Well, that didn’t take long. Bush has banned funding to international groups who supply abortion services or counseling:
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20010122/ts/bush_abortion_dc_1.html
WHAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMMM!!! What the @#%$@! was that? Oh, it’s ok. That’s just the sound of the country being slammed over to the right…
lol! thats hilarious… not the abortion thing, the slap to the right… heh.
Well, it’s not like this makes abortion illegal. It just means federal funding won’t go to helping it along. Fine with me.
And the problem with that would be what???
I have enough concerns helping to pay for someone’s abortion in this country, let alone helping to pay for an abortion in another country.
Sheesh, who needs Ashcroft when we’ve got Bush and the power of the executive order.
WHAMMO! That was the sound of women’s rights being thrown back a hundred years. I guess I’d better vote while I still can, before Bush takes that away from us, as well. :rolleyes:
Robin
Welcome to democracy (okay, yeah, it’s a Republic, but you know that).
Those of us who are moderate to conservative had to put up with liberal government for eight years because that was the way the election went. Those of us who are Libertarian have to put up with ALWAYS having the guy we didn’t vote for win. The conservative won. He is going to do conservative things.
Do those who are stridently opposed to Bush think that conservatives or moderates were any less appalled by some of the things Clinton did? By some of the things Janet Reno did? Geez, folks, that’s the way it goes. Yes, you have every right to protest, but what you’re really protesting now is that a conservative is gasp acting conservatively.
By executive order Clinton gave funding to groups that support abortion internationally. By the same executive order power, Bush has done away with that. I personally support that, not simply because I am pro-life but because I have a problem with the government spending my tax money to promote what I believe is the taking of human life. If you think you have the will of the people behind you, try to make it a law that the government funds international groups that give abortion advice. All that Bush did was undo an inherently undemocratic act by the previous president.
And that’s not even getting into the idea that being opposed to abortion has anything to do with being opposed to the rights of women.
Leaving aside the arguments about abortion itself, my main practical problem with this move is that Planned Parenthood, which does provide abortion counseling and abortions (in some locations) is also the main provider of birth control worldwide. Will a group that does strictly birth control take their place? If not, the cutting of funding is very likely to result in more unwanted pregnancies and more abortions - but those abortions are less likely to be done by competent medical personnel.
There’s some interesting (if obviously pro-Planned Parenthood) information about the use of U.S. federal funds here.
Good way to put it in perspective, Palandine. I don’t necessarily agree with all tenets of Libertarianism, but I must say you guys always seem to make sense. I also don’t ever recall any discussions with Libertarians where they completely overreacted to small events.
On the other hand, speaking of overreacting. Msrobyn, how the hell did you get the ending of women’s suffrage from a bill simply stating that our tax dollars weren’t going to fund abortion counseling and the like? Seems like a big jump to me.
One more thing. After rereading, I can see where my first paragraph could come across as being sarcastic. It’s not.
Planned Parenthood seemed to have a great deal of money to throw around during the election on televsion advertising for and against various politicians. Perhaps, if they feel so strongly about the issue, they could use their own money and that of their supporters, rather than ask for American taxpayers, many of whom oppose abortion, to foot the bill. I am pro-life, but if various private pro-choice organizations want to go out into the world and promote abortion, well, that’s their money and their right.
This was wrong on so many levels. It may be a “right” here, but not all people throughout the world accept it as a right, and to go into those countries and promote it is in itself a form of cultural imperialism. Then there’s the question of whether it is the American government’s job to promote its ideals of family planning throughout the world. Indeed, I don’t know how kindly history will judge the US for years of trying to decrease the population of poor people in the world by popluation control rather than improvements in quality of life. If nothing else, it may serve to hinder people from finding real, humane, but all too often difficult solutions to world poverty when the displosable alternative is so much quicker, easier, and cheaper. There’s a lot I don’t like about Dubya, but I don’t think this was a bad day’s work.
Really? All of the counts I’ve seen show that the Liberal ex-veep got 500,000+ more votes than the Conservative governor. From where I’m sitting, it looks like the Conservative lost, but got into the White House only by getting his Conservative friends on the Supreme Court to stop all the attempts to count ballots.
If Dubya actually won the election, then yeah, his opponents should just suck it up and accept it. But he didn’t, so I think it’s perfectly proper for his opponents to resist his un-mandated agenda.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Palandine *
**
I’m wondering if this will be moved soon. I’d just like to point out that you aren’t choosing your words wisely. We do not promote abortion, anymore than you promote women asking their boyfriends to kick them in the stomache.
Your numbers seem to differ from mine. Would you mind providing a link?
Especially when there are only 535 votes that matter. As a Democrat, I’ve gotten over it. Its time for people to move on.
Totals don’t count. Individual races do. 1960 - Yankees outscored Pittsburh 55-27 in World Series. Who won? Pirates - they won 4 games to 3.
Oh, and the count that the paper ran on the ballots (was it palm Beach Post?) where Gore was claiming he'd gain 600 votes? He lost 6 in Miami. Heavily democratic, known for voter fraud Miami, where the Democratic mayor was removed from office for vote fraud 2 or 3 years ago.
And did Gore ever ask in his suits for ALL districts to be counted? No, he did not.oldscratch, I respectfully submit that the perception of most people I talk to, and myself, is that pro-choice = pro-abortion. This doesn’t make it accurate, but nonetheless true.
I am pro-life, believing there are far better options that could be made more easily available. Having said that, I’d be happy to meet the pro-choicers half-way, and be content to see the abhorrent practice of partial birth abortions outlawed.
There’s a thread just like it over in Great Debates, though, if anyone wants to get involved.
I won’t be there, though.
Yes, it’s a great debate, but it’s an issue that it’s almost impossible to get any consensus on. When I was pro-choice, I couldn’t understand the pro-life side. Now that I am pro-life, I have a hard time finding the merits in the pro-choice side. There’s simply just too large a chasm between “it’s a sanctity of life issue” and “it’s an issue of the self-determination of women.” Both sides have good arguments. Both sides are convinced they are correct. Between all the straw men (pro-choicers want to kill every child in the womb, pro-lifers want women to be barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen and furthermore want nothing to do with children after they’ve been born) there’s just more heat than light.
Can I defend my beliefs? Sure. So can everyone else. But I can’t change anyone’s mind, and no one can change mine. Moreover, even just as names on a screen, I value many of you in all your diversity. Abortion is one of those issues that makes enemies out of otherwise compatible people. I want people to see me as the Catholic, Libertarian, editor, woman, St. Louis resident, Star Trek fan, lover of horror movies, pro-life person, not just as the pro-life zealot. I want to see those on the other side in all their diversity, not just as pro-choice proponents. So, FWIW, even though this issue is very crucial to me, I won’t be joining the GD.
Simply something mundane and pointless and I had to share. Cash value $.02