The niece that I mentioned several Pages ago has since had another baby, a girl born in October. So now there will be three unvaccinated, homeschooled kids in that household, and they are already talking about having number 4.
If anything terrible or fatal happens to any of these kids because of their parents’ decision not to vaccinate, I don’t think I could forgive them.
Of course. But if the new vaccine doesn’t work, that doesn’t mean that all vaccines don’t work, so the experiment isn’t what the anti-vaxxers are looking for.
Similar studies that werern’t unethical have been done, but that isn’t good enough. I was just explaining why you can’t do an experiment removing a proven vaccine from a portion of the population.
Hell, measurements in the drop of people getting diseases after the introduction of a vaccine should be good enough. But you can’t fix stupid, I suppose.
News from South Korea yesterday:
Note that South Korea has been declared a “measles free” area way back in 2014. Now about 7,000 people in the area around the national capital need to be monitored/mentored to ensure it doesn’t take off again.
Emergency declared over measles in anti-vax hotspot
For those who are looking for studies on the efficacy of vaccinations, doesn’t this sort of thing count?
It would be entirely unethical for the medical community to withhold vaccines from children to study how effective they are, and, well, IMHO, it is unethical for a parent to withhold vaccines from their children as well, but that’s a choice that they are allowed to make.
So, with the parents volunteering to put their children’s (and the children of others in the community who may be immunocompromised) safety at stake, is is ethical to take some learnings from that?
Throw in a study that shows no down tick in autism or whatever the claim of the day is in the unvaccinated children, shouldn’t that put this whole thing to bed?
There’s the study larryh1012 was screaming for.
Reduce vaccinations, measles outbreak. Vaccination proven to work.
I have no idea if this is true, but…
Common rotovirus vaccine may be preventing type one diabetes.
But, of course, it causes autism, so pick your poison. :rolleyes:
This hasn’t been a very good week for antivaxers.
Israel’s Health Ministry is calling out (and possibly sanctioning) antivax doctors amid a sizable measles outbreak.
Meantime, the World Health Organization has listed “vaccine hesitancy” as one of its ten global health threats for 2019.
Squeals of anguish from antivax-land are being heard.
Unfortunately you are talking about a state where homeopaths can legally be called “Doctors”.
The anti-science movement on both the left and the right side of the political spectrum is fighting. Well they call them “naturopaths” but the schools they have to go to require homeopathy to get around the legal issues and it is still woo.
Natural remedies can be fine for small household injuries or illnesses. Sure, it may not work, but it might, and probably won’t make things worse.
Some of the stuff that they will recommend actually is just good general health advice, for weight loss or insomnia or even headaches.
Bigger stuff, you should see a doctor who actually studied medicine.
According to the state these people did “study medicine”.
The fun of the 1938 Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act including the Homœopathic Pharmacopœia of the United States.
The states sponsored legitimacy has been a big part in these parent’s believing the anti-vax movement around here.
They are required to study homeopathy to gain access to the loophole about requiring evidence. These pseudomedicine pushers have a lot more credibility because the state calls them Doctors.
What do you mean by this?
Every degree at Bastyr has graduation reqirments that require you to take Homeopathy classes, because it is through the exception provided by Homeopathy that they are allowed to “practice medicine” that has either never been proven or has been proven false.
https://bastyr.edu/sites/default/files/2018-19%20ND.pdf
This is because of the exception I noted above.
Sorry for being dense, but what exception for homeopathy allows them to practice medicine that hasn’t been proven or has been proven false? Was it a ways back in the thread?
It was in the post you originally quoted “the 1938 Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act including the Homœopathic Pharmacopœia”
If you are a homeopath, the less you know about medicine, the better a doctor you will be. :rolleyes:
But in all seriousness, WHAT THE FUCK?!? That’s the stupidest loophole I’ve ever seen.
If I believe in UFOs, can I be a pilot without training? If I believe in bigfoot, I can be a vet without school? If I believe in ghosts, can I become a lawyer without passing the bar exam?
Holy fuck that is stupid, it hurts and burns witht he stpuid.
Especially when you realize what provings are in homeopathy
While not an unbiased source this avoids the fancy language homeopaths use to make it sound less absurd.
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Proving_(homeopathy)
The “science” behind homeopaths and naturopaths is absurd. But their false beliefs in how the immune system works is used by many anti-vaxers.
Also avoids properly used language:
Were, damnit, the subjunctive case isn’t that difficult. :smack:
Also, logic:
A homeopath dietician would tell you not to eat less crap, because that would actually cause you to gain more weight.
So, we convince them that it is the tiny amounts of antigens and the small amounts of liquid that are the problem, and that everything will be solved if they take more vaccines.
Homeopathetics are so smart because they only use microscopic amount of their brain cells.
Homeopaths also promote homeopathic “vaccines”, made by diluting pus or other infectious material until it is essentially just water* and then “immunizing” people with it.
*"Homeopathic nosodes, which are just as useless as all other homeopathic potions, are offered as a substitute for vaccines. This way you not only waste money on a worthless health scam, you also forgo safe and effective medicine – a nice double whammy.
Nosodes are prepared by taking body fluid from a diseased person or animal and then diluting it so that you have – water. This water is then given to prevent the disease that the person or animal from which the fluid was taken had.
In addition to giving fake medicine instead of effective medicine to prevent a serious and communicable disease, there is some risk to the preparation process itself. Homeopaths are making nosodes of HIV, ebola, Hepatitis, and other serious infectious diseases. That’s right – their answer to the HIV epidemic in Africa, or to ebola outbreaks, is to give their fake medicine."*
Recently there was publicity about a Canadian homeopath who gave a child a diluted product made from saliva of a rabid dog, to treat the child’s behavioral problems (he reportedly was hiding under a table and growling at other children). This makes sense, if you’re insane.
http://healthline.com/health-news/can-you-treat-rabies-symptoms-with-rabies
*at least, we hope that’s the case.