Are groups like the Masons or service organizations?

Factual Questions
1

Not sure if this was GQ or IMHO, if I’m wrong, mods please move.

See question above. One of my (government) job duties is to post various community-related messages on an electronic signboard in town. There is a policy regarding what can be posted on the sign; we post things like local school events, community stuff, non-profit fundraisers, safety issues, road closings, emergency info, etc.

Nothing controversial, commercial, political or religious; it is just for community service. So for instance, we would not run an ad for a local vet, as that is commercial, but if several local vets got together to hold a “pet clinic” and gave out free rabies shots and checkups to anyone who couldn’t afford to pay for pet care, and maybe had the local SPCA there promoting pet adoptions, we would put that up, as it is non-commercial and benefits the entire community.

I have been approached by a local Masons lodge to advertise an upcoming Fathers Day breakfast fundraiser on our sign. I considered them to be a service organization, that is, a volunteer (unpaid) group that provides a service to the community, much like the Rotary or Elks. This type of organization is OK under our sign policy.

My boss thinks otherwise, that they are a private organization that does not serve the community, only their own members, and as such does not meet the criteria.

So can anyone tell me, what type of group are the Masons? I Googled them but got a lot of confusing information about secret societies and religions, but also saw some info saying they were service-oriented (like Shriners Hospital). Do any of you Dopers know about Masons?

2

Despite the “secrecy” and sometimes “iffy” rep through history with some people, the Masons are just another service group. If you give space to the Elks, you should give space to the Masons. The Shriners Hospitals alone should earn them free space on the signage.

Your boss sounds like he has a personal agenda against the Masons.

3

Where did the boss get the idea that the Masons only serve their own members? Try asking him that and be sure to mention the Shriners’ Children’s Hospitals while you’re waiting for his answer.

4

Who cares if they serve the community generally? Is the Fathers’ Day thing open to the public? If yes, then post it.

5

If your boss thinks otherwise, are you (1) trying to change the boss’s mind, (2) going over your boss’s head, or (3) just going to post it anyway?

6

We walk a fine line in government, trying to be neutral and fair as much as possible while also being community-friendly. It’s tough sometimes!

My boss has nothing against any such groups (neither do I); we are just trying to make sure we don’t accidentally violate the written policy. We are happy to post public service messages for as many groups as we can, as long as they are non-profits whose intention is to provide a community service. Neither of us knows enough about the Masons to say definitively whether it was a private club or a service group. That’s why I asked the expert Dopers!

7

I post listings for public events on my “government sponsored” web page. The events have to be open to the public and they have to take place in town.

The Masons in my town co-sponsor blood clinics and have fundraisers for the Shriners Children’s Hospitals. I post those. If a church has a pancake breakfast, I post that.

I won’t post a regular Lodge meeting or a regular church service, though. Nor do I post the meetings of the Mother’s Club or Rotary. It has to be a larger-scale event open to the general public.

As far as commercial listings, I won’t run something like a sale at a particular shop, but if a group of merchants get together and hold a Sidewalk Sale Day, I’ll post it.

Sometimes the line is blurred. A local bakery/ice cream parlor is going to hold Classic Car Cruise Nights every Thursday night all summer at its location. I’m posting that.

I’m the only one in the office and it’s my call, but so far I’ve had no complaints and I’ve been doing this for years.

8

Write back to the Masons, tell them about this policy, and ask them to provide you a couple of examples of their service to clear it up unambiguously.

9

Doper Winston Smith is a Master Mason, and I think there are one or two others. You might send him a private message and ask.

10

I am not a Mason but am related to several. I have spoken with the lodge that a family member helped found and was a Master of for a few years and pretty much I am guaranteed acceptance if I ask. The Shrine (who runs the Shriner hospitals) is technically a separate organization that happens to require that all members also be 3rd degree Freemasons). There are other organizations like the Scottish Rite that are more esoteric and have elements of mystery religion and also educational aspects toward the members or candidates themselves.

11

Ask them to send someone in to your office to talk. Explain what the policy is and ask how they meet the reuirements. I am sure they can explain how the provide comunity service inyour area.

12

This seems the simplest way to handle it. You’d just be asking for information to show they fit your policy, just like anyone else who asks for postings.

13

I’d restate that as : Call them and explain what the policy is and ask them to send someone in to your office to tell how they meet the requirements. I am sure they can explain how they provide community service in your area.

I hate being summoned someplace not knowing what it’s about. I don’t think anyone likes surprises like that and unless the goal is to ambush someone, it’s not that effective. Let them know the agenda so they come prepared to give you the information you want.

But that’s just me.

14

Again I have to say, no matter who or what the group is, it’s the specific announcement that matters.

Even though a church is a religious group, a notice about it’s annual Used Book Sale is not. And that’s different than, say, Soul Saving Sunday. One notice gets posted. One notice doesn’t. Same group sponsoring both.

15

Legally, the Masons fall under exactly the same tax designation as the elks - 501©(10).

I’d consider creating a form in the future for organizations to fill out that provide a space to describe their charitable or societal benefit, so that your boss doesn’t get fired for being an idiot.

16

Munch, my boss is not an idiot (nor am I). It’s just that neither of us are well-versed enough about the organization in question to determine if they fit the criteria. At worst I would say that in this particular topic we are ignorant, not idiots. That is why I was seeking information. But I thank you for the information you provided.

17

Sorry, wasn’t implying you were an idiot, just your boss. Here’s a quick link to the IRS’ definition of a 501(c)(10). The relevant bit is this:

Now, your boss may have an issue with “and fraternal purposes”, thinking the Masons only benefit themselves. They don’t - but even if they did, he would be very hard pressed to justify excluding them from your signboard, as the federal government finds just as much public utility in organizations developing that offer specific groups (say, “Polish Army Amputees of Western East Lansing, #1”) an opportunity to build comraderie just amongst themselves as in an organization that offers a wider group (“People Who Really Hate the Bubonic Plague, Local 184”) an opportunity to raise awareness for their cause and provide a charitable relief to those within their focus. We know this, because the federal goverment provides identical designations for both groups.

Now, things could certainly get sticky for you in the future, what with the recent 501(c)(4) hullaballoo. I think you’d certainly want to exclude organizations that engage in lobbying and/or political efforts, or at least ban any even remotely political messaging.

It doesn’t seem as if anyone is going to be banging down your door with pitchforks, but I would also consider having for-profit entities (like your veterinary example) seek out a non-profit partner to sponsor the message, just to avoid any appearance of impropriety. But that may be too complicated for a pretty simple tool as your board.

18

You pretty much answer your own question - “fundraiser” for what?

If it’s open to the public, and the funds are for a genuine charity (their hospital, not a fleet of clown cars) then how are they different from a church book sale or an Elks fundraiser or a group of private vets’ free clinic?

That’s the key questions - open to the public? What are the funds raised for?

19

Who are you calling a simple tool, buddy? :wink:

20

Why the distinction? Raising money for a new fleet of clown cars is a perfectly legitimate reason for a fundraiser. Creating new definitions and distinctions of “charitable” that the IRS doesn’t have a problem with would be a HUGE issue for the OP and his boss.