I’d like to ask for a Pagan holiday off from work.
We turn in our vacation schedules at the end of this month. Yule falls on Friday, December 21st, 2001. In my office, vacation time is based on seniority, and while I might have a shot this year at the Friday before Christmas, my odds are still pretty slim (lots of folks like to take a few days before the holiday).
When we ask for vacation time in advance, explanations are not necessary. However, I want this day for my religion. If I explain why to my superiors, there’s a few different scenarios that could follow:
they’ll let me have it, and either a) deny someone with more seniority than me, which would piss someone off, or b)allow more than the usual number of people to have that day off.
they could ask questions, thus forcing me to “come out of the broom closet.” Working in the overwhelmingly Christian community in which I do, this is not necessarily a good thing.
they could deny me based on my religion, which would suck uproariously. I’d be all but forced to sue, and I’d win. But theres enough stress in my office already, and I really don’t want to cause more.
Now, I could just ask without explanation, and I might get lucky and get the day. But the odds are still not in my favor.
Have any Pagan folks out there dealt with this before? FWIW, I work for a municipality, and while our contract explicitly states that discrimination based on religion is forbidden, our vacation schedules are set strictly by seniority.
Tough decision to make.
We have a scientologist where I work, and as much as I disagree with it’s existence, I think it’s harsh the treatment he gets from the senior staff…
As much as I believe in honesty, I also know the harsh insecure close mindedness of the Christian world when it’s in the majority of a work place. It’s my opinion you either explain it as just a holiday, without any explanation of what holiday, or speak to someone you can trust higher up first and find their opinion on what the best scenario would be…
Let us know, I’m curious how this is handled… and Good Luck!
I guess I am lucky. I went into my job out of the proverbial broom closet and they understand that Personal Days are for my holiday’s and they always grant it.
Now then, I do work in a Tech Support center with quite a few religions (Hindu, Muslim, among others) so they are used to this.
I would ask for that as a Personal Vacation day, and leave it at that. If they ask, tell them a Religious day for me. If they ask more, start quoting law. I know it seems rude, and might cause a bit of stress, but it gets the point across.
No one deserves any kind of harrassment for their beliefs. At all. None. Just give them as little info as possible. My heart and energies are with you. Blessed Be.
I would say to go with the advice rob’s given you. Tell 'em you want it as a personal day, no questions asked. My mother works for the City of Toledo, and they each have several days they can designate as holidays, no questions asked.
If they ask questions, tell them it’s religious and leave it at that. If they still refuse… well, personally, I wouldn’t hesitate to call the ACLU. But that’s me.
I don’t suppose you could offer to work Christmas instead?
[hijack]This makes me glad that my personal religion has exactly one member–me–and no holidays. Though I suspect there are a lot of people, even in Ann Arbor, who wouldn’t accept that…
“So, you’re not a Christian, or a Jew, or Muslim. Are you one of those wacky Pagans?”
“Nope.”
“A witch?”
“No. I’m a Scientist.”
“Come again?”
I have been through this with several employers.
It is all dependent on the pharasing of both the request, and the office policys on certain items.
Vacation time: If you request the day as vacation, then the rules govening the granting of vacation apply (these are usually clearly defined in employee handbooks or hr info from hiring time, and you agreed to them when you signed on). In your case, this would be strictly governed by seniority. In most companies, vacation time is yours to do with as you choose… and explainations are not expected or considered. Otherwise management would have to deal with arguements such as “my trip to jamacia is more important than her cousins wedding”.
2)Personal days: In most companies, personal days and vacation days are different. In many cases, personal days do not have to be scheduled in advance (so these are what you use for appointments, rushing the dog to the vet, and days when you suddenly realize you were supposed to be somewhere else) These days are also often listed in employee handbooks as being " available for designation as personal religious holidays ". If you request yule in advance as a personal religious holiday, the request should be granted if your employer has such a policy concerning religous requests.
Hi Opal
If it were me (and it has been) I would ask for a meeting with whoever is responsible for that kind of scheduling (depending on office structure, it may also be advisable to have your imediate supervisor present as well)… and ask for it now, well in advance of the vacation deadline. Depending on who this person is, your approach to the meeting could vary. But I would explain that you follow a religion which celebrates holidays on the following dates (I wouldn’t focus on yule… as it could be open to misunderstanding your situation as scam to get the friday before christmas off). Explain that these days are important to you, and that you would like to ensure time off if at all possible. I typically offer to work on christian holidays like christmas and easter (good friday is another good one) in return for time off at times appropriate for me. Since you work for a municipality, (which are often completely closed for christmas and other holidays) this many or many not be relevant. Since you seem to be unclear on the policy concerning religious holidays I would explain that, and then ask what their policy is, and what you need to do to get time off on those days. They should have a policy. If they don’t, I would suggest that you offer to use your vacation time (and they make sure you get those days even if it involves an exception to the seniority policy) or offer to take the days as unpaid leave. Depending on the manager you speak to, you can either explain your beliefs and ask that they keep the information confidential (as part of your personel file) or you can just not give any details period (you don’t have to).
Regardless of how you get the days off… it’s none of your coworkers business what you are doing, and you don’t need to tell them if you don’t feel they would react well. I generally go with vague mention of religious olbigations, or just change the subject when asked about it. If they persist, direct them to management… who can’t give out personel info anyway (If management tells, then I would sue)
I have to agree with Pandora’s suggestion, especially #3. Talking about it now will allow time for the matter to be resolved, instead of waiting for Dec. 1st to roll around and suddenly springing this on them.
All I can recommend is be polite, but firm. You have the right to practice your faith just as others can practice their’s, which means asking for time off for religious purposes is completely valid. Also, prehaps you can compromise; offer to work over Easter or the like in exchange for taking off Yule/Solstice. I’ve found that if you try to work toward a common solution, many employers are willing to meet your requests.
I understand that offices are different but as you know (or maybe not) I work right smack in the Bible Belt and ahve never had a problem. Well, not since I started working in an office atmosphere anyway.
The advice you have been given is good. Just request it as a personal day or go ahead and call it a religious holiday from the get-go. If you are refused, then you can approach the individuals in charge of the scheduling and inquire about their reasons.
Sad as it seems, you may have to try a little non-lying semi-misdirection here. What I mean by that is that you should refer to the holiday as Yule (I know you do already!) without necessarily bringing up your religious affiliation. Yule is a more familiar, less-scary word than “pagan” and “solstice”–people are much less likely to question it.
I don’t know if this is true in your case, but every company I’ve worked for has set 1-3 “floating holidays” each year. Sometimes they lock one down to make the Fourth of July a longer weekend, but generally they’re left free for cases like this. Those are what I use; they’re usually governed by the holiday rules rather than vacation rules, so seniority doesn’t come into it. No one’s ever asked me why I pick particular days for them; I just tell my boss, mark the calendar, and I’m done. I hope it’s that easy for you as well. If not, well, the advice in this thread has all been pretty good.
From deep in the heart of Biblethumper territory,
Blessed Be
Offering to work another holiday is out of the question–we all get the same holidays off, as I’m a municipal government employee.
However, I did find out a bit of good news today. There are two people leaving my department very soon, so I will be moving up on the seniority ladder, from #6 to #4. What this means is that my odds on getting that day went WAY up. I will most likely be able to get the day, no questions asked.
There’s other holidays I’d like to take eventually, though, so this advice will come in handy later. The only thing that kinda bums me out is that I’ll never, ever, ever get Halloween. It’s one of our property tax deadlines, and nobody, but NOBODY gets that day off, not even the supervisors.
We accrue personal time every pay period, a set number of hours depending on how long you’ve been employed there. We don’t have personal days, but we do have rules regarding emergency situations (one unexcused, after that, you need a written excuse. They’re pretty lenient about what an excuse is, too. It’s not always medical. For instance, I once hit a pothole on the way to work, flattening my tire & damaging the rim. The receipt from the repair shop that fixed it qualified as an excuse). However, I don’t recall seeing anything in our office rules or our union contract about personal religious holidays (doesn’t mean it’s not there–just means I didn’t see it). When I get back to work on Monday I’m going to check it out & see what they say. If there’s something that does cover it, this might be the way to go if I want another holiday off.
But that’s me.