Once again, music lyrics provide the answer! In this case, Midnight Oil . Peter Garret would so kick your jingoistic ass if you said those words in his hearing - and he’s an 8ft tall bald-headed Ozzie MP…
I seem to recall that your entry to this board was a barrage of whining about the UK. Care to practice what you preach?
Yes, you’re right for the most part.
I have a guarded support for the war, and unlike chowder, I don’t pretend my views are anything other than political. They’re every bit as political as your anti-war views are, and I make no claim to the moral high ground on that score. What I am saying is that the anniversary isn’t about the war. You want to bitch about the war, hell have a bitchfest every year on the anniversary of the invasion of Iraq. This anniversary is about the World Trade Centre, not the war. Sure, the two are linked, but they became linked after the people in the WTC lost their lives. Just a brief time out from the ongoing five year-old debate is all I’m suggesting. Debate traffic laws in Iowa or something. If only for one day a year. You don’t need to stand to attention weeping at a rose-covered memorial or anything if you don’t want to (presidents, idiot or otherwise, are paid to do that). Just backing off for a day is all - or at least keeping the war and the WTC separate.
You have, of course, communicated the same message to President Bush?
And chowder brought the war up, linking the two just as surely as our president has. So I assume it’s just an oversight that you haven’t apologized yet to Scoundrel Swanswater for accidently quoting him rather than chowder in your post lambasting people for politicking on this occasion. And it’s also an oversight that you haven’t registered your disgust with the Bush administration, first for using the World Trade Center attacks as a false justification for this war, and then for continuing to try to link the two even after the evidence unequivocally showed that Sadam Hussein had no connection to the event. Right?
I mean, you wouldn’t want to be a hypocrite about this. You been talkin’ so purdy and principled, I’d hate for it to come out that that’s only talk.
Thank you, chowder. That was a very nice post, and much appreciated.
That is so not what you said.
There is a big difference between “don’t criticize this on the day of 9/11 out of respect”, which I can somewhat relate to although I don’t necesarily agree, and “you can’t criticize your own government!! Get out of America, you communist !!”.
You are really a sorry person and intellectually dishonest as well.
Good luck living in your narrowminded little world.
Let me thank you, too, chowder, for your patriotic and uplifting post. I hope you’ll try to understand that you posted it in a forum full of rabid political malcontents, alarmists and Chicken Littles who in no way mirror the point of view of the majority of Americans, and this is why you’re coming in for so much grief.
This is where they come to cry and wail and declare that the sky is falling because thus far they haven’t had much success getting their way come election time, and they believe with all their might that the country is going to hell in a handbasket because they aren’t in charge.
I, on the other hand, thank my lucky stars that they aren’t in charge and that we actually have someone in office who will undertake the difficult and painful steps necessary to deal with the problem of terrorism forcefully and proactively, rather than helplessly wringing their hands and doing nothing because to try to do something is going to strike someone, somewhere, as being wrong, and as good liberals it is of paramount importance not to be perceived as doing something that could be considered wrong, even if it means you have to stand by and do nothing while nuclear weapons find their way into your cities and people die by the hundreds of thousands. Better that, than for us to, you know, use force or anything to prevent it.
This is why people such as Carter and Clinton and Kerry, et. al are so impotent. They can’t come up with ways to deal with problems that someone, somewhere won’t disapprove of – thus calling their good liberal credentials into question – and so they flail about trying to appear to be taking action by seeking endless resolutions from the equally impotent U.N., or by trying to find ways to impose sanctions, or by issuing empty threats that fool no one.
If Clinton and his team had had the foresight and gumption that the Bush team has, none of this would be going on right now because bin Laden would have been toast in 1998.
More like Carter actively supporting the Shah
- and it would have helped if some people had bothered to work out why the Russians were concerned about Afghanistan.
It did not require hindsight to avoid this mess, we knew what it was about in 1979
Rriigghhtt, none of this would be going on.
Really think those bastards wouldn’t have flown the planes into the towers if bin Laden was dead,
really think the other bastards will stop when bin Laden is dead?
Getting bin Laden then, or now, is not about prevention,
or revenge.
It’s supposed to be about justice.
CMC fnord!
BTW, Thanks RedFury, Samuel Clemens taught me what it meant to be a real patriot.
A patriot knows when to be ashamed of his country.
(Mark Twain’s indignation)
Thanks to ** John C o M ** and also to ** Starving Artist** together with the few that saw my post in the light it was intended.
To those who chose to turn my thread into a Bush/Blair and I-hate-America fest all I can say to you is “There but for the Grace of God go I”
At the risk of repeating myself my original post stands with minor alterations which you will be aware of.
Let me put you straight.
- I never called or even implied anyone was a communist.
- It is you not I who is the sorry person.
- “That is not so what you said” is ungrammatical, you are intellectually hampered.
- My narrowminded world suits me admirably, I’ll just stop here and watch while you slip steadily down the path to self righteous ignomony.
That is all, I’ve said all I have to say in this thread but you may continue spouting your vitriol for as long as you wish.
You already said that, 27 hours ago.
See ya soon 
So… umm…
I’ve said that it would be good if people could take a short break from their politics (on both sides) to remember 9/11 (or even if they don’t give a shit about 9/11, out of courtesy to those who do) - ie. no politicking. But on the other hand, you want me to do something actively political like emailing the White House or somesuch, and if I don’t, I’m being a hypocrite?
Uh huh.
No I did not you stupid man.
I said if it went to the pit don’t expect don’t expect any posts from me in it.
…what is it they say about the Irish?
Your post was clear. You intended to make a political argument disguised as a memorial to the people who died on September 11, 2001. The fact that some people are so shamelessly partisan that they supported you in such an argument demonstrates the moral bankruptcy of the Republican Party today. The idea of seizing upon a tragedy of this magnitude in order to pursue a political agenda is simply disgusting. You should truly reconsider whether you are indeed the sort of person who does such things.
And if you really think that disagreeing with our administration counts as “hating America”, then thank goodness you are not an American. It’s difficult to think of anything more antithetical to the United States of America and the beliefs it was founded upon to try to silence opposing views with spurious accusations that those views are based upon hatred for our country. Patriotism, in the democratic system under which the United States operates, requires that those who oppose what the government is doing be permitted to sleep. You do not love the United States. Starving Artist does not love the United States. Loving the United States and working against the democratic principles our country is based upon are fundamentally incompatible.
No, I meant that you should register it here. Because so far, you have continued to maintain that people who don’t share your views are being “political”, and pretty words to the contrary aside, you have yet to redirect your ire to where it belongs - to chowder for starting this thread to continue the politicking surrounding 9/11 and to the Bush administration for greedily seeing 9/11 as the great opportunity to advance their political agenda. You have shown that you don’t really believe what you’re saying - you think only certain political views shouldn’t be shared on the anniversary of the event. Those views you agree with, you consider a worthy topic of discussion. That’s just sad.
Sorry, but this is just getting weirder and more surreal.
You called my failure to register my dismay with the Bush administration an “oversight”. You may not have considered the possibility that I may not want to because my political opinions are not the same as yours. I accept your political views and respect your right to hold them. I do not consider you stupid or defective for holding them. You don’t return that respect. That’s fine. But now you’re accusing me of saying only certain political views should be expressed on the 9/11 anniversary. Pot, kettle, etc. This on top of saying I’m a hypocrite if I don’t do the um… opposite of what I say. It’s also factually wrong. I for one would be extremely heartened to see an anti-war group turn up at Ground Zero to pay their respects to the people that died. Maybe they have done so - I don’t know. It would be probably a good thing for your cause. Please don’t assume you know what I’m thinking better than I do. If you want to know, just ask and 'll tell you my opinions honestly.
Apologies for over-quoting. An oversight. Please refer to the last paragraph only.
And yes, let me state on the record that I think Chowder was out of line (if well-intentioned) in starting this thread. Will that do?
You’re quite right, I did read that wrong.
What is they say about the Irish BTW? I’m interested.
I’d guess you’re trying to hint at the whole stupid Irish thing. Maybe the whole Anglo-Saxon thing did indicate that you hold certain views that may be a bit too nationalistic IYKWIM.
Seriously fill me in?