That’s simply not for you to decide, Satan. As long as a thread is in GD, I expect behavior worthy of GD. Period.
I said I would move the Rook thread if I got one more insult; perhaps unwise, since it allowed others to think that they can post insults in GD and the thread will be moved. Neither David or I mentioned moving the circumcision thread to the Pit, and we were quite rigorous about calling out people who posted insults and informing them that they were not allowed. Rook’s thread went on for quite a few posts in GS before it was moved; Jack’s thread was scarely moved to GD before you decided it was a sinking ship and it was acceptable to break the rules. Sorry, but it’s not.
Jack is warned three times that he’s pushing the limits? It appears to me that most members generally get one warning, maybe two in a short period of time, but this guy gets warned three times in one thread?
Jesus Fucking Christ Gaudere, but I never said it WAS! I said that based upon what was done a week prior, I thought it was something that YOU would do whether I prompted it or not!
Read my whole goddamned post! I apologized. Misunderstanding. What do you want, fucking blood? Do you want me to remove your panties and lay a wet one on your posterior directly? Do you want me to write 1000 times on a goddamned blackboard, “I wronged the Great Debates mods, and all I got was this lousy scolding?”
Let it fucking go. I said I was sorry. Accept it or don’t.
Hey Jodi - Wherever you are hanging out that is not in here, can I join ya?
*TIME ELAPSED SINCE I QUIT SMOKING:
Six months, three weeks, one day, 27 minutes and 59 seconds.
8200 cigarettes not smoked, saving $1,025.09.
Extra time with Drain Bead: 4 weeks, 11 hours, 20 minutes.
Well, the other posters haven’t needed more than one warning, with certain exceptions. I don’t think Jack’s crossed the line to ban-worthiness yet, and he hasn’t directly insulted anyone yet while in the Great Debates forum (he may have before it reached us, I didn’t read the beginning of the thread too closely.)
My apologies, yet in your previous post I didn’t see you say your actions were wrong and/or that you were sorry for giving us a hard time, just that you thought the thread was headed to the Pit “anyway”, so you thought it was OK to post insults. Twice. After we asked you and others to not do so. I thought it important to clear up that misconception. I don’t want to be a hardnose on you (quit laughing ), but I didn’t want people thinking “if I think a thread will be moved to the Pit, I can post insults.” If we have established that knowingly posting insults in Great Debates is not appropriate regardless of where you might think the thread might end up in the next ten seconds or ten days and that both your posts were inappropriate, I am more than happy to leave it at that. Whew.
Gee, look at the scene that has become from this debating idiot. Yeah I read JDT’s thread–pretty lame. So why do people get so worked up about this guy? ::shrugs:: I dunno. However, I think the people who are currently responding to the thread in question are totally ignorant for trying to debate with someone whom is that ignorant (IMO, JDT’s ignorance is intended – hey I used to be a troll too!). Anyways, since people can’t resist giving the guy gasoline, and arguing which forum the thread should be in, etc… why not just lock the thread? Silence all the bullshit. That’s just my suggestion, I don’t really care 'bout it all, I hardly ever go into GD. But I do come in here.
As far as I can see the OP itself, doesn’t display ignorance, rather the reasoning methods of one of the posters (methods that went through various interesting transformations). The OP itself seemed to have reasonable arguments on both sides, worthy of debate in a thread. If sent to the pit surely that debate will all but cease. If personal insults are allowed in it, then the reasoning of the thread is going to be obscured if not lost, the insults cannot help in seeking the logic of the debate. Therefore I can see no reason to question the judgement of the mods here. Of course I’m not so stupid to ignore the fact that I’m new to this board may have missed/am ignorant of any precedential threads/rules that could have bearing, I await correction.
That said I can see why member’s taking part bin the thread had their tempers flared by the said poster, and their need/right to vent that anger (at him would be preferable).
Silo, there’s a world of difference between the troll who is just trying to stir up shit and be an asshole and people like Jackie (and Ken Beacon, and Cyberian, and so forth ad nauseum). Jack is dead certain he’s right, and is perpetuating ignorance as an artform. That really gets under my skin.
I truly wish I had read this before I posted. I still have a question for the moderators though.
What was wrong with my assertation that JDT had insulted anyone? It is my statement to JDT, the I asked for a reply. I asked it directly to JDT. I realize that religeous and moral questions may be “offensive” or “insulting” to some, but direct statements =“your son will be a freak, and will hate you”??? WTF.?
I am new to posting and would truly like some clarification to this if possible. Any information would be greatly appreciated.
He said, precisely: “When he grows up he will be a freak (won’t be so many circumcised men when he grows up) and he will hate your guts for what you did to him (sorry to be so blunt).” Fortunately, I do not really have to decide whether or not that was an insult, since it was posted long before the thread arrived in my forum. Arnold moved the thread to GD from his forum, and he has his own rules for there and that is entirely acceptable.
If is was posted in GD… Hmm, is “your son will be a freak” any worse than “homosexuals are mutants” (which we also allowed)? When he said “your son will be a freak”, Jack is simply saying “your son will be a minority among largely uncut males”. Admittedly, he was using inflammatory language, but given that Jack firmly believes The Holy Kingdom of the Foreskin will come into being soon and make cut males widely declasse, I don’t know that I’d qualify it as a direct insult of the poster. absoul, it perhaps seemed to you that you got hit a bit hard, because you were unfamiliar with the rules of Great Debates, and were unaware that the mods are the ones who call people out for insults and that we already had a pit thread dedicated to questioning our moderating decisions.
[edited for crappy phrasing. That’ll teach me to post late. Hrmph.]
Addendum: I was not trying to say that “your son will be a freak” is acceptable in Arnold’s forum (I have no idea what Arnold has ruled on this), but that differing rules for differing forums is acceptable. Damn ambigious dependent clauses.
Ah, Gaudere, there’s always going to be gray areas. You’ll never be able to please everybody (Satan, that is not a slight towards you, or anyone, in the slightest). And keep in mind, the whole thread that spawned this affair is hardly a usual occurance… I mean, assholes are everywhere, but it’s rare to have one stir up so many people in so large a thread about so obscure a subject.
So, class, what have we learned?
“Don’t jump the gun.”
Very good!
(That last bit was an attempt to lighten the mood here, by the way)
I hate to get involved in these arguments, but I feel I need to step in and defend my colleagues DavidB and Gaudere here.
Here are the points I am going to try to make:
[ul]
[li]I didn’t read the thread as carefully as I should have. There were some statements in there that were on the verge of what is acceptable in a debate (at least IMHO), such as the example of “When he grows up he will be a freak (won’t be so many circumcised men when he grows up) and he will hate your guts for what you did to him (sorry to be so blunt).” When I checked the board on the morning of the 27th I saw that the debate was not really about Cecil’s column any more, so based on that (also one of our posters sent me an e-mail about the thread) I decided to move it. Before I moved it, I didn’t notice the sentence above that had been posted by Jack Dean Tyler. If I had, there is a good chance I would have said something and then closed the thread with an invitation to re-open it in GD, or I might have created a new thread myself in GD (which I have done in the past.)[/li][li]I moved it after simulposting with andros. Reading andros’ post I saw that the conversaion was getting heated and so I wrote to DavidB and Gaudere with an apology and asking them to take a look at the thread. Needless to say DavidB and Gaudere were none too happy about me dumping this mess in their laps, but they decided to try to make the best of a bad situation. So I would ask the posters unhappy with their decisions to cut them a little slack.[/li][li]Now I see that posters are criticizing DavidB and Gaudere either for not allowing enough insults, or allowing too many insults, or not moving the thread to The BBQ Pit, or whatever. I don’t want anyone to interpret any of my statements above as an implied criticism of DavidB or Gaudere. I fully trust the judgment of the moderators in GD who are doing a difficult job, much more demanding than my small efforts in the Comments on Cecil’s Columns forum. Congratulations guys.[/li][li]My final point - I am always saddened when people fell the need to post personal insults in the other fora. What use is The BBQ Pit if we start allowing insults everywhere else? I’m not of the school of thought that says that a discussion is lacking if you’re not allowed to call your debater a moron.[/li][/ul]
FWIW, I have no regrets about calling Jack Dean Tyler an asshole. Anyone who tries to tell a rape victim that s/he is “mistaken” about some aspect of the incident is a complete and utter jerk. That had no place in a civilized discussion.
I realize that it was probably a technical violation of the rules of the forum, and if my response had been moderated out I would not have objected. Perhaps if I had allowed myself a day to calm down I might have posted a less ugly insult. But I doubt it.
I was hoping that Jack would have the humanity to apologize for what he did. Instead, he denied having done so. At that point, I lost all respect for his (lack of) humanity (as is illustrated by some of my posts in the Pit thread discussing him).
That said, I’m not particularly bothered by the moderation in the thread. Allowing Jack to blather on in his bizarre little way lets the lurkers see how perfectly fucked up he is. I’m not the only one he’s insulted. I don’t think he even realizes that he’s being insulting. But I suspect most everyone else does, and I’m willing to bank on the ability of the general readership to recognize a complete moron when they see one.
), but I didn’t want people thinking “if I think a thread will be moved to the Pit, I can post insults.” If we have established that knowingly posting insults in Great Debates is not appropriate regardless of where you might think the thread might end up in the next ten seconds or ten days and that both your posts were inappropriate, I am more than happy to leave it at that. Whew. 
