expect a team running on a shoestring budget to have money for all the equipment necessary. But in the NFL, it’s teams worth billions or hundreds of millions of dollars playing other teams worth billions or hundreds of millions of dollars. Most of the stadiums are set-up with their NFL team as THE client. The technology surely exists, and why it hasn’t been implemented for at least preseason games is a mystery to me.
A sensor still wouldn’t tell you when the player was down. I don’t think it would be that much help. The only way I could see it working is if you could sync a “ghost” image of the ball with video replay quickly and accurately.
And, given the money in top-level college football, they could do it there too.
Well what else would they need to do? Put the players in full sensor suits to determine the first part of the body to go down? At least it would help them not call bogus roughing the passer calls I guess but I don’t see how just at least 2 sensors in the ball help enough to bother.
While I think it was a fumble the fact is that the refs could not overturn the call because they could not see the whole leg. But that late hit on Rodgers call was ridiculous and let the Pack get 7 points. Some folks are saying how devastating this loss is for the Packers, I dunno, I certainly don’t think they go 15-1 next year, but if Nick Collins comes back and they can somehow get their pass rush back then they should be fine, but man they looked so bad on Sunday.
Thank you, Vernon Davis (or, more likely, his PR staff) for pretty much locking up a Big Blue victory. (warning: sound on page)
Win or lose, how could you not want to hang out with Vernon? I’d ask him to sing.
The stories leading up to the Giants-49ers game are about the suddenly surging Alex Smith vs Eli Manning, or the 49ers defense and the Giants pass rush.
The stars of this game are going to be Frank Gore, Patrick Willis, and Candlestick Park.
Frank Gore: Bill Walsh Field is going to be soggy, and the wind and rain will make for Frank’s playground. Now that defenses have to account for Smith, I foresee off-tackles and counter-whams and every other middle run you want getting called, and Gore finishes with 120+ a TD or two, with some good receiving numbers.
Patrick Willis: Without a scary tight end to cover, and the weather conspiring against Eli, Patrick can focus on dueling with Navorro Bowman for the tackle lead. If the Giants abandon the running game as most 49er opponents do, Willis could get for a sack or two, maybe even a pick off a tipped ball.
Candlestick Park: Like an ex-lover we still have feelings for, Candlestick is singing her siren’s song this weekend, with the legendary swirling wind her voice, the California rain her orchestra, and the crack of shoulder pads her rhythm section. Reminding us of the glory days, trying to hide her age and general unpleasantness.
Yes, my friends, the first weather pattern of the season is finally showing up, right in time for this game. There’s been a lighter system wetting the field down already, another is arriving Sunday afternoon. Rain drops will be on the camera lenses, sleeves will be on Ed Hochuli’s arms, and the football will stay on the ground. It’s going to be the type of game the 2011 49ers were built to win. The bewildering Harbaugh/Roman running game is going up against a D-line meant to rush the passer, and a questionable linebacking behind them. And nobody runs on our defense. I foresee both passes and kicks getting toyed with, receivers’ feet getting squeezed by the turf, and Jim Harbaugh’s “fortress” helping the 49ers to a dramatic, slugfest victory.
Just a reality check, Eli is a pretty good, you might even say exceptional bad weather QB. Whether raining or -20º.
The Giants have a few potential stars of their own so why don’t we wait and see.
But we’re football fans. It’s ever so much more fun to endlessly speculate, argue, and predict the results of games in advance.
I’d like to see another Patriots/Giants Superbowl, but the 49ers have really proven they can win some big games.
If this was played in Jersey, maybe I’d give it to the Giants but dem’s the breaks.
I really and truly think its going to be another Patriots/Giants Superbowl. And it SHOULD be. Nobody wants to see two dominant defenses with boring offenses playing in the Big Game.
ETA: Two boring offenses with less than elite level QB play, at that.
I do.