I’m sorry, am I missing something? November 11 marks the end of the Great War and (nowadays) commemorates soldiers who fell in that and other wars.
I don’t see how Arafat’s death bears on this. He may have regarded himself as a soldier, but he died of illness at the age of 75 or so.
In any event, I kind of doubt that November 11 has any particular signficance outside of countries that ended up on the winning side in the Great War. While that war was partly fought in Palestine, I imagine the locals at the time regarded it as Other People’s Business, which they either tried to take advantage of, or tried to ignore. Either way, I doubt very much that November 11 has any particular resonance for Arabs.
A violent power struggle where “extremists” win in Palestine even if official face isn’t extremist. Israel thumps its chest more and the US does the same. And the violent struggle continues.
Not quite. It’s Veteran’s Day, the day to honor those who came back. Memorial/Remembrance/Decoration Day is in May; that’s the day to memorialize the dead and put flowers on their graves.
Still, you’re right: I can’t imagine that either holiday means diddley-squat to the Palestinians.
The way is now open for fresh negotiations. This, at least, is cause for optimism no matter how unseemly outright rejoicing at someone’s death might be.
The question is: Who can realistically stop the bombings?
The more reasonable and cuddly the chief Palestinian negotiator is, the less likely it is that Hamas/Islamic Jihad/Al Asqa Martys etc. will listen to them. The candidates most likely to be listened to are those most likely to have strapped explosives to a teenager with their very own hands.
Here is the bullet which must be bitten: Israel must negotiate with th terrorists themselves. Any attempt to dupe them into arrest or outright assassination based on a false pretext of negotiation will result in far more bombs, which I believe the Israelis will only have brought upon themselves in this specific instance.
Ultimately, I believe that lasting peace will only be acheived by granting the Palestinians either a vote in Israeli elections, or a viable state which they can control themselves (however corruptly and disastrously). Gaza is a start (although Israel still controls all its borders, like an enormous prison), but I do not see how the large settlements in the West Bank can reasonably remain in the long run. If someone can stop the bombings for a predetermined time, the negotiations should continue from where they left off at the Oslo agreement.
You can’t negotiate with people who don’t recognize your right to exist.
This is a beautiful sentiment. But giving the terrorist factions the vote will either frustrate them when their guy can’t win at the polls, creating more bombings after the (first and only) election, or put a terrorist-supported person in power, signing the death warrant of every Jew and non-fanatic in the whole region.
And creating a viable Palestine is something that must come from the inside, not be imposed on the residents. I don’t see those impulses coming from the same people who strap on explosives and blow up schools.
That is, as I see it, the million-dollar question. The terrorists aren’t going to reason with any Israeli or anyone they see as working with them, which includes anyone from their own side who wants a cease-fire.
There is no way out for Israel. They are doomed to negotiate with fanatics the bombers support or weaklings the bombers ignore.
I could have sworn a lot of people were pissed at palestinians that comemorated 9/11… and alas… now we see once again people comemorating other people’s suffering. Things never change it seems… sad.
… Now what ? Now Bush has an opening to try and fix the palestinian situation… and I doubt he will take it or if he does try… he will fail miserably. Despite Blair’s visit and tenacity in bringing the subject to the White House.
In fairness, the Palestinians were celebrating the deaths of thousands of innocents. Not quite the same as celebrating the death of a man who was an obstacle to peace.
True… still its the spirit of the thing. I don’t see americans caring about what Israel is doing to the territories either… and there has been a lot of killing. No one will admit it… but I think some americans actually like what Sharon is doing.
Talk about false analogies Rashak! Here’s a more appropriate one: should we mourn the hopefully soon demise of Pinochet with false appraisals and stolen flowers? Or is it merely Arafat who deserves such hypocrisy?
. . .
The al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade is calling for terror attacks to avenge the cowardly and covert Jewish assassination of Arafat. Hamas think Israel poisoned Arafat (…and which Israeli group should have done that? Arafat was the Israeli hawks best ally and doves don’t usually go around poisoning their adversaries). Meanwhile the Palestinians are practising their skills by emptying their ubiquitous Kalashnikovs into the air. New dawn indeed.
Well at least it’s a consolation that the completely unbiased BBC can share the burdens and tribulation of this great man, yeah even weep for old terrorists as well as their victims, actually come to think of it, I’ve never read of a BBC reporter weep at the fate of Israeli terror victims – undoubtedly I’ve not paid sufficient attention.
(Only this last week or so, without paying particular attention, I’ve read of this of this fucked-in-the-head BBC reporter, the use of Michael Moore on an expert panel covering the American election and now the use of Jenin-style manipulation and obvious lies in their coverage of Fallujah – BBC. Unbiased, neutral, impartial? duh!)
I’m thinking of the billions he stashed away in Swiss bank accounts. What, can they just disappear? There should be enough to pay each Palestinians $1,000 - $2,000 (…meanwhile the Danish government is contemplating increasing their/my! Palestinian donor/terrorist contributions). Surely there must be others besides Arafat who knows how to retrieve the money. His fat wife, so called, Suha? – but Arafat apparently erased her from his will. If not, can the bank just put it on the balance sheet as profit? Don’t know what pisses me off the must, paying money into the deep pockets of an old decrepit terrorist or into the coffers of big multinational offshore banks.
I don’t think Americans don’t care. There’s been a degree of disengagement in the last few years by the government, for certain. Perhaps there’s a line of thinking that we have other issues to deal with than this seemingly endless struggle, I don’t know.
I also think Arafat was scum… but he was their scum. For good or bad he represented their quest for nationhood. By disregarding their aspirations and their leaders Bush has not helped any peace process. Now there is a new chance… lets see what happens.
Not that this thread is the appropriate place to show us your hard-on for the BBC, or indeed discussing the size of Mr Arafat’s widow, but that Question Time also featured David “axis of evil” Frum and I’ve yet to see any outright lies in the Falluja coverage. As for Barbara Plett, she clearly says she wonders herself where that suge of emotion came from given “his obvious failings - his use of corruption, his ambivalence towards violence, his autocratic way of ruling…”. Perhaps a memo to go to Tel Aviv and cry a bit might be in order?
Ah well. I guess Pinochet is the Argentines scum then…. Anyway I think a few people would disagree that Arafat was simply a pest for the Palestinians only. Like the Israelis. A few athletes. The passengers whose flight was so rudely disturbed. Me!, who’ve had to endure the sight of his ugly face on television for these long years and now have to endure endless bullshit from fawning terrorists appeasing western leaders & journalists with an attention span of seconds and their toadying eulogies. On top of that I’ve had my pockets pilfered by the grubby diamond ringed fingers of his fat 26 years younger bottle-blond wife languishing away in luxury beds in five star Parisian hotels with her oily Lebanese playboy. Suha can go back to being a cheap whore. I want my fucking money back!