Confiscation. Duh. 
See, first they take a step toward confiscating the gun by forcing registration, then before you can lock and load {swipe!} all yer guns’re gone!
Nobody says you have to read 'em, hoss. Won’t bother me none if you don’t.
Looks like the SOTU threat is being hijacked into another gun nut thread- as if there weren’t enough of those floating around already. Sigh.
I watched the Whitehouse dot gov enhanced version of the SOTU. Most of the video was just Obama with Biden and Boehner from the nose down also in the view. My least favorite part of the SOTU was watching Boehner blow his nose and inspect his handkerchief briefly before folding it and putting it away. Ick.
Parts I liked were parts that I hadn’t hear a lot of talk about before- raising the minimum wage to $9.00, universal early childhood education, the new website to compare colleges and there was something about federal dollars to universities- perhaps limiting fed dollars to universities that don’t perform somehow- that I missed.
OK- from the transcript: " Tonight, I ask Congress to change the Higher Education Act, so that affordability and value are included in determining which colleges receive certain types of federal aid. And tomorrow, my Administration will release a new “College Scorecard” that parents and students can use to compare schools based on a simple criteria: where you can get the most bang for your educational buck. "
Regarding registration: It’s not possible to confiscate the millions of guns if you don’t know where they are and who owns what. Thus preventing registration is a logical and effective method to prevent confiscation. In countries that did go forward with confiscation registration preceded it.
But you guys knew that.
So from my posts you two have somehow inferred from my hypothetical about a family hunting camp include:
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It’s a “gun camp”, not a hunting camp. This is truly funny.
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The guns at the camp are “lying around” and not secured, despite me saying nothing about this having nothing at all to do with my point.
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We are all somehow irresponsible gun owners despite my posts saying nothing that would indicate this whatsoever.
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That we’re too cheap/lazy to pay a $15 fee.
It’s amazing that you made this all up based on absolutely nothing! I mean why don’t you just go ahead and accuse everyone who’s ever been to the hunting camp of littering and regicide.
Was there anything else that’s worth talking about?
Ah. I see.
As Obama pointed out in the speech, many states have already raised theirs. Why not let states decide this? Some states might have different needs than others. Why does California have to have the same minimum wage as North Dakota?
American kids are the barely able to read as it is. Let’s please spare them another year of the failing public education system. You want to fix education? Get people vouchers so they can leave failing schools and go to better ones. Keep early childhood education private so that it continues to be good. As it is kids have a huge boredom problem when they go to kindergarten after being in private preschool where they actually learn things.
Because clearly this is something that doesn’t exist already and the government needs to stick it’s nose in.
Your case would be stronger if you can show us that confiscation always followed registration. Can you?
It doesn’t matter.
Confiscation can’t be done without registration.
I admit registration is possible without resulting in confiscation, but to quote Remo, the Chicago Mob boss in the movie Casino: “Why take a chance?”
Since there are many people who do want to take the guns away and never cease to incrementally move in that direction I will oppose anything that will make it easier for them. Sure, many people might support registration for reasons other than confiscation. But it will undoubtedly make confiscation easier and would begin to be used as an argument for confiscation the day after registration is completed. I won’t help them take my rights away, even if it was a good idea, which it isn’t.
Logically, this is like a banana peel soaked in oil at the head of a Slip n Slide.
I think we know all about the slippery-slope fallacy, yes.
It doesn’t have to. California could easily raise their minimum wage higher than North Dakota.
CA has a higher cost of living, I’m sure. That $9/hour Obama was talking about should be only a national floor.
And you can’t piss on the electric fence without taking a piss, either. So maybe you should never take a piss. And you can’t trip and fall in front of a subway train if you never go near the subway, so never go near the subway. And you’ll never fall off a third-floor balcony and break your neck if you never go out on a third-floor balcony. Etcetera.
:sigh:
You really need this explained to you?
I’m not making a logical argument that registration must logically lead to confiscation. In fact I explicitly stated that it doesn’t necessarily lead to it.
If I were arguing that registration making confiscation easier meant it must lead to confiscation that would be a slippery slope logical fallacy.
However, I’m not doing that. I’m saying that since it is a needed first step, I’m opposed to it simply because it ensures that the second step isn’t possible.
It’s like saying “You are with me or against me.” Saying this might be an example of the excluded middle logical fallacy if you mean that being against me is the only possible alternative of being with me. However, one could also use this as a simple statement of “If you don’t support me on this I will oppose you” and take it at that.
Just because something resembles an example of a logical fallacy you read on Wikipedia once doesn’t automatically make it one unless someone is actually using it in the right context and trying to prove a logical point by stating it.
They don’t have to. As BG just pointed out, the Federal minimum wage is a national floor, and states are free to enact higher minimum wages.
How about if you spare us your gibberish about “the failing public education system.”
I started elementary school in 1960 (back in the “good old days” before liberals and integration and whatnot supposedly ruined everything) in a good suburban school and they assumed we knew essentially nothing going into first grade, since there was no public kindergarten at that point. They promoted me to second grade because I could already read and count.
My son started kindergarten this past fall. He is learning to read and write, can already count well past 100, and is starting to get a grip on addition and subtraction. He probably won’t be as good a reader entering first grade as I was, but he’ll have a basic grounding in it. And nobody will even think about whether he should skip a grade.
This is just to say that (a) public education isn’t getting worse over time, and (b) early education, oddly enough, helps kids learn things earlier.
I think Atrios hit the nail on the head this morning when he said:
Paraphrasing from Chris Rock, you know what that means when someone pays you minimum wage? It means "Hey if I could pay you less, I would, but it’s against the law.”
Fact is, the minimum wage hasn’t kept up with inflation and is worth less now than ever before. Even the minimum wage in the 60’s was worth around $10 per hour in today’s dollars. I agree that it’s mostly for the states to decide where to set their minimum wage, but there definitely should be a federal “floor” and $9 per hour is plenty reasonable. Tying it to the cost of living makes sense and has had bi-partisan support (as Obama said, it’s one of the few things he and Romney agreed on).
So if you don’t want to get hit by a car, you should never cross the street. Hell, stay off the sidewalk, because occasionally a car will find its way there, too.
Which Romney was that? 