Well, there’s no evidence that anyone has been run through a plastic shredder yet, is there?
Hey, look! We’re right back to talking about the torture stupidity!
Whoopee! :rolleyes:
The prison abuse scandal has zero, ZERO, to do with this latest atrocity.
Al Qaeda have repeatedly demonstrated that they are a band of vicious, murderous thugs. They don’t need any news reasons to murder innocent people in cold blood.
At the same time, this outrageous brutality does nothing to excuse or mitigate the guilt of those responsible for mistreating the prisoners in Al Ghraib.
Does the existence of a serial killers mean that police brutality is justified?
Does police brutality encourage serial killers?
A horrible crime has been committed. I hope that Berg’s killers are tracked down and punished for their actions as swiftly as possible. Frankly, hanging is too good for them.
I also hope that the perpetrators of the far lesser crime of prisoner abuse are punished as well. In a manner that is proportional to their crimes.
When did simple justice become a matter for debate?
Care to provide a cite for the bolded bits?
Anyway, everyone knows that the best way to rebuild a country is to… uh… wave a magic wand and hope it happens all by itself. That way, no actual people are necessary. :rolleyes:
5 time champ: While what they did might not stack up to some of Saddam’s deeds, we’re supposed to be the good guys here, or at least adhere to the Geneva Convention. It’s been a month or two since we went through a briefing on the GC, but I don’t remember humiliation, assault or buggery with Snap-Lites to be allowed on enemy POWs.
Well, you can believe that, but it still won’t help the black Muslims being “ethnically cleansed” by the white Arabs in the Sudan.
I’m one of the dumbest motherfuckers you’ve ever seen? Listen to me you hysterical brain dead waste of human skin, All I ever asked for is proof. I have been proven wrong in the past and admitted it, because, frankly, I’d rather know the truth than hold onto a falsehood to spare my ego, but I am NOT going to jump on every fucking knee jerk bandwagon that wanders down the street, just because it happens to have a loudspeaker trumpeting what I want to hear. You on the other hand are the board poster child for situational hissey fits, nothing Israel ever does is wrong, while even the hint of a possibility of an American behaving improperly and you’re screaming “boil them in oil” from the battlements. As for the alligations of rape, sodomy, murder, etc…, when they have been properly investigated, and charges brought, I’ll be the first to champion the cause of locking them up for the rest of their natural born lives when they are found guilty. Until them, I am not going to irresponsibly state that peope are guilty of heinous crimes simply because an accusation has been leveled against them and it happens to jibe with the political axe I want to grind. It’s called being objective and judging situations based upon facts, not simply FLYING OFF THE HANDLE simply to fuel your rightous indignation and briefly feel alive instead of all rotten inside.
I went to middle school with Nick Berg. I haven’t seen him since we graduated 8th grade, but he had been a friend of mine. I can’t believe this has happened to him.
He was a really nice kid, very funny and smart. It figures that he’d want to go to Iraq and help out. This is just terrible.
He was Jewish:
Yes you are.
The difference here is this.
You sit around and wait for Bush admin to be proven wrong, which usually happens after they can no longer ignore the truth, or reality.
We already know this idiot and his admin are running the country through the mud, and are trying our best, despite your complete ignorance, to steer us off this “path of the damned”.
I already know this torture business is a lot worse then we’ve even fathomed. The fact that the Bush admin is huddling, probably running market research to determine which course of action will minimize the effect in the polls, reinforces my distrust.
This admin is lying to us, and they have done nothing to convince me otherwise.
Oh Weirddave, shutthefuckup, you ignorant sack of shit. You didn’t ask for proof, you demanded proof and then expected a retraction – as if you haven’t been reading or watching the goddamn news this past fucking week, you stupid moron. You KNOW the evidence that’s out there, but you just froth at the fucking pie hole for every opportunity to follow me around and fling your monkey feces. I’d tell you to kiss my ass but I’d have to spend the next 6 months getting disinfected. Rot off, asshole.
[QUOTE=WeirddaveAs for the alligations of rape, sodomy, murder, etc…, when they have been properly investigated, and charges brought, I’ll be the first to champion the cause of locking them up for the rest of their natural born lives when they are found guilty. Until them, I am not going to irresponsibly state that peope are guilty of heinous crimes simply because an accusation has been leveled against them and it happens to jibe with the political axe I want to grind. It’s called being objective and judging situations based upon facts, not simply FLYING OFF THE HANDLE simply to fuel your rightous indignation and **briefly feel alive instead of all rotten inside.[/QUOTE]
So in your world, nothing bad happens unless and until somebody gets convicted of commiting the bad act?
Shit, weren’t you one of the guys yelling about how we had to invade Iraq so we could end all those terrible human rights abuses? And now you pull this weak-ass cop-out crap?
Disgusting.
Libertarian, thank you for your answer to my query if we pulled out.
But I’d like some more detail.
What does it would turn into total chaos mean?
Anarchy?
Another despot rising up?
Less terrorism?
Less money spent on military?
How can Iraq be saved?
What I posted was a very short and polite rant, directed at no one, about how sad it was that this act couldn’t just be decried without the typical SDMB Pit stunts and drama. That there couldn’t be some level of people just feeling the brutality of a man slaughtered like a hog. Likely the full video will get out and be viewed by his family and loved ones, at some point.
I felt that sometimes, some events just need people to get together and say that for the sake of being and acting human and having morals “this is a terrible act, the people who did this specific act are monsters, and we mourn for the torture and brutal loss of human life”.
No one is ignorant of the politics and other underlying events. No one can be. This board has fostered a new thread about Iraq nearly every 2 hours like clockwork for 2 or more years now.
If my count is right at least three people have painfully either completely missed my point, or read a whole lot more into it. Since this is seemingly difficult, I will put it in one sentence - It would be nice for people to mourn the event without their usual political axe-grinding, if even for just a few, brief hours. It’s not like the weightier issues haven’t been discussed in 1000 threads in the past year, and will be discussed in 1000 more.
OK, that’s two sentences.
Plan A: Pull out of Iraq
Upside: Saves lives of soldiers, and millions of $.
Downside: General turmoil and mayham in Iraq, leading to a whole lot of gruesome deaths. (Sort of as it were before we started the war!)
Plan B: Stay in Iraq and fight to the death.
Upside: Bush wins election (wait…is that an upside?) I meant…stability and peace.
Downside: McDonald’s pop up everywhere, and the Iraq population stops worrying about death by guns and starts thinking about carbohydrates. Oh, and lots of American soldiers dying bloody deaths.
That’s my rant for the night, guys.
Well yes, because we had pictures of the terrible tortures Saddam Hussein perpetrated against the Iraqi people and everything. Oh wait, no we didn’t. The testimony of the tormented Iraqis was good enough for Dave then, but seems to be entirely suspect now – in spite of the fact that we do have photographic evidence!
He’s also one of the pie holes who insisted that the word of the Commander in Thief and his cronies, like Rummycakes, was good and holy – they wouldn’t lie to us, you know. But when I take Rummycakes’ word for the heinousness of the crimes he personally witnessed images of, well, I’m kneejerking my political axe. Did Rummy finally wise up and abandon the GOP for the Dems while I wasn’t looking? Or is Dave just a hypocritical ass? I think I’ll take door number 2.
Disgusting, indeed.
Go fuck yourself with a rotten goat penis you diseased old cunt. You fling unproven accusations and then attack and insult me when I ask for proof. You are the syphilitic offspring of a dying baboon and your mother getting the only sex she ever had. I hope you spend decades in a nursing home, retaining just enough awareness to realize that you’re sitting in your own shit, and nobody, nobody is visiting, ever.
Not at all, if you would bother to read what I wrote, I said:“when they have been properly investigated, and charges brought, I’ll be the first to champion the cause of locking them up for the rest of their natural born lives when they are found guilty.” You think I should advocate locking them up before they are found guilty of anything? Why minty, that’s positively totalitarian of you. I’m not coping out of anything, I’m demanding due process of law. I thought that’s what you bleeding heart types were big on: Fair trials, demanding proof before acting, etc. Why the change of heart now?
Interesting. The actions of a few soldiers are Bush’s fault. The fact that G.W. has publicly apologised for the atrocities means nothing. The fact that the military is court marshalling the guilty means nothing. The fact that these acts have been condemed roundly by the entire administration means nothing. Nope, it’s all Bush’s fault.
Tell me, cany you see more than one letter on the keyboard at a time with those blinders on? Christ, I’m not even a Bush supporter and I think you sound like an idiot. How about laying blame where it belongs, squarely at the feet of those soldirs who committed these terrible acts, huh?
Oh, and Shayna, reguarding your latest diarrhea, show me one post where I said we should “take Bush’s word” for anything. Or Rumsfeld’s. Or anyone in the administration’s. You can’t because I never said that. Hypocritical my ass. What’s hypocritical is that you’re all for attacking terrorists if they look cross eyed at Israel, but when they cut off the head of an American civilian, well, he had it coming. You are benieth contempt.
Oh, and I demand that you cough up proof of this lie (impossible) or retract immediately! Prove that I feel anything other than exactly what I said in this post, that “there are many actions of today’s Israel that I oppose, also… You don’t have to like the way [Israel’s] fighting (I don’t always like it either),” or that I ever, ever suggested boiling anyone in oil, let alone at the slightest hint of impropriety, merely because they’re American.
Lying sack of shit. You sully this message board with your presence.
Whew! You’d think, from the sound of these comments, that we were right up there in the action. Since we’re not… .let’s think about those who have given their lives.