Al Gore and Bubba

I want your opinion on a very specific question about Al Gore. What do you think of his decision to stand by Clinton during the Monica scandal and now subtly attack Bubba over it in order to distance himself? During the debate with Bradley last night, Gore apparently agreed Bubba was wrong and then justified his actions by saying he believed his constitutional obligations required him to stay in office through thick and thin. I have a much more cynical view–I say he didn’t want to piss off Bubba and Hillary due to his own political ambitions and that if he had any REAL moral convictions, he would have resigned. Whether you support Clinton or not, it is a fact that he lied under oath at his deposition in the Paula Jones case and before the grand jury and lied to the American people for 8 months about her. What are your thoughts?

KSO…I’m not sure what country you’re operating in, but whatever Bill Clinton may or may not have done (and he does have some of the defining characteristics of Genus Slimeballus, no argument there!), Gore took a separate oath to serve the country as its Vice-President. For him to resign, especially with Clinton facing impeachment, would have been tantamount to abandoning that oath, unless he was convinced that he had in some way violated that oath and that his responsibility to the country was to vacate the office.

Granted, he probably had some strong political reasons behind the particular stance he took. That is not incompatible with being responsible to his oath.

The country has had people with somewhat less than perfect moral character in office before, from all four of the main political parties of their day. And you know something funny? Since the way we choose the President is by democratic election, it happens that people with political aspirations tend to get elected President.

You got a better technique?

I’ve got to go with Poly on this one. By resigning, it wouldn’t have been an issue of abandoning Clinton, but of abandoning his own duties.

I’ve gotta agree with Polycarp on the Al Gore not resigning idea. Even if Al would have viewed that move as a moral obligation, it pretty much would have signaled his end in elected office (at least at that level)
I think Al chose the paths that he viewed as giving him the best chance at being elected.

When Bubba was in trouble but highly popular, stick by him. He will, in turn, get some good poll points from fans of Bill who see Al sticking with him.

Now that Al is on his own and the country is sick of a Clinton White House, it makes sense for him to become distanced from a Clinton and to try and make some statement of moral outrage at Clinton’s behavior. He doesn’t word it too strongly because he wouldn’t want to hack off Democrats or Clinton lovers (he needs their votes).

The change in attitude is basically relying on the ability of the average American voter to have a pretty short term memory when it comes to negatives. And, any time any elected official makes a move just ask yourself “How does that move relate to their poll numbers and electability,” because that is the #1 goal of any politician. Stay in office once you get in office.

Here’s hoping the Gore candidacy remains as sharp as a bag of wet hair.

Here in frog land we always eat our porridge, because it keeps us frogs real peaceful-like.

For the record, I’m a Bradley man all the way, and I resent the republicans stealing my handle to use as a derogatory reference to Slick.

That said, I belive Gore had no idea Clinton was lying, or at least no proof he was. If Gore had resigned and Clinton had been convicted, the speaker of the house would have been president. If not for any other reason, that’s why Gore stuck it out. I’m going to go along with Polycarp on this one too.


Hell, the main reason for a Vice-President is to have a backup man in case the President couldn’t fulfill his duties either through death, illness, or impeachment. It would be a dereliction of office for Gore to jump ship just because Clinton screwed up.

Not that I like Gore… I think he’s Jimmy Carter II. A nice man, but a disaster as a leader. But hey, he was elected.

Clinton was elected. Gore was along for the ride. I doubt many people look at any presidential ticket and think “Neither presidential candidate does much for me, but ______ sure would handle meaningless speeches and handshaking better than the other VP candidate.”

Mull…I take your point. But at least once I’ve been influenced strongly by the VP choice. They do run as a ticket.

And consider: if Strom Thurmond, for example, were to run for President, wouldn’t you look carefully at who his running mate would be? (I can’t think offhand of an elderly Democrat to juxtapose with him, but you get the idea.)

It’s scary to think that Strom Thurmond is third in line for the Presidency.

Nothing I write about any person or group should be applied to a larger group.

  • Boris Badenov

Yeah Poly, you do make a good point. It could change on a ticket by ticket basis. It would take a heck of a weird situation for a Veep choice to influence my voting though. I have only been eligible to vote for 6 years, so I haven’t faced that situation yet. However, as I have studied past elections, I don’t think I would have been affected by those either. But if Jesse Helms were to get on the Republican ticket, I would have to consider abondoning my Republican roots for one vote.

And Boris, I don’t think Strom is 3rd. Pretty sure it would go to Denny Hastert next.

Which makes Hastert 2nd. (Gore is first in line.) I’m not sure who is 3rd – some things I just don’t make an effort to remember. :slight_smile:

David - A big fat “Duh” on my part. I read 3rd in line but didn’t stop to think about what the words actually meant. Time for another nap.


Vice President
Speaker of the House
President Pro Tempore of the Senate
Secretary of State
Attorney General
Health and Human Services
Housing and Urban Development

So yea, the Ancient One is third. Betcha he’s not the “designated survivor” on State of the Union day.
Not sure where Cecil fits into all of this…

Livin’ on Tums, Vitamin E and Rogaine

I used to do that all the time. I argued about who was what place in line with a friend of mine, and finally he got me to say, “The President is first in line for the Presidency”. I didn’t hear the end of that one for a while.

The Secretary of State is 4th in line, the Secretary of the Treasury 5th, etc., in order the Departments were created (with Defense assuming the War Department’s old spot). This makes for a total of 17 people in the line of succession.

They don’t all fly on the same plane…

Nothing I write about any person or group should be applied to a larger group.

  • Boris Badenov

The Secretary of Veteran Affairs is 17th in line. I bet he tells that to his grandkids all the time.

Nothing I write about any person or group should be applied to a larger group.

  • Boris Badenov

The Secretary of State is 4th in line, unless it’s Alexander Haig.