American foodstuffs - a few questions

Them’s fightin’ words…my family, from Austin with roots in the Panhandle, would consider no such thing. Now, here’s the way we do barbecue, which with us means brisket.

First, make a spice rub:

(nb: one US tablespoon = approx. 15 ml)
6 tablespoons salt
3 tablespoons black pepper
2 tablespoons MSG
2 tablespoons garlic powder
2 tablespoons ground bay leaves
(about 15 g whole leaves)
1 tablespoon paprika
2 tablespoons dry mustard

Grind bay leaves in blender or food processor, then add all other ingredients. Keeps for years in refrigerator or freezer.

Then, get a nice, evenly cut boneless brisket, no smaller than 5 lb (2.3 kilos) - don’t even think of using one that’s smaller. You’ll need one that’s got some marbling and a good layer of fat on one side - much of which will cook off).

Slice garlic cloves (you’ll need at least a bud’s worth) into about 1/4" (2-3mm) thicknesses. With a small knife, poke holes about 1" (2.5cm) apart and about halfway into the brisket. Force one or two garlic slices into each hole. Make sure to put garlic at all depths of the meat, on both sides.

Now, rub the spice mixture generously over the whole brisket. Insert brisket into plastic zipper or garbage bag, then refrigerate at least 24 hours (preferably 48).

Slow barbecuing is easiest with a rectangular grill, rather than a Weber kettle - preferably a model with a thermometer set into the lid, so you don’t have to open it very often. (I think there are also electronic thermometers that work remotely.) The goal: you’re going to make a fire (charcoal is best) that’s about 200 to 210 degrees farenheit (94-99 celsius), and keep it there for 6-8 hours. (about 1.5 hours per pound/half kilo).

Now, the very very best thing is to have some mesquite or hickory chips available, about 1 1/2 lb (700 g). Soak in cold water for at least 1 hour before you set the fire. (My grandfather is endlessly amused that people pay for mesquite, which grows - rapidly - on his land as a noxious weed.)

Make the fire, then move the bricquets to either side of the grill. Add about 1/4 of the soaked wood chips, if you have them. Set the brisket, fat side up, on an aluminum foil pan (or you can make one with heavy-grade foil) set on the cooking grate. Baste the brisket from time to time with the fat and juices that accumulate in the pan. If using charcoal, add 10 to 12 fresh coals per side every hour and toss more wood chips on the fresh coals. (Add about 1/2 cup/250 ml chips per side every time you replenish the coals.)

After 5 hours or so, you may want to wrap the brisket in foil, especially if you’re fire’s been running a little hot. The interior temperature you’re looking for is about 165 farenheit/74 celsius.

When you remove it from the grill, let it rest at least 15 minutes before serving. Slice thinly across the grain.

Oh yeah, there’s the ice cream, too, but I mean just frozen Snickers. And yes, they might kill your teeth, but they die happy.

To correct a misconception, there are two kinds of Chicago-style pizza. The older, more traditional Chicago style is deep dish, with a very thick crust. This is what most of the US calls Chigago-style. (Beware of bad deep dish–in unskilled hands it’s often a big, underbaked blob of dough with with the bare minimum of toppings.)

However, pizza in Chicago itself has evolved beyond deep dish to stuffed pizza. Stuffed pizza is a 2-to-3 inch deep pizza which consists mainly of cheese and toppings, often with a second crust on top. It’s incredibly dense, incredibly filling, and incredibly tasty. (It can also be quite expensive, due to the high cheese & filling to crust ratio.)

You can also get Milky Way and Three Musketeers bars frozen.

Cheeze Whiz is an artificially flavored spread. It’s soft and smooth, and doesn’t quite taste like real cheese, but I find it tolerable if you just don’t have any cheese (and its fairly cheap). I think children like it more than adults do. It can be spread on crackers or sandwiches, or melted and poured over pasta or vegetables.

If you make your own shakes, you can have a malted ----- put in a few spoonsful of Horlick’s into a chocolate shake (of the thick, ice creamy variety.) Wonderful!

On the Snickers/Marathon issue: I was going to bring that up. When I was over there years ago, the Marathon bar was sold in a wrapper with the exact same color scheme and font as our Snickers bar. I never bothered to buy one and try it out, because I sure wasn’t going to waste my money on American candy when there was all the GOOD stuff to explore. (My theory at the time was that they avoided calling it “Snickers” in the UK because it sounded too much like “knickers” and they didn’t want to give 8 year old boys something to laugh about.) It seemed strange to me because, indeed, I had known the Marathon bar as the braided chocolate covered caramel bar (like the Curlie Wurlie)

Sadly, that is what MOST people in the US think the term barbecue means as well. In North Carolina, we know that barbecue is a NOUN, and not a VERB. :stuck_out_tongue: It refers to pork, cooked slowly over a fire (usually a hickory wood fire), typically served chopped with a vineagar and pepper based sauce. There is a dividing line down the middle of the state; the people on the western half of the state typically add a bit of tomato in their vinegar based sauce, but in the east, they are purists who insist on the vinegar and pepper sauce. It is served with slaw and hushpuppies (cornbread batter, sometimes flavored with a bit of finely chopped onion, deep fat fried.) The event of cooking this up is referred to a pig pickin’.

(North Carolinians use the terms “cooking out” or “grilling out” to refer to cooking meat outdoors. If it’s hamburgers and hot dogs, it’s NOT barbecue!)

By the way: I, too, read your name as “Man get out” when I first saw it in a different thread. When I saw you as the OP of a food thread, though, the French pronunciation immediately jumped out at me — I didn’t even realize that you were the same poster until someone else pointed out the alternate reading!

Great thread!

I thought so
Over here we have apples that are sold only for cooking - the difference is that they are always too tart (for most people) to eat raw and they are huge, each fruit may weigh up to a pound. Bramley’s Seedling is the favourite.
Occasionally though, I use dessert apples for a pie and just use a little less sugar.
Interestingly, with Golden delicious*, the only thing I think they are fit for is gently stewing (no sugar) and eating cold with ice cream.

*The further north Golden Delicious is grown, the more the fruits resemble Granny Smith, I think the pale soft watery fruits are just what you get if you grown them in warm temperate zones.

Actually, there are baking apples that are larger than eating apples, the most common variety is called Rome, but here’s the rub, they are NOT good pie apples – too bland. They are good for making baked apples, pretty much. Rome apples are incredibly bland and taste pretty yucky raw. IMHO, the best pie apples are Northern Spy.

A new English “chip shop” opened in my neighborhood! (The only thing missing now from my nabe is an Argentinian BBQ restaurant). My husband and I had the battered cod and chips. They were not much different from the “good” fish and chips we usually get. The shepards pie was made with ground beef, which surprised me. There’s an Irish pub in Queens that makes the pie with cubed lamb— it’s to die for.

My daughter had chicken curry and chips. The curry was really, really sweet. And it had tomatoes in it. Different from both the Carribean and Indian curries I’m used to.

The thing that caught my eye-- and my son’s 'cause he ordered it-- was on the “pudding” menu. Are all desserts “puddings” in England? Anyways, my son ordered the Deep Fried Mars Bar. Are these batter-dipped, fried, powder sugar covered heart attacks on a plate popular in England?

Definitely Lamb mince for shepherd’s pie, otherwise it’s cottage pie.

Yes, ‘pudding’ is a generic term for dessert/‘afters’, but of course it also describes suet puddings which may be sweet or savoury (but not both)

I believe these originated in Scotland, where I understand it is now possible to buy almost anything deep fried (any confectionery you care to name, plus deep-fried meat pies, pizza, cakes etc) Heart disease is common up there.
I’ve yet to try deep fried confectionery, but one day… (I’ve gotta try it once)

To get back to the Cream of Wheat discussion, what we call Cream of Wheat here is called Semolina in England. (One of the advantages of talking with Fierra is I have learned a lot of word equivalents between England and North America :wink: )

OxyMoron - that’s not quite a Gyro. A real gyro has just onions and tomatoes on the lamb, and the sauce (tzetziki) is a blend of plain yogurt, cucumbers, and garlic. Lots of garlic. I love tzetziki - it’s also served as a dip for pita points. But that’s not American foodstuff.

Now, CORN DOGS, that there’s an American food.

Take a wooden stick, very much like a popsicle stick but a bit longer, and insert it into a hot dog almost all the way through. Dip the hot dog in a thick, corn meal batter, and then deep fry the entire thing. This is typically done in booths at events like County Fairs, etc.

Done right, they’re heavenly. The batter should be fluffy, kinda sweet, and still a bit greasy. The hot dog should be cooked but not rubbery. Dip 'em in mustard, or run a bead along the side, and devour.

There are frozen ones sold in grocery stores that you can prepare in the oven or microwave, but they’re tragic in comparison.

It is when I eat it1 :smiley:

That’s the beauty of American food: all it has to do to become “American” is arrive here. No naturalization.

And here in NYC, at least, anything that starts with Ground, Reshaped, Cone-Shaped, Roasted Meat and ends in a pita is a gyro, regardless of what anyone else thinks.

And that’s the beauty of NYC: we really don’t care what you think it should be, we just make so that it’s right. :slight_smile:

Great thread! I’ve been reading it faithfully but just haven’t had time to post. Fascinating stuff.

Speaking of foreign foods so beloved they get themselves adopted, adapted and naturalized (ahem! pizza? gyros?) I fell slam in love with the tasty, inexpensive Indian food in London.

This was years ago–and not that the more traditional fare wasn’t good, too. (I thoroughly agree that honest local dishes taste miles better than knockoff wannabes.) But that Indian food tasted damn real, fine and at home, too. I haven’t been back since–a dismal state of affairs that WILL be rectified ASAP. So my actual experience is outdated, doncha know, and first impressions–while vivid–can still be flat wrong. Since then I’ve visited through print but seems like youse guys have taken to Indian cuisine like ducks to water.

Have my eccentric reading habits misled me or has Indian food become sort of part and parcel of British cuisine, rather like Murrikins have adopted pizza, etc.?

Veb

TVeblen, I could have sworn pizza was invented in America. So I went to Google and searched for “pizza invented.” The first link that came up was a staff report by Dex. http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mpizza.html

I guess I was half right.

[Edited by TVeblen on 07-13-2001 at 11:59 PM]

Veb, while you’re here would you mind sticking a closing bold tag after your name in my last post? TIA.

Ya got it, mblackwell! And it only took two attempts.

Coulda been the sheer giddy euphoria of “Veb” and “bold” linked in context.

Horselaughs at self,
Veb

Despite how much I crave them as well, I really don’t think the gyro qualifies as an American (or Americanized) food, in the same way as Pizza, or as curry is an Anglicized food. Both of those are distinct adaptations of a foreign cuisine. The gyro is pretty much unaltered from the original Greek recipe. We’re talking about origin, not audience.

The only real difference is than in Greece, it’s not lamb slices roasted on a spit. It’s a leg of lamb roasted on a spit.

Here’s another American food, adapted from a foreign concept: the Hard Shell Taco.

Authentic Mexican tacos are served on a stack of two small soft corn tortillas, and they’re filled with meat and fresh salsa relish only. (Pork carnitas tacos are especially yummy!)

The crunchy hardshelled taco with seasoned ground beef, lettuce and tomatoes and cheese and other garnishes is an American invention.

Thought of another one:

Hushpuppies

No, not the shoe. God, it’s been ages since I had a hushpuppy.

HOT Indian curry. Yum! Funny how there are Chinese restauraunts all over the US, even in small towns, but Indian restaurants are only starting to make inroads here, even though it’s the British who have the reputation for bland food.

American sweets also tend to be too sweet for a lot of visitors. My favorite is dark chocolate that I find in France: 200 gr. tablets with hazelnuts or what they call praliné or truffé. The Monoprix and other supermarkets have some stuff under their own or little-known brands, but sometimes Cote d’Or and Lindt have a better selection. I’ve never seen “Bittersweet” American chocolate that measures up. It seems that every country in the world now sells Snickers, but I now find it too sweet. Even though Cote d’Or and Lindt have websites, I can’t find the varieties I like. So much for globalization.

Oooo. One of my UK friends once sent me a Lindt bar - ultra dark chocolate. I think it was called something like 70%, somewhere in there. It was lovely.

Why do we not have things like that in America?

Btw, in re: overly sweet sweets - you ain’t seen nothing yet. The folks in Turkey and India have Americans beat hands down - their sweets are sweet enough to kill diabetics on sight.