I want to build some basic framing around some ductwork to drywall over. Usually when tearing out old stuff I find most framing to be put together with nails. I’d prefer to predrill holes and use long drywall screws to build the framing.
Any reason not to do this?
Yes, several... the most extreme case being someone could be seriously hurt or even killed when the screws fail.
Drywall screws are for hanging drywall exclusively, they are not designed for framing. They are not the proper size or strength to support the weight of your framing and drywall, they don’t have the proper thread pattern, nor are they the proper treated steel for that function. I have seen whole ceilings sag and fall for similar reasons.
Secondly, with the proper wood and screws there is no need to predrill holes as you will weaken your structure further.
You should be using 2x4 framing with 3" construction screws or spiral nails which is probably cheaper anyway.
I’m way late to this party, and probably the work in question has already been done, but I have to question the assertion that someone could be hurt or killed by this. The OP is proposing to frame around ducting. He’s not putting up structural framing. Drywall screws are more than adequate for the insignificant load we’re talking about here. I’d always use drywall screws in a situation like this, just because you can frame up without subjecting any existing work to a succession of hammer blows. Of course, if you had a nail gun, you could always use that.
Project is finished, thanks.
I did use drywall screws for the light framing around the duct. One very small 8x12 duct that ran 12 feet along a wall and ceiling.
Any deaths to report?
Thank you Tim Taylor…but the OP asked if there were any reasons not to use drywall screws for framing drywall and I provided them. Drywall screws are not for framing … period. There are cheaper and more reliable screws or nails which are designed for this purpose. The OP’s project may have been a small bulkhead to enclose some ductwork and drywall screws may hold, but why he want to do it right and use the proper materials?
Secondly, it is apparent you underestimate the weightload of drywall. In this case, it may be “adequate” but for other readers looking for advice, this is not the right way. To compromise materials or methods on any project, no matter how small, is an indication of your attitude towards larger projects.
Third, to question the fact that someone may be hurt by a collapsing ceiling due to faulty construction practices shows a complete disregard for your quality of work and the safety of others.
The purpose of this forum is to share experiences and provide advice on proper construction materials, methods, codes, etc… between other experienced renovators and/or professionals, not how to cut corners, use substandard materials, disregard the safety of others, ignore installation instructions, and then rate our final product as “adequate”.
I’m sorry, but you’re exaggerating somewhat wildly here. The weight of drywall, the weight of framing members are a known quantity. In a situation where the sum of drywall and framing members is inconsiderable, as in the OP, it’s perfectly safe to use drywall screws. He’s not building a bearing wall; he’s boxing in a duct. You may deprecate it, but this is an approach that’s widely used in the trades. You say “Drywall screws are for hanging drywall exclusively,” but if that’s the case, why are they routinely sold at Home Depot in two- and three-inch lengths? Heck, online you can buy them even longer.
There are often plenty of reasons to use screws rather than nails – where you don’t have room to swing a hammer, or fear subjecting part of your house to hammer blows. You’re right that there are screws sold for this very purpose that are in fact stronger than drywall screws… but drywall screws will do the trick. I’m not sure why you’re so down on them. Where the building code requires nails, it’s because nails have greater shear strength than drywall screws, but for something that’s not subject to shearing forces, it’s more or less immaterial.
You shouldn’t act like I’m saying that drywall screws can be used in any and all framing situations. I’m explicitly not saying that. I’m saying that in the situation proposed by the OP, yes, you can use drywall screws, with complete confidence in the safety of the installation.
I would have used wood screws. Different fasteners are designed for different applications. The best results come from using fasteners as designed.
For a “hey, it’s good enough” project, go for what you want to do. But then, why ask here?
Death and dismemberment warning is a little over the top for this situation, but good habits breed good results, now and future.
BTW, no snark intended, just being matter of fact.
Look, as I’ve stated before, for the scope of the OP’s project they would work. I mention the extreme case of someone being hurt because it could happen, if fact, it has. I I have witnessed ceilings collapse due to faulty installations and people have been seriously injured.
I’m sorry but at approx. 1.6 - 1.7 lbs. per square foot, the weight of drywall is not insignificant, what you are ignoring is the effects of moisture, oxidation, rot, gravity, and the passage of time.
Absolutely not, I have never used drywall screws for framing nor have I witnessed it. if I were to catch any of my contractors or subtrades using drywall screws for that purpose they would most likely be removed from the work site immediately.
Errr…still no. The longer drywall screws are still only for drywall, just another application. They provide deeper penetration for attaching drywall overtop of another substrate material such as laminating drywall over an existing layer of drywall, plaster, etc. For example, when a build calls for a curved drywall surface, we would double up the sheets and use the longer drywall screws to secure both layers.
Get off the shear strength thing! Besides you’re comparing apples with oranges, different nails and screws have different shear strenghts by design.
Fasteners are specific to their application by design which consider other factors such as tensile strength, yield and pullout. The screw’s grade, treatment and coating will also effect their resistance reaction with hydrogen and other materials.
Drywall screws fail in these areas.
Exactly.
To be crystal clear, the OP specifically asked:
I simply provided an explanation as to how and why this is wrong along with the suggestion as to how to do it properly. I’ll admit to some hyperbole, but there have been serious incidents where on a larger scale such constructions have failed over time.
I have no idea why Sal Ammoniac has issues with these facts, but if he won’t take an experienced professional’s advice… meh… there’s not much more I can say, “you can lead a horse to water…” and all that.
Well, I won’t belabor the argument. I’ll only say that on the narrow question of whether the OP’s project would fail if drywall screws were used, we both seem to agree the answer is no. On the larger point of drywall screws should be used for framing, I think we both agree that the general recommendation should be no. Fair enough? Good, because it happens that I’m on my way out of town… to the Great White North, as coincidence would have it.
No hard feelings here. Enjoy your trip, where are you headed?
Say Hey, Hosers! to Bob and Doug.
I’m heading to Hamilton, Ontario. In fact, I’m waiting in line at the border at this very minute!
Drywall screws are brittle and don’t bend easily without cracking because they are hardened. I have used them for framing soffit frames and the likes but use a heavier version “Deck screws” where there needs to be structure involved. Deck screws are a lot stronger and a little more expensive and also take a different screw bit to install them. You have to make sure the length of the fastner is adequate when you build things. Make sure you have an adequate amount of fastners when building things but remember that too many can weaken things also. I have had more problems in the past with nails coming loose. Nailing for overhead soffit atachment needs to be done with nails at opposing angles so they don’t pull loose.