When I was a Canadian white teenager back in the 60’s and even into the seventies, it was common “knowledge” that a white person who walked into a black ghetto was in extreme danger. Harlem in New York was to be avoided at all costs.
But now President Clinton has an office in Harlem and he seems to be doing okay. Furthermore, I haven’t been in any American city save Dallas for many many years, and I just haven’t heard of this problem for a long long time.
Do angry inner city black ghettos still exist ?
Are whites “reasonably” safe from racial anger everywhere in America ?
I don’t think the issue was ever really racial anger except for a few isolated incidence like the LA Riots. The main factor is that they are poor areas with a higher than average violent crime rates, drug dealing etc. I grew up next to some rural black ghettos and I lived in New Orleans for a while. The only disadvantage a white person has is standing out and appearing to have some money. In lots of circumstances, that actually works in favor of a white person that will get lots of attention if something happens. I would say that blacks are in as much or more danger in those neighborhoods. I have only been afraid a few times because I was white and only then, it was because it appeared I had money.
BLACKS in the ghetto are at a greater danger of being victims of crime than whites are.
Most crime is generally acknowleged to be intra-racial.
So yes, there are still places in American cities that are very high crime, and where there is risk of getting mugged, assaulted or carjacked. But I don’t think it’s about “racial anger.” It’s just about simple economics.
As to your other question: black ghettos still exist but many of the infamous ones were created by urban planners with fucked up ideas. We now know that you don’t take thousands of poor people and confine them to a few large buildings or concentrated areas. It breeds crime and general lawlessness. Chicago’s high-rise ghettos were a horrible idea as well as similar things across the country. France has the same problem even now because they have tried to warehouse poor Muslims in concentrated areas away from the city.
However, there are still ghettos in many areas. Their design is just a little better and police have learned more about how to control them such as fixing smaller problems such as graffiti and run down buildings before they breed bigger crime.
There are poor neighborhoods with large black populations that self-righteous wanna-be thugs like to call “ghettos” while they drive around in their decalled Hondas blasting rap music from their $10,000 stereos.
I’ve often wondered what the reaction would be if you transplanted a few of those guys to a real ghetto. But I digress.
There are certainly neighborhoods where gang violence is a huge problem. But no, being white and merely walking into them is not generally a death sentence. On the other hand, don’t go walking around Bed-Stuy wearing an “I hate the darkies” t-shirt.
As for Harlem, crime there was significantly worse in the 1970s and 1980s than it is own. And gang warfare did not necessarily encompass all of Harlem, which is quite large and home to lots of white people as well. Much of Harlem is quite gentrified these days. And violent crime in New York City in general has been plummeting for the past ten or fifteen years.
Yeah, I’d say it’s more an issue of class than race. I’m white and my clothes and grooming probably scream “middle class.” The two American areas that sprang to mind as places I’m likely to deliberately avoid are Compton and East St. Louis.
There was a time when I was in college on a road trip, riding in this upscale sedan that my friend had borrowed from his dad. We got off course and wound up driving through a portion of East St. Louis, which was overwhelmingly black and poor (this was about 10 years ago). Every stop was a 4-way stop, most businesses had smashed, boarded up windows. Heading back to the freeway, we got stopped by a passing train and were surrounded by other cars filled with people who simply stared at us pointedly. It was intimidating. That’s the one and only time I felt like a target based on the car I was in. I believe that we looked like we had money and thought maybe we were being sized up. Obviously nothing came of it, so most or all of that could have been my imagination.
Why do you say that. From m-w.com A ghetto is “2 : a quarter of a city in which members of a minority group live especially because of social, legal, or economic pressure” Maybe not where you live, but I can tell you Milwaukee has black ghettos, as well as Mexican ghettos.
Perhaps it’s just the Jew in me. I find the use of the word “ghetto” to describe a poor ethnic neighborhood to be incorrect to a level of offensiveness.
DGMW, in New York City there were several social and legal policies that forced hundreds of thousands of black people into certain areas, but not for the past 40 years or so.
I never understood the concept of street danger. What is supposed to happen to me if I walk into a bad neighborhood? Having walked around Richmond, CA alone in the middle of the night looking for an open liquor store (don’t ask), I don’t understand the basic idea. Sure, if you live there you are statistically more likely to be a victim of a crime, but what is going to happen to a visitor? Burglary is out. Murder or assault most likely as well unless you get hit by a stray bullet. Mugging is a possibility but I would imagine it’s more likely to happen in a nice, rich neighborhood where the mugger is not going to get his brains blown out before he can say “wallet”.
I think this general misconception stems from the fact that some people really stand out in bad neighborhoods based on the way they act and dress. Wherever you are, be it Beverly Hills, Palo Alto, Manhattan, Harlem or bad parts of Rio - if you look like a confused family-type tourist your danger of getting into trouble goes up exponentially.
I was just in Milwaukee last week, and due to all the lovely construction you’re all suffering through these days my Mapquest directions were completely useless. After leaving Miller and asking how to get to Pottawatomie casino we were told we would be driving through some “pretty bad neighborhoods” via the routes that were still open. I didn’t worry, I’ve been in some pretty bad neighborhoods in my day. Watts, Compton, downtown Detroit, the areas around University of Illinois Chicago, etc.
Either that was one sheltered white dude I was talking to or Milwaukee bad neighborhoods don’t have anything on, say, the Robert Taylor Homes here in Chicago. Sure, they were mostly black, but there were kids riding bikes and people having lawn parties. Not exactly a bad neighborhood, you know? No flipped over burned out cars or large groups of young men standing in the middle of the street drinking beer.
It may not be politically correct, but here’s a true ancecdote that may be relevant, from a white guy who lived in New York .
In 1984-ish I mailed a registered package to a friend living in New York on the border of Harlem. He warned me never to do it again, because his post office branch (where he had to go to sign for the package) was located in Harlem , 10 blocks north of his apartment, and going there was dangerous.
He told me that just walking into Harlem was dangerous, and became a complex operation. He took no less than 5 friends (all white guys in their 20’s) to walk with him, and they planned in advance how they would behave–no eye contact with the drug dealers who operated openly on the sidewalk outside the post office, no conversation between themselves that might attract attention, and a few other “rules of the street” that New Yorkers apparently took for granted.
I was shocked, and I don’t know if my friend (and his companions) were over-reacting, or being racist, or just behaving normally for 1980’s New York. The situation has changed for the better now.
But if you look scared and out of place they just might screw with you a little because it’s funny. Hey! Yes, you! What the hell are you looking at? You looking at my girl? Hey! HEY!
Bah, you guys missed the best part of town. Try driving down around 13th and Cherry where there isn’t a lawn in sight (mostly broken down cars on the dirt) and make sure you drive slowly down the side streets (like 10th) where you have to stop at a stop sign on every block. Where there are usually large groups of individuals mingling in the intersections or partially blocking your way with some sort of vehicle or an ongoing basketball game.
I diverted around some construction near Washington High and headed down a side street and I was getting the looks and snide comments from a group of youngsters. Something hit my helmet (probably a small stone) as I waited for the intersection to clear. I was anxious to get the hell out of there and I was only a block from the main drag (where little old white ladies walk their dogs down the street). Milwaukee has its bad parts too. I wouldn’t walk at night down the same street I was driving the bike on, no friggin way.
Milwaukee is a very segregated city and I would say that our inner city is as close to a black ghetto as any other city, just not quite as violent on a daily basis.
See - now when I was heading to LA last month and I was going to be driving around I was warned to stay the hell away from Compton because a white girl like me would have big problems in a BAD neighbourhood such as that, even though I was going to be in a local vehicle with local plates.
It was never explaned what the big problems were going to be, just that I would have them.
FWIW, I drove to and from Santa Monica with no trouble whatsoever.
It makes drug dealing and carjackings very convenient but I am not convinced that is why the highway department put them there. I think that people just really notice the stop signs when they really wish they didn’t have to stop.
