I recently spent some time in Malaysia, mostly Kuala Lumpur (“KL” to the world traveler), but also Senai, Melacca, and neighboring Singapore. During my time there, I realized that both nations are very socially conservative. HBO is edited for content, the sex trade exists but is kept somewhat on the down low (which is in stark contrast to their neighbors such as Thailand, Indonesia, and even China), a large percentage of the women adhere to the wardrobe restrictions dictated by their religion, and socially liberal ideas are rare or non-existent. But rather than the Christian based social conservatism we see here, theirs is based on Islam. The surprising thing to me was that Islamic conservatism and Christian conservatism is very much the same thing. The high emphasis on family values, the adherence to religious doctrine, resistance to socially liberal ideas such as gay rights, and the overall idea that those who know what’s best for us must rise and save us from ourselves. The thought processes are nearly identical.
Since my time there and this paradigm shift that I experienced I’ve seen on TV a few Muslim clerics rattling their sabers and quoting their scriptures and condemning the infidels of the world…and something occurred to me. Those guys are cut from the same cloth as people like Rush Limbaugh, Rumsfeld, Ann Coulter and countless other Western conservative icons. They’re the same people. Our guys wear suits; their guys were robes and whatever that headwear is called (my apologies for my ignorance of Middle Eastern clothing), our guys quote the Bible, and their guys quote the Koran. Also, it seems to me to be not so out of the question that if given the right set of circumstances, terrorism, jihad, suicide bombing, and all the bad stuff we see from Islamic extremists, could easily be superimposed with Christian extremism.
Now perhaps being that I lean towards the left, I’m being biased against conservatives, but I don’t think so. Conservatism might look different on the outside, but I think the foundations of the conservative stance is essentially the same. If asked to describe an ideal world, I think the Christian vision and the Muslim vision would be nearly identical other than the religious verbiage and a handful of cultural or regional differences.
Does anyone else see it this way too?
Yes. I had noticed that before. They all just want to tell us how to live our lives. And they’re going to use whichever religious document happens to be handy to beat us into submission.
Apart from Singapore being Muslim/Islamist, of course…
In any case, conservativism can also manifest in other ways, such as Plutocracy, Fascism, Aristocracy, Monarchy, etc. In addition, many other very conservative countries lack terrorists, including China, Singapore, Korea, Japan, Germany.
Correlation <> causation, and in this case it’s not even very good correlation.
Also, U.S. Democrats, socialists, Marxists and Stalinists. All pretty much the same.
Sorry, didn’t mean to imply that Singapore’s brand of conservatism was the same as Malaysia.
You lean to the left? It would suprise me if you could stand without a crutch to prop you up.
Comparing al-Zarqawi to Coulter? It’s one thing to fire up the base, it’s another to get followers to literally “fire up the base.”
And it seems that, in the US at least, it’s the liberal/progressives that seem to know what’s best for us. The whole idea of political corectness is to tell you what you should and shouldn’t do based on what the elites see as best for us all.
Other than that, I’ll agree that any religion taken rationally will tend to be conservative, especially in matters of family, and could all be interchanged with no noticable affect of society. The big difference being in the beliefs of spirituality of any given faith.
I view Christians shooting abortion doctors with the same contempt as Muslims blowing up a bus full of Isreali children. But I try not to lump all Muslims together. Though it’s difficult sometimes when the Imams themselves are telling followers to kill anyone they see as a threat to their power.
Just my opinion of course, YMMV.
Sometimes when I walk to a certain building on campus I pass this truck with the bumper sticker “Gods Word: America’s Answer” and the same thought pops into my mind:“Like the Taliban?”
I understand where the OP is coming from, not in just that hardcore muslim and christian (any ideology for that matter) fundmentalist are alike, but that they don’t REALIZE how alike they are.
I use to visit another board that had a lot of conservatives (didn’t know it at the time as I was invited by a friend) and these people were morons. I’m not lumping all christians together because I’m sure most consider their religion as one of peace (as does most muslims probably), but these people were just unbelievable.
They were like a satire or parady of the “conservative”. They were parrots screaming “God bless America, God bless America” in every single post. They would put up article after article of religious proproganda and how Bush could do no wrong and how much christians were being oppress in America. I remember one posted an article about how the government should “treat” homosexuals since they have a chemical inbalance in their brains. Sarcastically I replied “Why don’t we just kill them all instead?” The reply; “You’re the one who said it! LOL” I left the board soon after that.
It just bothered me that these people couldn’t see that a theocracy America would be the same as an islamic country. NO religion is immune to corruption no matter how great you think it is.
You know, I met some black people in DC, and some others in Philadelphia, and still some others in LA. They all had similar tastes in music and dress. They all had similar language mannerisms. Guess they’re all the same.
I’m with you, dear.
On a hijack: I noticed in another thread you called your SO Taxi Driver. I thought that was the best “opposite” version of a Doper’s name I’ve ever heard. Loved it.
I feel that I have nothing to add to the point that Bill H. just made.
This seems as good a place as any to ask this without making a new thread - I know ‘GOP’ refers to the Republican party, but what does it stand for?
Grand. Old Party.
That’s it.
Urg. I left out period: Grand. Old. Party.
Urg. I left out an “a”
I’m going home now.
And a second period.