I’m a college professor in biology. My wife is a physician in general internal medicine. We have one child. We are all natural-born American citizens.
We would like to move to England permanently. We haven’t lined up jobs but my wife, at least, should be able to find employment fairly easily prior to going there.
How likely is it that we could move there and not have to return? I wouldn’t like to move there if the odds are that we’d have to return within a few years. But we would really love to live there. We’re willing to renounce American citizenship if required (but we’d prefer not to).
You’ll need to check here for details of practicing medicine in the UK. That being said, we have foreign doctors from all over in our unit all the time.
You don’t have to renounce your US citizenship to get UK citizenship.
Hmm…a bit sobering. Sounds like docs aren’t quite as in demand in the UK as they are in the US. I guess they don’t restrict the supply as much in the UK as they do in the US…wise, but a pain in my butt!
I hate to do this in GQ, but I’m posting this with the disclaimer that you should verify everything I say via UK government channels. As a starter there is:
If you (or your wife) can find a job, it may be possible to immigrate. The rules may be different for highly skilled people like doctors, but in general an employer must be able to show that they can’t find a qualified British or EU citizen before they can offer the job to someone from outside the EU. I repeat that different rules may apply for some professions. Having a job in advance may well be critical. There used to be a system called the “Highly Skilled Migrant Programme” that allowed people like doctors and other professionals to enter without having a job lined up, but I believe the Home Office is phasing that out.
If your family were granted visas, there would be no particular urgency about becoming UK citizens. In general, you would be able to apply for citizenship after 5 years of legal residence in the UK, provided that the last year or two involved no restrictions on your stay - what used to be called ILR (Indefinite Leave to Remain - sort of like a Green Card in the USA).
At this point, I’d say don’t worry about the citizenship thing. It would be a few years in the future. As already noted, you would not have to renounce your US citizenship in order to become a citizen of the UK.
One big employer and a few small ones - BUPA is the major private health contractor, but there were others, and presumably still are. The government’s policies have made it very easy for foreign-trained (read: from the Indian subcontinent) doctors to go there for further education, and a lot of them wind up staying. That’s why I’m a British citizen - both my parents are doctors, and they moved to Britain shortly before my birth. The crux of this is that doctors in Britain are plentiful and relatively underpaid; it’s one of a few lucky circumstances that keeps the NHS from collapsing.
I would suggest that if you haven’t lived in the UK before, you not do anything rash like renouncing your US citizenship (although if you were all born stateside you retain your permanent right of abode anyway.) Not that you have to, of course; it’s just that Britain, while mostly similar to the US, is very different in a few ways.
In your shoes, I would certainly rule out moving unless at least one of you has lined up a job first. Adjusting to a new home country is hard enough without simultaneously searching for a job.
You (singular) should have a very easy time finding a job at a private secondary (high) school, if not in higher education.
Also bear in mind that British doctors aren’t paid as much as American ones, so if your wife has significant med school debt, it might be much more difficult to pay it off on a UK salary.
The government’s incompetent tinkering with the system has recently produced too many British junior doctors chasing not enough places in the system. This has resulted in many leaving to find work, principally for Australia and Canada.
See http://www.talk.uk-yankee.com/ for other US expats living in Britain
Come to Scotland - we have irn bru, moray cup, deep fried mars bars and haggis running free in our fields!
As GilaB said the pay for doctors here isnt as good as the US but you can still afford a decent house and a good lifestyle. Before you make the final arrangements just do plenty of research in terms of the area that you move - does it have good respectable schools. Also Im sure that various universities for example may have better biology depts so that could be a factor of where you relocate. Good luck with getting things sorted and please do let us know what you decide and how you get on.
A general is emerging for me here…it seems that one of the tragedies of my life is that I am a born European who happens to have been actually born in the US. Not that the US is terrible, but what I value in life is much more prevalent in Europe that in the US. It’s sad that we humans have drawn lines in the dirt to keep each other out.
Realistically life in England probably wouldn’t be as great as I imagine it, and my options here in the US certainly could be a lot worse. Nobody need ever feel sad for me. But I know I’ll always be a little bitter that the state of the world is such that living in England would entail more sacrifice than it would be worth.
By the way, if anyone’s interested, this site does a pretty good job of summing up the kind of environment I’m searching for. [Moderate obnoxiousness warning for the site, but it’s better than it looks at first glance].
Don’t be too negative. American academics join UK universities all the time - I guess it depends whether your speciality is in demand. If anything your wife may have more of a problem. As others have noted she will be competing with a lot of other Doctors for the good jobs - there are always plenty of locum and agency jobs. I don’t know how much a Dr earns in the States these days but a General Practitioner would expect 100k GBP or more and a top hospital consultant can earn up to 170k GBP in the NHS - and I bet the insurance premiums are lower!
According to the Google currency converter the exchange rate is nearly 2 GBP to 1 USD, making 100k well above average general practitioner salaries in the US…promising?
The problem is that here in the US academics get paid crap and the job market is tough, so I generally operate on the assumption that my wife will be paying the bills and I’ll be working for fun. This may not apply to the UK…
You can only use that figure if you’re saving all that money and moving back. Most goods and services cost about the same in Britain in pounds as they do stateside in dollars.
For example, a new Ford Focus is ~$15,000 in the US; a new Ford Focus is ~£15,000 in Britain.
As usual, the average is deceiving. On my job track (starting prof at a small liberal arts college) the starting salary is unlikely to exceed $50000. Not horrible, but certainly not to support a family comfortably considering the elevated cost of living in the UK.
Oh, and I have no intention of staying someplace like NC (see the website I linked to above if you’re interested why).
Humm - I would actually think that you would have a fairly easy time finding work in the UK. Certainly University Collge London has a large health sciences department - depending on your research focus you could be highly in demand.
However, if the UK is looking less appealing you could certainly move to Vancouver, Canada. Your wife would have no problem setting up a very lucrative practice, UBC has an excellent research reputation - again depending on your focus you could find an excellent niche, and it’s certainly walkable. It has fantastic transit, and is very bike friendly - the climate is quite temperate, although the winters tend to be rainy. You could consider it anyway. With both of your degrees you would be welcomed with open arms into Canada.
I think the main problem that you’ll have is that England is a huge target for immigration to the EU. There are plenty of other EU countries that really need doctors badly and will make it easier for you.
Think about it. Everyone from India who wants to go to the EU is going to want to try the UK first because of cultural ties and possible family. I think the UK being such a big draw will naturally have all of it’s national labor shortages filled by people from their ex-colonies pretty quickly. And if I’m not mistaken they have priority over those like us who overthrew the king!
But certain groups of people with in-demand jobs are given priority in many countries.
If you’re so hell-bent into getting into the UK at any cost, you could possibly go to Belgium first. There they only require you to be a resident for 3 years before giving you a freaking Belgian passport. Then you can move to the UK if you want.
Also you might want to consider Ireland. I have no idea on their need for doctors though. Remember though that you could be the one to get the visa too. The basic plan after that would be to continue to work there until you were there long enough to apply for naturalization. This varies from country to country, so you might want to see into that.
On an unrelated note:
I understand the desire to leave the country. There’s a lot of stuff that’s just messed up in general. I’ve lived in Europe for four years. But you have to understand that the UK has it’s share of problems too. I hope you like soccer, first of all, because a big part of people’s lives over there revolve around it. There’s plenty of things to complain about in the UK just like in the US. And really I think we’re on the verge of something good as a nation. I have a feeling that rising gas prices will be a very good thing for the country because we’ll finally pick ourselves up out of this mess we’ve gotten ourselves into.
Really?? I love Vancouver. We just came from 11 joyous years in Seattle, I miss the mild weather and don’t mind the clouds. I am going to look in to this.
is emerging for me here…it seems that one of the tragedies of my life is that I am a born European who happens to have been actually born in the US. Not that the US is terrible, but what I value in life is much more prevalent in Europe that in the US. It’s sad that we humans have drawn lines in the dirt to keep each other out.