Insufficient paranoia.
I may be remembering wrongly, and if I am, please correct me…
…but after the first tape, the Baltimore tape, was released, did I see someone from ACORN say that the filmmakers tried this scam all over the country, and it only worked in Baltimore?
ACORN has no burden to prove its own innocence. Those who want to make accusations have the burden. Let’s see a specific allegation and some specific proof. Sam stone claims there’s “evidence” of something. What is he referring to?
They seem to be correct. The California tape is bullshit, and no other office seems to have taken the bait on the “underage prostitution” thing.
Why would they do that?
I think you’re remembering more or less correctly. As I recall, they said it had been tried at six offices, and only worked in Baltimore.
I think it’s obvious that they tried at far more offices than six, and that far more than one bit. (Even leaving aside San Bernadino.)
I think that ACORN’s calling for an independent investigation of themself is a good thing. I think it’s the only way they can save themselves. They do very good and very useful work, but to have - hell, I dunno - 5% of their offices bite on this is worrisome.
And, frankly, if it turns out that ACORN has institutional problems that require throwing them under the bus, I’ve no problem with that. The good people will move on to other liberal organizations and continue to do good, and the bad people will not. Works for me.
I think that a reasonable person at a place of their employment when approached by someone that wanted to participate in clearly illegal behavior, would want to cover their own ass. I’ve had it drilled into my head more times than I can count, if something seems suspicious: document, document, document.
I would also like to see them release where and when the scammers got “thrown out the door”
I don’t see why they’d need to cover their own ass if there was nothing to cover. Those who showed these scammers the door are not in any jeopardy.
The scammers are the ones who have the tapes.
And I’ll repeat – ACORN has no burden to prove a fucking thing.
If Acorn is making accusation of multiple scam attempts is the burden of proof on them?
Is ACORN alleging any criminal acts?
Your little bitch boy with the camera is the one making the allegations.
Since a few posters apparently have decided that this thread is mainly a link drop, I might as well throw one in as well:
http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/09/17/blogs/coopscorner/entry5318671.shtml
I think Mr. Cooper hits the main points pretty well. Whatever one thinks of O’Keefe and Giles’ little bit of theater, some ACORN staffers have arguably shown remarkably poor judgement, and this has enabled right-wingers to successfully smear the organization with a blanket of shit that will most likely take years to wash away.
Nevertheless, the knee-jerk reaction of Congress to this manfactured ‘scandal’ is nothing less than a joke. After more than a week, the perpetrators of this drama still have yet to provide unedited tapes to anyone; no one, including ACORN itself, can seem to give a straight answer as to at how many offices the scam was attempted; there remains not the slightest shred of evidence that ACORN’s management is guilty of anything more than hiring some staffers with remarkably bad personal judgement, and the only known official investigation by any law enforcement agency launched so far has been a brief check by the San Bernardino police as to whether an ACORN staffer had killed a former husband, which she apparently didn’t, so as far as the San Berdoo PD is concerned, case closed. Lastly, there is a woeful lack of investigation by the media over what clearly seems to be a slam-dunk case of misrepresentation by the filmmakers.
I seriously doubt that members of Congress know anything more about any of this flapdoodle than what they’ve caught in snippets on the news, or in angry letters from constituents. Rarely has so much smoke been generated from so little actual fire, IMO.
ACORN is indeed in jeopardy. It would be helpful if ACORN could demonstrate the documentation that shows that the vast majority of their employees showed the scammers the door.
I can assure you that if someone came to my place of employment and asked me to do something illegal, not only would I tell my boss about it, I’d document it - just in case. But then, my company has a culture of such; a culture of honesty and following the rules, which culture is unculcated in us constantly, without winks. I am rapidly approaching the suspicion that ACORN has no such culture.
People today are media savvy and find the idea that they may end up on some new version of Candid Camera if they play along appealing. The woman who didn’t kill her husband? Expansion: The woman IN CALIFORNIA, home of the movie and TV industries, who didn’t kill her husband? Did she hand Pimp Daddy her 8x10 and resume after the shooting? And the other lady, suggesting alternative job titles, at the conclusion of the taping did she ask where Allen Funt was?
It’s “General Betrayus” and MoveOn all over again. Whiff of a relatively low-wattage scandal and the Dems crumple quicker than paper.
They seem to be alleging multiple scam attempts and failures. Would it hurt anything to release a few of the times and places this happened?
^^Don’t hold your breath
They are alleging nothing criminal. They have no burden to prove anything.
It’s unlikely that exact times would have been documented anyway. There would be no reason to, since it was obvious this guy was not on the level.
Acorn named five citiesat which the filmmakers failed; at two of those, we now know that they did in fact succeed. O’Keefe has said there are more videos to come, so it’s possible that more of those cities will be crossed off the failure list.
Certainly it would seem easy enough for ACORN to have a couple of employees step forward and tell about one of these supposedly numerous failed attempts. Given the waty they’re getting abandoned politically, it’s hard to imagine why they wouldn’t be doing this if they could.
When the first video came out, the immediate (and defensible) cry heard was “isolated incident.” Now we’re up to six and counting. If they tried, say, twenty offices (which we have no reason to believe, but we’ll give ACORN the benefit of the doubt) and found six of them willing to aid and abet crime, that isn’t more damning than if they had gone one-for-one?