I think magellan actually has something of a point on this (please hold off the tar and feathers).
I read what tomndebb was saying there quite differently. I don’t believe he’s saying “i’m not going to ban you, even if you did these things” - he’s saying “i’m far from banning you, even though you are doing these things”; and among those things are insults (“incompetent debater” for one). I read it as a pretty clear insult of magellan.
Since when?? I don’t think I’ve ever seen magellan01 do any better. To call him a fuckwit is an insult to fuckwits.
No, I’m just explaining why I made the ruling that I did. Sorry if I was unclear.
[sub]Why do I keep looking at this thread? “Avoid the Pit,” I say to myself, over and over.[/sub]
Correct, IMO.
And, as serious discussion of issues of this sort is not common in the Pit, it is unfortunate that the thread was moved here. magellan01 has a legitimate point. To move it to the Pit is merely to invite (tacitly, at least) diversion of the thread into a series of personal attacks against the OP. A way, IOW, of avoiding the question of tomndebb’s behavior in GD, whether advertent or not.
Regards,
Shodan
Crap, Shodan’s agreeing with me. You do realise any credibility I once had is now shot, right? 
Just as a general point, I don’t think the board is best served by putting all critique of Mods or the board itself in the Pit. Certainly for the more insult-filled attacks on board speed, or if someone just wants to mock a Mod - but by making even those OPs which question a Mod’s actions in a civil way be Pitted, it does invite general mocking and insulting from all concerned (and from those not). If threads such as these were allowed in ATMB then they’d be both shorter and probably end up with less ill-feeling on all sides, as well as stopping the random sniping that controversial posters recieve (even when it’s deserved, it’s pretty pointless).
As do I. However, I’m always hesitant in situations like this because I inevitably wind up “defending” some miserable malcontent, who’s managed to stumble into a valid position.
I have a hard time understanding how the words “incompetant debater who distorts what has been posted” attacks magellan’s arguments and not magellan himself.
Bit of grey there. A disparaging remark centered on how one conducts a debate has some legitimacy. “That was an asshole thing to say” is phrased on the margins of acceptability, while “you are an asshole” is not. We have mods like we have traffic cops, we expect them to bust the utterly egregious, but not to convene a conclave of scholars to parse meaning. Kind of like we expect cops to bust someone slamming down the road at 110 mph but to shrug off 56 or 57 mph.
This is rich. I seem to recall you atacking me in The Pit once before. That went well for you, didn’t it? You migth want to review that sneaky, cowardly move of yours and remind yourself what it’s like to be so wrong and get so bitch-slapped you run away for months.
Well, not surprised to see you here. Life is nice and safe in a pile on. Enjoy. Now, while, based on exchanges with you in the past, I don’t care a flea’s ass what you think, this seems to be a good opportunity to help you with logic. Who knows, maybe it’ll penetrate. Let’s say Tom is a good mod—no, a GREAT mod—maybe even the best mod of all time, that doesn’t make him right in this particular case, and me wrong. And that’s kind of the point of this thread, which you decided not to address. Actually, I am of the opinion that tomndebb brings a great many positive things to these boards. He is articulate and has an impressive grasp of a broad swath of topics, particularly many aspects of history. I’m also of the opinion that he is not infallible, just like everyone else. The major fault I do find with Tom is that when he does err, he seems to be incapable of admitting his error and, God forbid, apologizing. Now I’ve long ago given up on the latter, but I will continue to hold him to the former, particularly when it involves me.
I hope that helps. Thanks for your valuable contribution. You may now go back to your nice simple world: “magellan01, baaad. tomndebb goooood.”
They’re so cute when they say this…
No, I strongly diasagree. Look at the tone of the OP. Those weren’t insults directed to anyone, they were examples to lay the groundwork for the discussion. They were helpful as to what was to be discussed. Insuts would necessarily be part of the discussion, much like the words wop, kike, and nigger would be used in a GD thread about racial or ethnic slurs. I wanted this to be a serious, sober discussion, but your tossing it into The Pit has made that difficult. Just look at how few people have actually weighed in on the questions posed in the OP. But I’m not surprised by that. Neither, I’d wager, are you.
I don’t think there’s any reasonable way to parse it where it doesn’t attack magellan the poster, instead of one of his arguments. It doesn’t even bring up one of his arguments, it just calls him an incompetant debater. Accurate, legitimate, perhaps, but the rules clearly state that you should only be attacking the arguments, not the person behind them.
It’s fair to expect minor violations to slide, however, someone lodged a complaint. If you complain about something that is clearly a violation (even if it’s just 5 miles over the speed limit) I don’t expect the traffic cop to say “I don’t think he was speeding, but your taillight’s out, here’s a ticket.”
I would have been happy if there was even just an acknowledgement that the post was not totally kosher.
It is far from my desire to have a discussion in GD turn ugly. I would actually prefer a heavier hand in moderating tempers in GD, as long as it was done with an even hand. The intent of the OP is to cast light on the fact that tomndebb, who I ve had minor but recurring problems with in the past, insulted me in GD. Ordinarily, a mod comes in a straightens that out. But he is a mod, and ignored the issue when I brought it up to him. The OP was crafted to focus light on his transgression. That last line is there to remind the powers that be that people need to know the rules to follow them. Even, evidently, a mod (tomndebb).
Oh, Jesus! This dumbfuck was spewing bullshit all over the thread, and clearly violated a rule about not putting “blah blah blah” in someone’s quotes. Despite it being clearly a violation, he got a very patient non-warning about it. Nevertheless he bleated on for about five posts pushing the matter, being a fairly rude little prick while doing so.
He oughta have gotten a warning or a time-out. Instead he’s here amping up the fucking whine, and getting support from some for doing so. Fuck that. The guy’s a half-brained shit disturber.
He’s the type of little weasel that likes to goad and bait and prick until he gets a less than polite response, and then jump up and down pointing and crying foul.
My hope is that he’s circling the bowl and looking for a death by mod.
::: sigh :::
I can see how it can be construed as a personal insult, but that is not how it was posted and there was a specific context to the exchange:
magellan01, as is his habit, turned a discussion of issues into a personal feud, finally indicating that I might actually Warn or ban him simply for disagreeing with me.
I replied that I would not Warn him for being a bad poster; I would warn him for breaking the rules.
As I say, I can see where my statement can be construed as an attack, but my original response was intended as a hypothetical. Given that magellan01 frequently turns disagreements into personal feuds, I did, indeed, ignore his claim that I was making a personal attack. It seemed like just one more of his complaints. Subsequently, we had a bit of an e-mail exchange in which nothing was resolved–certainly not to his satisfaction, after which he took this to the board.
The “arguments” that I “did not bring up” were the comments that I would ban him for a disagreement which was the specific text to which I responded.
Do us all a favor and just ban the fuckwit. He’s a troll, and we know from past experience that he’s not going to shut up about this non-incident.
He will when we stop answering.
What’s the fuck is your problem? Pay attention, genius.
Eh, eh?
Stupid troll.
Obviously, that should’ve read “What the fuck is your problem?”
But the point stands. You go out of you way to stir up shit in GD, and then whine and complain about shit being stirred up in GD. You are, in short, lying and pretending to hold a position that you do not really hold. And you are doing so in order to piss people off.
You are a troll, and hopefully your time will be up soon.
I know this is The Pit and all, but do you care to share the evidence of this accusation? I mean, you must have some, right, you would never just throw around an empty accusation, right? That would just be dumb, wouldn’t it?
I suggest you look at the stickies and see what the word means. I mean you wouldn’t want to caught lying, would you? After you see you’re mistaken, I’ll look forward to your apology.
And if only there was some way to avoid having to deal with someone you find so objectionable…If only there was a way to direct your mind away from what he types and not respond… If only…
FinnAgain, ditto for you.
Now if either of you wish to weigh in on the OP, that I might be interested in. Even with your clear bias. Seriously.
On review, FinnAgain, what is this position that I hold but do not really hold? And how do you know this? And therefore feel comfortable concluding that Im lying about it?