So, you’ve dropped your act of being offended by bad words…
Yup, “LOL” & ALL CAPS are truly marks of class!
The one thing I despise the most about the protestors is the absolutely false medical information they disperse. Abortion causes breast cancer! Your two month old fetus can feel pain! Men have psychological damage from abortion! All women regret abortion! Abortion makes you sterile! Adopton is a wonderful la-la land where nobody gets hurt! Bullshit all!
I read a very weird book that stated from the time of conception a creature can sense enough to know when it’s being rejected, and future embryos will miscarry because they will know the womb is a place of “rejection and death.” Of course, the same author claimed sexual deviance was caused by “lustful conception”; i.e. rape, unmarried intercourse, or even “too lustful intercourse within marriage.”
I could not make this shit up, so if you con’t believe me, read this
So when you say “permitted” you’re not talking about any sort of claim that the LAW permits it – you’re saying that individual police officers choose to ignore the law in the instances you witnessed.
Taking you at your word, you’ve only seen law enforcement intervene once in 200 instances. You don’t say how many of those 200 instances involved illegal conduct on the part of the protesters.
Do you have any data other than your own observations? I have attended more than 200 abortion clinic protests where the actions of the “protesters” were limited to standing there praying. Not once have I personally seen any illegal conduct on the part of the protesters. In fact, the most significant interaction I’m aware of from personal experience was a woman who stopped to tell one of our number that he was an idiot – who would care for this kid if she had it? Him?
He replied, “Let me call my wife and ask her.”
And that woman, once she realized he was serious, ended up having her baby and my friend and his wife adopted the child. And they kept the birth mother involved in her daughter’s life to the extent she wanted to be; all three attended her daughter’s high school graduation and the young woman just got married.
Since we’re trading anecdotes, and all.
I don’t deny that protesters have crossed the line into acting illegally. I reject the claim that it’s proper to say these acts are permitted because of some special legal status that only innures to abortion protesters.
Hmm…first Bricker was proclaiming that having differing versions of the same story made it more credible for him. Now he’s postulating multiple occasions where someone supposedly asked the woman the same question and got the same non-sequiturish answer, and demanding that I document these postulated events to prove his point.
Exactly how long have you been posting here, Bricker? You know better than this.
You should, since the anti-abortion movement so grievously embarassed itself by making ludicrous claims about her. Some might view that as justifying caution when citing a poorly documented anecdote in the case of another brain-damaged patient and using it to promote anti-abortion views.
Before, you said that filming clinic visitors was to protect the anti-abortion protestors, pure and simple. Now you’re conceding that it’s intimidating to the patients, but that it’s “unavoidable”. Nice switcheroo.
False. I pointed out that the stories were vague, not to mention differing on a key detail. Nowhere did I accuse either publication of lying. Get your facts straight.
Since you’re speaking for these people, here’s an answer directed to them. “Don’t get in the face of clinic patients, don’t blockade clinic entrances, don’t stalk, harass or obstruct women seeking medical care, and reject the use of bombs and guns to get your way when the law doesn’t agree with your goals. You’ll find that accusations of illegal activity will cease to be a problem.”
Another ancedote: The protestors know me. Some respect my opinion, some treat me like shit.
One of the latter was talking to a guy attempting to go in the clinic one day. I was standing behind her where the guy could see me. When she realized I was there, she moved between us. I moved again. She moved again, blocking me from his view. I moved again. She moved again. I moved.
She finally turned around and said “Excuse me, this is a private conversation.”
I looked befuddled, then said “Excuse me, this is a public sidewalk and I have not said a word.”
The cop came over and asked what was wrong. I explained what happened, adding that I was not saying anything to anyone.
He told the protestor I had every right to stand there, but he wasn’t going to interfer.
I guess i should be glad the protestor didn’t pull a gun and shoot my ass.
“But” he wasn’t going to interfere? Shouldn’t that be “and”? Nobody there was doing anything wrong; the cop is exactly correct.
You’ve proved that a book of some kind exists.
Your implicit claim that this is some sort of standard text for abortion protester use is still unproven, and does in fact fall into the catefory of “making shit up.”
As to the other claims:
Abortion causes breast cancer!
Agreed that this is nonsense. The only relationship I’m aware of is the fact that a risk factor for breast cancer is a woman’s age at the time of her first live birth. I suppose one could thus argue that a young woman who chooses to give birth rather than abort somehow insulates herself from being an older woman giving birth for the first time, but that seems a tenuous argument.
Your two month old fetus can feel pain!
Pretty sure that’s nonsense, although there is some debate about what age a fetus can feel pain. I’ve seen studies that place it at 20 weeks and studies that place it much later. I am unaware of any serious pro-life attempts to claim it’s less than 20 weeks, and since most abortions occur prior to the 20 week mark, I don’t think this would be a deciding factor too often.
Is this a strawman, or have you a cite for any serious pro-life claims of an 8-week-old fetus feeling pain?
- Men have psychological damage from abortion!*
This doesn’t seem like an impossible claim to me. What is your evidence that this is “bulshit all?”
- All women regret abortion!*
Obvious nonsense. Of course, equally nonsensical would be a claim that no women regret abortion – right?
Abortion makes you sterile!
Obviously untrue, although equally obviously there’s a non-zero chance that abortion would result in some medical problem that would cause sterility. But so might tobacco use, STDs, and endometriosis, all with substantially more likelihood than abortion, so this claim is fairly described as bullshit, and I HAVE heard it made by pro-life advocates.
- Adopton is a wonderful la-la land where nobody gets hurt!*
I think this is another strawman. Obviously pro-life advocates believe that adoption is generally positive and almost certainly a better choice than abortion, but I’ve never seen anyone seriously claim that it’s a wonderful la-la land where nobody gets hurt.
When you phrase it that way, you remove it from a debatable proposition to an obvious falsehood. That’s exactly what the “strawman” fallacy describes: you change your opponent’s argument to something absurd, and then defeat it, hoping your listener will conclude that you’ve defeated that actual argument.
How about a comment on the actual argument: adoption is generally positive and almost certainly a better choice than abortion?
Not at all. The answer is “non-sequiterish” only in the first story. In the second, it’s a perfectly responsive answer to the query.
Still dodging the basic issue. I have two cites. You have zero cites. Put up or shut up.
Yes, I’m sure you meant only to clear up the confusion on the key detail.
:rolleyes:
Really? When such fair-minded persons as yourself are on the other side?
Yeah, that’s funny.
And…?
It’s no wonder you seem to believe the cops are ineffective, if this is your idea of a situation in which the cops should have acted.
What crime do you contend was committed here, that would have justified the cop’s acting in some way?
PM?
BTW and FYI, “partial birth abortion” is more of a political term than a medical one, and there is a lot of disinformation about it. Also, it is not as simple as it sounds. Obviously, I did not see what dropzone sent you, but your response sounds quite vicious.
Not to mention posting private information about a third party that was received through a private channel. Stay classy there, lady!
A quick “thanks” for mentioning the story of Angela Carder (née Stoner). I hadn’t heard of her before, and I’m horrified to think that this happened in my country and during my lifetime.
From the Wiki article:
"The doctors at George Washington University Hospital in Washington, D.C. immediately gave Carder only days to live and disagreed with her choice to put her own life ahead of the fetus. Instead of treating the cancer, they ignored her protests and inserted an oral feeding tube into her, rendering her silent, and administered sedatives, in an effort to delay her death and increase her fetus’ chance chance of continued development. . . "
ClassyladyHP: do you agree with what the doctors at the hospital did to her? Would you have done the same?
These posts include language that isn’t permitted in The Pit. Please review the Restricted Language in The Pit sticky and avoid repeating that language.
Gfactor
Pit Moderator
Noted and apology proffered to Gfactor.
*goes off to read sticky that I should have read before posting:smack: *
Is that an admission that an embryo is not a baby? Now we’re at least dealing with facts.
If someone sends me hate mail i have a right to disclose that. I didn’t post the actual PM but I can if you want. They have no right to privacy if they are stupid enough to send an abusive PM they have forfeited that right ok stupid?
Nope:rolleyes:
You see? That’s what I was trying to tell you. too bad you’re not bright enough to get it.
If this was a rom-com Bricker and Classy would be sitting on the edge of a hotel bed by now, watching a pregnancy test strip slowly change color.
Then the scene would change and Classy would be in line at a planned parenthood.
He referred to it as a partial birth abortion.I didn’t post the actual PM. I still have it though.