Just out of curiosityand in full acknowledgement that this point may have been raised already, isn’t the “world” of World of Warcaft designed to be a medieval-ish fantasy realm, rife with violence and warfare? Even in modern times, a sufficiently large gathering requires sentries and security of some sort. Could the funeral attendees have posted a few people on the perimeter to raise an alarm if intruders stormed in? Would it have made any difference? I too am a little confused by the apparent slow reactions of the attendees while the attack was underway.
Well, contrary to popular belief, not all nerds are smart. In fact, most can be distracted rather easily with shiny objects.
No, I… doesn’t!
As mentioned upthread, there’s little more ‘harm’ than a bit of time wasted running back to retrieve your corpse, or a small damage penalty and some resurrection sickness if you decide to rez at the graveyard.
Also
You’re right on all counts there. They could have posted sentries, who could have /gchat or /yelled for everyone as soon as the alliance turned up. But there you go.
Veteran? I still play the damn thing…
So what exactly is your point? No one here is supporting the actions of the people who crashed the funeral. It doesn’t make it okay just because they did it in a PvP zone. But the people holding the funeral were bloody stupid to announce it to a bunch of tools who are not known for their social graces. Honestly, what did they expect?
That argument makes no sense at all. If they were holding the service somewhere else they wouldn’t be logged onto the PVP server and would be unavailable for the other paying customers to fight anyway.
But it wasn’t “wherever and whenever” they felt like it. It was in the player’s favourite place. Attacking it is inappropriate not because you’re barging in on their entitlement party, but because the players are MOURNING.
Nobody? Correct me if I’m wrong, but FinnAgain seems to be.
You just don’t get it do you? The whole premise of a PvP server in WoW is that your character tries to KILL other peoples character. The fact that they were holding a fake funeral in a contested zone after announcing it online only makes it easier for me to hold them in contempt.
So it was the dead guys favorite area. Big fucking deal. It isn’t like it’s even a real area. At least it isn’t unless there’s someplace where elves riding wolves happens in the real world.
So Serenity Now were sort of assholes. I don’t even want to go that far as they did absolutely nothing wrong within the context of the game world. Get over it. Unless, of course, your life is now ruined because a bunch of internet nerds did something that gets sand in your crack.
FinnAgain never supported their actions; he simply pointed out that what they did was not as shocking and unexpected as some seem to think. Why are people so fucking surprised that obnoxious teenagers without a life are acting like obnoxious teenagers without a life?
Again, I don’t see your point. Are you saying that the SN guild should be officially reprimanded for their actions? Or that the mourners were perfectly justified in thinking they could hold a funeral in peace in a PvP zone after announcing it to the whole world?
HazelNutCoffee, Xploder: Spot on. Or
Or, as I said way back on page two:
They acted within the spirit of the game, within the rules of the PvP server, and within character for their roleplaying personas. The Horde guild, on the other hand, tried to wedge their meatspace drama into a video game, with other players being non-consenting. And the more I think about it, the more I think that the people who tried to stop the normal course of a game for selfish reasons are the ones who should’ve done something differently.
Wow… we’re now through the looking glass. It makes no sense to you, it seems, because your entire argument is now a fallacy of circular reasoning.
You’ve also stumbled across the point. Yes, if they weren’t logged into a PvP server (whose function is for Players to fight Vs Players), then they physically could not have been messed with in that manner. The paying customers would, then, have been able to play with people actually intersted in playing the game, rather than bringing real life into the game.
Even if they weren’t on that server, other players would’ve been able to explore and fight and such, even with a reduced number of players on the server, rather than having an entire area “roped off” for personal use and non-game issues.
And, as the stiatuion stands, if you (pl) want to satisfy your own private urge to mourn, you need a private place. I can’t stand in the middle of Manhattan at rush hour and demand that everybody be quiet so that I can have my own moment of silence and contemplation. If you want private time, seek a private venue. And if you don’t want people playing a game around you while you’re mourning, make sure that there aren’t people around you
The two aren’t mutually exclusive.
Again, not mutually exclusive. SN were jerks, but the Horde guild were spoiled brats.
People laid down a gauntlet, requesting/demanding (arrogantly, IMO), that the game not be played as it was intended. Rather than hold the memorial on private grounds, like AIM or a private webpage, they decided that their selfish desires trumped those of the community.
Their announcing it to the entire community, even their enemies, is borderline trolling in my view.
And as I’ve said before, I view the situation as nuanced. Yes, SN were jerks. But the Horde guild were selfish, arrogant trolls.
Also, on a side note, the paintball analogy falls apart because the WoW game is always in session… if they wanted to hold it on a WoW server, they could’ve gone to a PvE server. If they wanted to have it moderated, they should’ve simply taken a screen cap and posted their thoughts on a memorial page. Their desires don’t trump the community’s.
If you absolutely have to hold a memorial service on a paintball court, rent out the court and make it private. If you insist on mourning in public, expect the public to be involved.
FinnAgain - in that case I agree with you more than I thought I did.
- They were kind of setting themselves up.
- There were no rules against the other guild attacking them and no action should be taken.
- Holding a short ceremony in a small area of a large map on one server… well I guess that is a little disruptive to the game. If more people did it it would probably be a problem.
However, I don’t agree with you describing the funeral as “fake”. If these people interacted with each other through the game, and only knew each other through the game, then a funeral in the game is about as real as it’s going to get. If some people wanted to have a fight where their funeral was, while it was being held, then I guess they wouldn’t be able to. But in my experience in PVP people just wandered around fighting whoever they came across, and if one area was occupied, be it by a funeral or some other people fighting, they just wandered in another direction. I remember in some game some people held an in-game protest by blocking a bridge with their characters. That would have been a pain in the ass for anyone who wanted to cross the bridge, but to me that’s just part of the fun of the game. I wouldn’t have minded a protest or a funeral, personally. If people had stumbled across the group of unarmed characters standing in a line without knowing what they were there for they’d probably attack them. If they knew it was a funeral, though, they probably wouldn’t. I think that was the purpose of the forum post. I don’t find it unexpected that they were attacked but I wouldn’t have been expecting it either. Though I’m also puzzled as to why they didn’t have sentries of some sort.
Damn, this thing still going? This is just a total non-event. Idiot Horde guild wants to mourn, announces fact, jerk Alliance guild thinks it’ll be fun to crash, hilarity ensues, then is over.
Big deal, the dead player liked farming there. There are chapels in all major cities and most smaller towns.
Wrong, the game is designed to have players fighting players. PvE servers are just for people who like “Easy Mode”.
What MMORPG have you been playing, it obviously isn’t WoW.
Can’t happen. If a bridge is chock full o’people, you’ll just walk straight through them.
As a PvP veteran, I would have expected it.
3 or 4 sentries, or however many there could be… would be quickly overwhelmed and killed. If one side is seriously outnumbered or outleveled, it’s gonna get wiped out.
Tell me about it. I’ve been quietly grinding up in the Arathi Highlands, only to be ganked by a bunch of Horde on their way north to UC. I come back with some friends and kick their asses, only to find a bunch of 60s on their way down have then decided to wade in and join the fun. That ended up going on for a good few hours, back and forth… Nobody turned away from that fight that I saw.
Sentries are your first line of warning, not defense. How much of a surprise attack is possible in game “daylight”? Is there any chance of sounding the alarm and retreating to a more defensible position, backed up by your now-aware buddies?
It’s irrelrvant what the players are doing. Nobody attacked the players - they were sitting at home in front of their computers, Doritos at hand, safe and sound. What matters is what the CHARACTERS are doing. On a PvP server, they’re perpetually at risk. It’s wholly in character for Alliance characters to attack Horde characters.
Honestly, it’s akin to saying it was mean of that Dodgers player to hit a home run off that Cardinals pitcher because the pitcher was distracted and sad that his goldfish died the previous evening. By logging on to a PvP server and leaving a safe zone you are giving every opposing player permission to attack and kill your character if they think they can do it.
I have a basic question: Since I could barely tell what was going on once the fighting started, was the mourning clan not fighting back or something. I mean it seemed like there were plenty of them to make it a fair enough fight.
I agree with the FinnAgain et al sentiment, having never played the game. Yes, they were a-holes, so what, in this fantasy world there are a-holes, there are enemies, there are psychotics, etc. The idiot clan, if they truly respected the game would have held the funeral in the appropriate way…within in the context of the game. Meaning they could have not held it in a contested zone, or they could have posted sentries, asked for a temporary truce or whatever. They were super-imposing some sort of real world sensibility into this game, where it had no place.
Wrong analogy.
Try this: “How do you feel about attacking real-life funerals that are held in a paint ball area without the owners knowing about it while a paint ball game is actually under way?”
I’d say, if I paid my money, I’m playing some paint ball. If these people wanted to hold a quiet, decorous funeral, they should have contacted the owners about having a private session.
The analogy is closer to this: You see an ad in the paper about a memorial people want to hold for their paint-balling thread, in a specific section of a huge paintball field. Do you go out of your way to go to play paintball at that day and time, and seek out this small part of the field in order to piss on everyone’s cheerios?