Am I REALLY stealing?

Alright, question time. I guess you can look at this from a moral or legal standpoint.

DirecTV, and those fancy “All Access” Cards.

Basically, I’m a Canadian. The CRTC (Canadian Radio and Television Council - I think) Broacasting laws say, as a Canadian, i’m not allowed to be subjected to un-regulated broadcasts (IE DirecTV). Also, as a Canadian, I’m unable to subscribe to DirecTV.

It’s legal to buy the equipment, legal to owen the equipment, legal to use the equipment, but illegal to subject myself to the resulting information. (sounds close to communist propaganda if you ask me)

Since I am able to obtain the equipment (through purely legal means) am I really STEALING/PIRATING it?

Can anyone give me any parelled situations?

PS: My facts may be way off, as I haven’t researched this matter. Perhaps you can inform me otherwise.

Yes. You’re stealing and you’re being very very naughty.

Just kidding. Hey, if DirecTv wants your money, they can deal with the Canadian government so that they can be allowed to accept Canadian subscribers.

If it’s as you say, it looks like you’re not stealing, you’re just accessing something you shouldn’t. It’d only be stealing if it was legal for you to get it but you got it without paying. The closest I can think of is if somebody had a bowl of cigarettes out on the counter that he took from a box of tax-stamp-free (i.e., illegally imported) cigarettes, and you took some of them. The cigarettes themselves aren’t obviously illegal (they look just like ones that came into the country with a tax stamp on the package), you just didn’t pay the tax for them.

Okay, that’s not a very good example. Anyway. Not stealing. Just accessing something the government says you should pay for but can’t figure out how to make you pay for it, like internet porn. Oooh! That’s a MUCH better example…

let’s see, you’re taking something that some one else produces as a product that they sell, and not compensating them for it. Does that make it easier to see? The fact that it’s not for sale legally where you reside is immaterial (unless you’re attempting to say that you have a basic right to have this).

The only similar things I can think of -have to do with ‘intellectual propoerty’ or artistic designs or something like that, where some one has their own product/ talent, and you obtain benefit from that product w/o compensating them or anyone else.

but that’s just MHO.

I think that “Intellectual Property” is a bad example. After all, The broadcast themselves, are not property of DirecTV. DirecTV is merely providing a service, repackaging, if you will, the property of others.

In terms of whether or not the owners of the property care or not, I highly doubt it. I’m still being subjected to all their advertising, thus still connected to their revenue generation.

And yes, I do access a service they provide without paying for it … but the thing is … they woudln’t be able to MAKE me pay for it, thus they are not loosing any revenue.

What a pickle.

how about: you live next to the drive in theater. You’re on ‘house arrest’ and not allowed to stray more than 25 feet from your house. However, you purchase (legally) audio equipment which allows you to amplify the sound at the nearby drive in enough for you to hear, and you can sit on your front porch and see/hear the movie.

Or, way back in when I was in high school, the ‘favored’ beer was Coors (what can I say?) , but it wasn’t sold locally. Did that mean, that if a Coors truck drove through my neighborhood and a case fell off, I would be justified in keeping it?

Anyhow. Even if I can’t come up with a ‘similar’ enough situation, IMHO, it’s stealing. You’re obtaining something for which others pay $$ and you aren’t paying. You asked, that’s my answer. You’re free, of course to do what you will.

lol, well … the situations are still not close enough to convince me.

In the drive in case, I agree it’s wrong because you could head to the drive in and give them your 10 bux to get in. By purchasing the equipment you are in essence depriving them of the 10 bux you would pay to see the movie. What if you were BANNED from the drive in for some silly reason. You woudlnt’ be able to pay for admissions regardless. But now, by using the equipment you are not depriving them of any revenue (and your not violating any laws for that matter either).

In the case of the coors truck, by keeping the rogue case of beer your are in fact depriving COORS of the revenue that would have been gained if that case had been purchased by an eligible customer.

heh, i’m still in the grey here.

This reminded me of the farmers who were forced to pay royalities to the company that sold genetically modified corn. The farmers didn’t plant that modified corn, it had been planted in an adjacent field and the wind blew the pollen onto their crops. They didn’t even use the seed but they still had to pay.

What’s next? If I produce oxygen can I charge you for using it?

The airwaves belong to the people. Any airwave signal is fair game for interception. I say freedom of the speech (out) goes hand in hand with freedom of recievers (in.)

Similarly, if I can have any type of telephone in my home hooked to the telephone line than I can any type of reciever in my home hooked to the cable signal.

Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. It is NOT illegal, and the courts have twice now thrown cases like yours out of court. (In BC and Ontario.)

It is technically illegal for an American firm to SELL you the dish and decoded. It is not illegal for you to use the, although Bell and ExpressVu like to make it sound as if it is.

You are stealing nothing and breaking no laws.

You guys are missing the point. The reason why DirecTV is not legal for sale in Canada is that due to the typical stupid Canadian protectionism laws and restrictions requiring minimum Canadian content, Hughes just said screw it, you canucks can put up your OWN sattelites. And the Canadians said they would. But as far as I know, they never did.
I wish you guys would get your OWN damn DirecTV sattelites, and then DirecTV can drop your lame channels (like TRIO) off our system.

There are two Canadian services now, actually, ExpressVu and Starchoice. They’re pretty good; the prices and volume of content are very competitive, and of course the quality of the signal is amazing. Incidentally, I have absolutely no idea what TRIO is. It’s not on my service and I’m in Canada! Are you sure it’s Canadian?

The fact is, however, that it is legal for a Canadian to use an American service, and always has been. Every effort to make it illegal has been heaved out of court with gales of laughter. The Canadian providers have done a very good job of convincing people otherwise by twisting the facts and pounding their drums, but they have no leg to stand on.