Another gay man beaten comatose

[MrVisible]

Mark Fontes, 21. Walked out of IBT’s early Tuesday morning. Found a block away by a passerby, lying in an alley. Skull fracture. Facial fractures. He’s currently in critical condition at a local hospital.

Daniel Fontes told the Gay.com/PlanetOut.com Network that his brother seems to be recovering. “He’s in a light coma, able to function a little bit. It’s a good sign. He was hit in the back of the head and kicked in the face a lot, probably with a steel toe,” he described.

I don’t have a lot of rant left in me right now. I wish I could say I was shocked. When our own leader calls us sinners on national television, when churches denounce us from the pulpits, when we’re routinely called a threat to people’s marriages (as if we were standing outside your happy home with hockey masks and kitchen knives), some innocent people are going to get hurt.

I hope Mark lives. I hope he recovers full use of his body and mind. I hope his recovery isn’t too painful for him or for his family.

You’ll note that in the article, there’s no theories yet as to who did this. No suspects, no motives, no evidence. Could have been anyone; it could have been a spurned lover, another gay man. It could have been the CIA; oddly enough, Fontes had been in trouble with them as of late. Seems he sneaked onto the local military base to try and get an interview with President Bush. He got pretty far, too.

Last June, a man got killed for walking out of that same bar. Soon after that, a firefighter beat a gay man on the northeast side of town, and got off with a slap on the wrist. Two years ago, a man was stabbed for simply standing in front of a gay coffee shop.

If Mark Fontes wasn’t the victim of straight supremacists, I’ll be relieved; if somehow he was caught up in drugs or crime or espionage, that’ll mean that there aren’t people out on the street right now who think it’s right to beat the shit out of the people I love.

But nobody will be shocked if it was people who hated him for just being gay who beat him unconscious and bloody and left him in an alley to fight for his life. Nobody will be shocked, and that’s a really sad thing.

[sturmhauke]

Ctrl-Alt-Del

Fatal Exception 0E
The world is not responding. Press any key to continue hatred.

Fuck.

[MrVisible]

Links:

The Arizona Daily Star (Only available 1/16/04)

Gay.com

[mhendo]

From the Gay.com article:

She said as far as she knew, the investigator had yet to look at surveillance video recorded from a camera outside the bar. “He said he would try to get to it today, but if he had other leads to follow, he may have done that instead.”

WTF?

I’m no detective, but it seems to me that the surveillance video that was recording the area right near where the bashing took place should probably be pretty high on the priority list for the investigator. Especially since the preceding sentences in the story informed us that

“In order to solve this case, we need people to come forward.” Sgt. Altieri said, revealing there were no witnesses.

.

[IWLN]

@mhendo

WTF?

Well I agree with mhendo. Hopefully the police have looked at the surveillance tape and they have a reason to keep it quiet. You are wrong about one thing MrVisible, it always shocks me.

[gobear]

Sigh.

I’m just waiting for IzzyR, Scylla, or any of the other usual suspects to come in here and say that we gay people are just imagining acts of hate against us.

This is just too damn depressing to wake up to.

[norinew]

If this guy was beaten because of involvement with drug dealers or other criminals, that’s one thing (still wrong, but understandable). But if he was beaten just for the “crime” of being gay, that’s just sad. Shocking? No. There are still people walking around who will beat or kill people just for being black, just for being women, just for being the wrong religion. This just follows that same course of reasoning (for want of anything better to call it).

No offense to non-believers, but I have prayed for this man and his family.

[Airman_Doors_USAF]

Guys, can we stop and think about this for a minute?

From the linked article in the Arizona Daily Star:

Some wonder if Fontes was attacked because he is gay.

That’s a possibility. However:

Investigators are looking into the possibility the incident was a hate crime, but have no evidence that it was…

C’mon, guys. This is jumping to conclusions just a bit, wouldn’t you say? If it happened because he was gay I’d be the first to put the guy who did it up against the wall, but there’s no proof that it was.

It seems to me that if a gay man gets beat up the conclusion is automatically drawn that it’s because he was gay. It’s like assuming that every time a crime is committed it’s a black man that did it, or every time a black man is beat up it was the KKK that did it.

Also, I find it interesting that the article pointed out in the headline that the guy was gay, seemingly wanting everyone to think that it was hate related even though there’s no evidence that it was. In other words, they manufactured a story with the headline while conceding within that it may not be the truth.

I, for one, am not immediately jumping to a conclusion on this one. If it’s a hate crime, fry the attacker. Hell, even if it’s not, fry the bastard. But not every negative thing that happens to a gay man is a hate crime, any more than it is when I get beat up.

And if I’m wrong about this, I’ll fall all over myself to come in here and concede that I was wrong. But I’m not jumping to conclusions.

I’m just waiting for IzzyR, Scylla, or any of the other usual suspects to come in here and say that we gay people are just imagining acts of hate against us.

No, you’re not imagining it. There are definitely acts of hate against gay people. But can we wait and see on this one before assuming the worst?

[elfbabe]

@MrVisible

If Mark Fontes wasn’t the victim of straight supremacists, I’ll be relieved;

The OP’s not ignoring the fact that it may NOT be related to his orientation at all. It’s just… hard not to assume the worst after all the times when it has been related.

[gobear]

No, you’re not imagining it. There are definitely acts of hate against gay people. But can we wait and see on this one before assuming the worst

He was found outside a gay bar, so I don’t think we’re jumping to conclusions here.

[Homebrew]

@Airman Doors

C’mon, guys. This is jumping to conclusions just a bit, wouldn’t you say?

I’m sure it was just a coincidence that he was assaulted coming out of a gay bar. :rolleyes:

[Polycarp]

Just as a quick response, Airman Doors, if you will note the last few paragraphs of the OP, Mr Visible explicitly raised the point that the motive is as yet unknown.

But one would have to be purblind not to recognize that gay men seem to get assaulted at a much higher rate than, say Church of the Nazarene bachelors, or Naval aviators, or Irish tenors, and that there is definitely a reality to the issue of hate crimes, regardless of whether any particular assault happens to be one or not.

And yes, I find it both shocking and disheartening. I recently witnessed the closure of a forum on a Christian board I belong to discussing sexuality in general and homosexuality in particular – and the number of people there who were firmly convinced, for religious reasons, that gay people chose to be gay and, effectively, deserved what they got for making that choice, was something that just plain left me gobsmocked.

This. shit. has. got. to. stop. Period.

[Airman_Doors_USAF]

Fair enough, guys.

[Priam]

While its true that other motives are quite possible, we can probably consider robbery unlikely…

“The most valuable thing Mark had on him was his watch, and they didn’t take it,” he asserted

And if this was on Tuesday night, the fact that they’ve not had any leads would indicate no obvious horrible vendettas existed between him and someone else (or that they’re keeping it totally hush-hush).

Plus it occured outside a well-known gay bar in the area.

Let’s just say that circumstantial evidence exists for a hate crime motive outside of our poor paranoid brains.

[The_Flying_Dutchman]

But one would have to be purblind not to recognize that gay men seem to get assaulted at a much higher rate than, say Church of the Nazarene bachelors, or Naval aviators, or Irish tenors,

Sure, but I think comparing young male bar patrons, gay and straight, is far more relevant.As a young man, I’ve been beaten up at bars, but never managed to get in the papers.

[gobear]

and the number of people there who were firmly convinced, for religious reasons, that gay people chose to be gay and, effectively, deserved what they got for making that choice, was something that just plain left me gobsmocked.

And you’re surprised by this? A survey of Christian message boards–RaptureReady, Christianity Forums, BaptistBoard, just to name a few samples–will quickly show that devout Christians overwhelmingly hate and despise gay people (and they’re none too fond of Muslims or science educators either). The ministers preaching in their pulpits and the lay teachers in midweek Bible studies and prayer meetings are, IMO, responsible for teaching their flocks that gay people deserve to be hurt for “defying God”.

And SDMB Christians, spare me your outraged replies of “my church doesn’t teach that.”

If you are gay-friendly, thanks but you are a tiny minority in American Christianity. Your fellow congregants are the ones who shun their gay children, who vote for anti-gay legislation, and who spread lies and misinformation about gays to their friends and neighbors.

There is a chain leading from the hate spewed from the pulpit to some cretin thinking that God and society approve of beating up gay people for the crime of existing.

[jayjay]

@grienspace

Sure, but I think comparing young male bar patrons, gay and straight, is far more relevant.As a young man, I’ve been beaten up at bars, but never managed to get in the papers.

I’ve been to a fair number of gay bars in the last 12 years, and I’ve seen maybe 3 barfights between men. Total. The lesbians, now…troublemakers all.

But in my personal experience, barfights are relatively rare in gay bar culture, compared to straight bar culture. You can’t simply assume that someone who’s been beaten up in or near a gay bar has been in a barfight.

[Revtim]

@gobear

He was found outside a gay bar, so I don’t think we’re jumping to conclusions here.

IMO, I don’t think the fact that he was beaten leaving a gay bar increases the probability that his homosexuality was the motive. All the other theories could have resulted in him being attacked there as well.

Especially if he was regular at the bar; then that’s a good place to find him. If I had it in my head to beat a guy, I’d look for him where I know he might be.

If it’s found there’s no other connection between him and the attacker, then I’d say the probability gets higher it was gay-bashing. Much higher. But until then it’s jumping to a conclusion, IMHO.

[Polycarp]

@gobear

And you’re surprised by this? A survey of Christian message boards–RaptureReady, Christianity Forums, BaptistBoard, just to name a few samples–will quickly show that devout Christians overwhelmingly hate and despise gay people (and they’re none too fond of Muslims or science educators either). The ministers preaching in their pulpits and the lay teachers in midweek Bible studies and prayer meetings are, IMO, responsible for teaching their flocks that gay people deserve to be hurt for “defying God”.

And SDMB Christians, spare me your outraged replies of “my church doesn’t teach that.”

If you are gay-friendly, thanks but you are a tiny minority in American Christianity. Your fellow congregants are the ones who shun their gay children, who vote for anti-gay legislation, and who spread lies and misinformation about gays to their friends and neighbors.

There is a chain leading from the hate spewed from the pulpit to some cretin thinking that God and society approve of beating up gay people for the crime of existing.

To a point, I concede all that you say here. I might venture to point out that my own parish is overwhelmingly pro-gay, and my church (denomination) put its money where its mouth is by consecrating Gene Robinson recently. But you are no doubt aware of the strong divisions that has engendered.

A tu quoque would be to point out that you’re in DC; why aren’t you incessantly lobbying all those Senators and Congressmen to stop kissing the collective ass of the Immoral Minority and do what’s right for a change.

In point of fact, I’m sure you know that Rome is not built in a day. And you’re doing what you can, when you can, towards getting things changed.

And so am I. And RT, and **Lib and Edlyn, and Tris, and Jodi, and Siege, and Sauron and Aries, and of course andygirl and Priam, who have a foot in each court on this one.

And I’m seeing progress … very slow and halting, but it’s there. Just as we’ve come a long way since Stonewall in public perception of what it means to be gay, the churches are moving towards understanding and acceptance. Little by little. And with a lot of hostility and recalcitrance. But they’re doing it.

The more the bigots insist on untruths, the more the people of good will and sincere faith stop believing what they say, and start listening to what you and I say.

I cannot in good conscience say, “have faith” or “have patience” to you, friend. But I can tell you that “All will be well, and all will be well, and all manner of things will be well.”

:::: tosses gobear a virtual hazelnut in token of that promise :::

[vanilla]

@gobear

If you are gay-friendly, thanks but you are a tiny minority in American Christianity. Your fellow congregants are the ones who shun their gay children, who vote for anti-gay legislation, and who spread lies and misinformation about gays to their friends and neighbors.

.

Your welcome. And you are correct.
What should I do?Never go to church?