"A View To a Kill" quirk

[mixdenny]

I’m watching A View to a Kill for the 45th time and spotted a small quirk I hadn’t seen before. Right after Bond and Tibbett go to the horse auction, Tibbett follows the doctor and a henchman into the stables. They are joined by a second lackey. The trio walks past the stalls with all the horses looking out toward them. The second guy (with a plaid shirt, I think) is a step behind. As he passes each horse, that horse makes a sudden nudge with his nose towards the fellow. The horses do not nudge the doctor or the first guy, nor does the one horse show any interest in Tibbett as he sneaks out.

Tidbits in the pocket or something?

Dennis

[Richard_John_Marcej]

I realize this has nothing to do with the quirk you’re talking about, but since you brought up “A View To A Kill”…
It’s my least favorite of the Bond films (well, tied with “Die Another Day”) for many reasons, but there’s one line in the film especially that took me right out of the story.

Bond is racing through San Francisco to stop the bad guy and a US police officer stops him and this conversation takes place:

U.S. Police Captain: You’re under arrest.
Stacey Sutton: Wait a minute, this is James Stock of the London Financial times.
James Bond: Well, actually, captain, I’m with the British Secret Service. The name is Bond, James Bond.
U.S. Police Captain: Is he?
Stacey Sutton: Are you?
James Bond: Yes.
U.S. Police Captain: And I’m Dick Tracy and you’re still under arrest!

When the officer hears the name James Bond he thinks the guy is putting him on, using that name. That’s why he responds with a well known fiction police detective name, Dick Tracy.
BUT- in this version of our world James Bond is a spy. The man on the street, most all people wouldn’t know the name of a British spy, or any spy.

It was lazy writing.

[Bryan_Ekers]

There’s a similar moment in Diamonds are Forever. Bond impersonates a guy named Peter Franks, but when the real Franks shows up, Bond kills him and puts his own ID on Franks’ corpse. When Tiffany Case finds and searches the body, she looks up at Bond (who she thinks is Franks) with wide-eyed wonder:

Case: You just killed James Bond!

Bond: [badly-feigned surprise] Is that who that was? Well, I guess nobody lives forever.

Case: You don’t understand - you don’t just kill James Bond and wait for the cops to show up!
It’s a dumb movie, my least favourite of Connery’s - worse even than Never Say Never Again.

[mlees]

I always assumed the horse moved because of Tibbett moving around inside the stall. (I don’t know if there is enough room in those stalls for a horse to turn itself around in.) We don’t see him at that moment, but he could have put his hand on the horse as he approached the stall doorway.

[wevets]

@Richard_John_Marcej

BUT- in this version of our world James Bond is a spy. The man on the street, most all people wouldn’t know the name of a British spy, or any spy.

It was lazy writing.

True.

It is a conceit of the Bond movie universe, though. In most of the Bond movies, everyone except a few low-level goons and bystanders know exactly who James Bond is and who he works for. In most of the early movies, he doesn’t even bother with a cover name.

[terentii]

@Bryan_Ekers

There’s a similar moment in Diamonds are Forever. Bond impersonates a guy named Peter Franks, but when the real Franks shows up, Bond kills him and puts his own ID on Franks’ corpse. When Tiffany Case finds and searches the body, she looks up at Bond (who she thinks is Franks) with wide-eyed wonder:

Case: You just killed James Bond!

Bond: [badly-feigned surprise] Is that who that was? Well, I guess nobody lives forever.

Case: You don’t understand - you don’t just kill James Bond and wait for the cops to show up!
It’s a dumb movie, my least favourite of Connery’s - worse even than Never Say Never Again.

It is possible that Case would know about Bond, since she’s a member of Blofeld’s smuggling operation. Word about Bond must have filtered down to Blofeld’s minions by then.

Ignoring the magic Mustang that flips on two wheels, the most gaping flaw in ***Diamonds *** is that Plenty comes looking for Case and ends up drowned in her swimming pool. I spent years wondering if I had missed something there, but I finally learned the footage connecting the two was shot but ended up on the cutting room floor.

By the time ***Diamonds ***was filmed, the Bond movies were being written by committees basically chosen to satisfy UA executives, and went through more drafts than a celebrity prenup.

[mixdenny]

@mlees

I always assumed the horse moved because of Tibbett moving around inside the stall. (I don’t know if there is enough room in those stalls for a horse to turn itself around in.) We don’t see him at that moment, but he could have put his hand on the horse as he approached the stall doorway.

No, he is still way behind the bad guys, looking around the corner as they walk past the horsies.

Dennis

[mixdenny]

@terentii

By the time ***Diamonds ***was filmed, the Bond movies were being written by committees basically chosen to satisfy UA executives, and went through more drafts than a celebrity prenup.

You mean Bambi, Thumper and the gay duo weren’t crucial plot elements drawn from Fleming’s works?

Knowing a bit about how long it takes to weld pipeline to pass x-ray inspection, switching electrode types as you progress from the root pass through the fillers to the cap welds, I find the welding bots quite silly.

Dennis

[terentii]

@mixdenny

You mean Bambi, Thumper and the gay duo weren’t crucial plot elements drawn from Fleming’s works?

Believe it or not! :eek:

[Bryan_Ekers]

@mixdenny

You mean Bambi, Thumper and the gay duo weren’t crucial plot elements drawn from Fleming’s works?

Well, Wint and Kidd (the killers that kept popping up through the movie) were from the novel and Felix Leiter in that novel speculated they were gay, but there was nothing nearly as indicative as the hand-holding scene from the film.

I’ve read, though, that the hand-holding was an improvised bit by Bruce Glover (Wint) who did it mainly for his own amusement to mortify Putter Smith (Kidd).

[Richard_John_Marcej]

@Bryan_Ekers

Well, Wint and Kidd (the killers that kept popping up through the movie) were from the novel and Felix Leiter in that novel speculated they were gay, but there was nothing nearly as indicative as the hand-holding scene from the film.

I’ve read, though, that the hand-holding was an improvised bit by Bruce Glover (Wint) who did it mainly for his own amusement to mortify Putter Smith (Kidd).

Well at the end of the film while Mr. Kidd dives off the boat, on fire because of the flaming kabobs, Bond grabs the time bomb that’s tied in Mr. Wint’s hands and pulls it between Wint’s legs, when he does this, putting pressure on his crotch, Wint has his “O” Face on. Of course Bond then flips him in to the ocean where Wint blows up…

[Harvey_The_Heavy]

@Richard_John_Marcej

When the officer hears the name James Bond he thinks the guy is putting him on, using that name. That’s why he responds with a well known fiction police detective name, Dick Tracy.
BUT- in this version of our world James Bond is a spy. The man on the street, most all people wouldn’t know the name of a British spy, or any spy.

It was lazy writing.

I don’t think the cop was reacting to the name, just the assertion that he was from the British Secret Service.

[Superdude]

@Bryan_Ekers

{snip}

Case: You don’t understand - you don’t just kill James Bond and wait for the cops to show up!

{/snip}

This has “Sean Bean Meme” written all over it.

[Stranger_On_A_Train]

@wevets

It is a conceit of the Bond movie universe, though. In most of the Bond movies, everyone except a few low-level goons and bystanders know exactly who James Bond is and who he works for. In most of the early movies, he doesn’t even bother with a cover name.

A trope that is lampshaded in Casino Royale (the 2006 Daniel Craig reboot film, not the abysmal 1967 ‘comedy’) in which Bond dispenses with his cover when checking into a hotel, assuring his compatriot that ‘Le Chiffre’ already knows who he is and what he is there to do (not realizing that Vesper has already betrayed him).

In the Bond universe, including the Craig films, everybody already seems to know who he is, including his rank and affiliation, number designation, weapon preference, et cetera, which makes a mockery of Bond as a “secret agent” performing globe trotting investigations under false covers. He also seems to carry little or no luggage and lose passports and other identification and yet never has a problem flitting from country to country, somehow being fully equipped with well pressed three piece suits, dinner jackets, and a variety of other informal wear appropriate to the station even if he just travelled from Shanghai to Aruba (another trope lampshaded by Craig’s Bond, this time in Quantum of Solace). He also manages to smuggle or acquire needed weaponry and gadgets through whatever customs and entry inspection he goes through, although why he sticks with an underpowered 7.65 mm Walther PPK in the majority of films (except in Casino Royale and parts of Goldfinger and Live And Let Die is beyond me).

James Bond is a terrible secret agent, which is why M is always threatening to replace him with 008. “He follows orders, not instincts.”

Stranger

[The_Other_Waldo_Pepper]

@Stranger_On_A_Train

In the Bond universe, including the Craig films, everybody already seems to know who he is, including his rank and affiliation, number designation, weapon preference, et cetera

Heck, From Russia With Love opens with a SPECTRE operative rehearsing a kill by murdering a tuxedoed Sean Connery lookalike complete with small handgun – in much the same way that the opening sequence in The Man With The Golden Gun shows the title character using a tuxedoed wax dummy of Roger Moore, complete with small handgun, for target practice, one finger at a time.

[CalMeacham]

I just recently re-watched Diamonds are Forever on a DVD full of extras, so I got to see the excised footage at long last. I also got to see the “making of…” documentary. What amazes me is that they all thought they were making a good film, whereas this has always been my least favorite of the Connery Bonds – even when I first saw it. In their mind, they were re-assembling the team that had made Goldfinger, and were hoping to repeat its success. They got the same scriptwriter, the same director, the same Shirley Bassey to do the theme song. And when UA insisted, they dropped their plans for John Gavin as an “American” James Bond and reverted to Sean Connery, with his usual backup of Bernard Lee, Lois Maxwell, and Desmond Llewelyn as “M”, Moneypenny, and “Q”. Ken Adams did his usual magic with the sets, and they tried to duplicate the “Fleming sweep”. They departed from Fleming’s book, big time, but they’d already done that with You Only Live Twice, so what was the big deal?

Then they turned out a film filled with unanswered questions and blatant stupidities The “American Gangsters” that co-scripter Tom Mankiewicz was supposed to be so good at were embarrassing caricatures. Plenty O’Toole’s role has been cut so thin it doesn’t make sense. Banbi and Thumper, such wonderfully formidable foes, basically give up when dumped in the water. Blofeld’s getaway looks like the buildup to something bigger, and fizzles out disappointingly (They were evidently going to have a chase sequence, somewhat like in the previous film, [On Her Majesty’s Secret Service, but they ran out of money and time – they blame Connery’s huge salary. But they should’ve arranged something better than what they have.)

Even ignoring that it would’ve taken longer than they show to get Bond sealed up in a pipe, it’s incredibly dumb and lazy. Putting Bond in a section of pipe to be buried? What if he woke up early? What if – as seems way to likely – someone noticed him in the pipe before it got buried? What the hell kind of send-off is that, in any case?

Too many of the effects seemed absurdly bad (the hinged hillock-with-a-fake-cactus exit in the desert, the bad matted explosions off helicopters attacking the oil rig, the disappointing “laser” attacks, the obvious dummy of Putter Smith as Mr. Kidd when he gets his Just Reward at the end, and so on.

And this was the first Bond movie that I saw when it was just released. At least it was a bit better than Roger Moore’s first outing in Live and Let Die.

And I have to agree that the idea of a “famous secret agent” is a complete oxymoron.

[The_Pork-Chop_Express]

@Richard_John_Marcej

I realize this has nothing to do with the quirk you’re talking about, but since you brought up “A View To A Kill”…
It’s my least favorite of the Bond films (well, tied with “Die Another Day”) for many reasons, but there’s one line in the film especially that took me right out of the story.

Bond is racing through San Francisco to stop the bad guy and a US police officer stops him and this conversation takes place:

U.S. Police Captain: You’re under arrest.
Stacey Sutton: Wait a minute, this is James Stock of the London Financial times.
James Bond: Well, actually, captain, I’m with the British Secret Service. The name is Bond, James Bond.
U.S. Police Captain: Is he?
Stacey Sutton: Are you?
James Bond: Yes.
U.S. Police Captain: And I’m Dick Tracy and you’re still under arrest!

When the officer hears the name James Bond he thinks the guy is putting him on, using that name. That’s why he responds with a well known fiction police detective name, Dick Tracy.
BUT- in this version of our world James Bond is a spy. The man on the street, most all people wouldn’t know the name of a British spy, or any spy.

It was lazy writing.

Maybe the cop’s referring to his being in the British Secret Service, not the name.

[Robot_Arm]

@CalMeacham

I just recently re-watched Diamonds are Forever on a DVD full of extras, so I got to see the excised footage at long last. I also got to see the “making of…” documentary. What amazes me is that they all thought they were making a good film, whereas this has always been my least favorite of the Connery Bonds – even when I first saw it. In their mind, they were re-assembling the team that had made Goldfinger, and were hoping to repeat its success. They got the same scriptwriter, the same director, the same Shirley Bassey to do the theme song. And when UA insisted, they dropped their plans for John Gavin as an “American” James Bond and reverted to Sean Connery, with his usual backup of Bernard Lee, Lois Maxwell, and Desmond Llewelyn as “M”, Moneypenny, and “Q”. Ken Adams did his usual magic with the sets, and they tried to duplicate the “Fleming sweep”. They departed from Fleming’s book, big time, but they’d already done that with You Only Live Twice, so what was the big deal?

Then they turned out a film filled with unanswered questions and blatant stupidities The “American Gangsters” that co-scripter Tom Mankiewicz was supposed to be so good at were embarrassing caricatures. Plenty O’Toole’s role has been cut so thin it doesn’t make sense. Banbi and Thumper, such wonderfully formidable foes, basically give up when dumped in the water. Blofeld’s getaway looks like the buildup to something bigger, and fizzles out disappointingly (They were evidently going to have a chase sequence, somewhat like in the previous film, [On Her Majesty’s Secret Service, but they ran out of money and time – they blame Connery’s huge salary. But they should’ve arranged something better than what they have.)

Even ignoring that it would’ve taken longer than they show to get Bond sealed up in a pipe, it’s incredibly dumb and lazy. Putting Bond in a section of pipe to be buried? What if he woke up early? What if – as seems way to likely – someone noticed him in the pipe before it got buried? What the hell kind of send-off is that, in any case?

Too many of the effects seemed absurdly bad (the hinged hillock-with-a-fake-cactus exit in the desert, the bad matted explosions off helicopters attacking the oil rig, the disappointing “laser” attacks, the obvious dummy of Putter Smith as Mr. Kidd when he gets his Just Reward at the end, and so on.

And this was the first Bond movie that I saw when it was just released. At least it was a bit better than Roger Moore’s first outing in Live and Let Die.

I remember the days before cable TV, when the Big 3 networks had regular slots in their lineups for movies. It was always a big deal when some recent blockbuster was getting it’s free broadcast premier. I think ABC had the rights to the Bond films, and they always gave them a bit of extra hype, and for Diamonds Are Forever in particular.

There was a time when every Bond film had to big bigger and faster and explodier than the one before, and DAF fit the bill. As those excesses have fallen out of favor, so has it.

[AtomicDog]

@Richard_John_Marcej

Well at the end of the film while Mr. Kidd dives off the boat, on fire because of the flaming kabobs, Bond grabs the time bomb that’s tied in Mr. Wint’s hands and pulls it between Wint’s legs, when he does this, putting pressure on his crotch, Wint has his “O” Face on. Of course Bond then flips him in to the ocean where Wint blows up…

I checked and found out that the both Putter Smith and Bruce Glover are still alive. It would be cool to see a reunion: Mr. Kidd and Mr. Wint - still together after all these years.

[Just_Asking_Questions]

@Robot_Arm

There was a time when every Bond film had to big bigger and faster and explodier than the one before, and DAF fit the bill. As those excesses have fallen out of favor, so has it.

I’m not convinced they have fallen out of favor. While Skyfall and Spectre don’t have the excesses of, say, Moonraker, they both seem to be trying to out do their predecessors. I think Casino Royale was a fluke. Somehow, they let a Bond movie slip through that made sense and wasn’t over the top. They’ll never let that happen again!