A few years ago, I had the pleasure of visiting New Zealand and Australia. Noticing the contrasts between the two nations, I was reminded of the stereotypes about Americans and Canadians. That is: Americans = brash, loud, informal, friendly in the manner of dogs, obnoxious, arrogant, convinced of their own superiority; Canadians= reserved, polite, unassuming, friendly in the manner of cats, boring. I realized that the same stereotypes seemed to fit Aussies and Kiwis; Aussies are exuberant and Kiwis - well, I think you’d have to hold a gun to his head to get a Kiwi to be rude to you.
These are of course stereotypes and not literally or universally true (no one could accuse a member of the All-Blacks of being unassuming!). But they do seem to be based on certain cultural norms. At least, so it seemed to me, on admittedly short acquaintance.
So what about it, antipodean Dopers? Any truth to this? Are Kiwis quieter than Aussies? Are Aussies more friendly? What do you guys think about each other?
As an Aussie, I love Kiwis. They have the most spectacular country!The sporting rivalry is fierce, but when the rest of the world gets involved, the Kiwis are our buddies. I have never heard an Australian make a rude comment about Kiwis, other than in jest. There are a lot of Kiwis living here.
As for generalisations, I can’t make a generalisation about Australians because we all seem so different from within the clan. Nor have Kiwis, as individuals, been consistent. They are just individuals we work with. Maybe you have to look on from afar to see the general patterns.
Anything I say will be automatically suspect, having been a Kiwi all my life, but I do rather think that the Aussies tend to be a little louder, a little brasher than we are. Also, on the whole, a bit more successful.
I lived in New Zealand for three years. I don’t think there’s a great deal of difference between the two nationalities in terms of brashness or friendliness. There’s a wide spectrum in both countries.
I’ve always thought so. Smaller population, very similar in many ways with subtle differences, often have to define themselves by what they’re not (Australian).
In terms of broad stereotypes, there are some obvious parallels, yes. But Kiwis have the Maori, and Canucks have the Quebecois. There’s an enormous lack of parallel there.
7th generation Aussie here who’s worked for more Kiwi GMs than Aussies.
Apart from when there is a ball involved, the relations might be phrased as “Fortunately we understand each other so well, we don’t need to be polite.”
Much the same effect plays out within New Zealand between Auckland and the rest of the Shakey Iles (the JAFA effect … just a fucking Aucklander). I would predict that in the next century this neck of the South Pacific will be driven by three economic engines Sydney, Brisbane and Auckland.
Yes, Australia has become a bit brasher, probably since the 2000 Olympics, and if a few more Radical Republicans had been Pragmatic Republicans in 1999 we’d have had a bit more reason to be brasher.
Kiwis have remained (stereotypically) self-deprecating a lot longer than they have any reason to. But you had only to be over there when Lord of the Rings was raging to see they can dish it out with the best!
Some example of the standard chiacking:
From “The Gruen Transfer”
From: Underbelly: A Tale of Two Cities
“Australia was invaded twice in the 1970s. First by heroin. Then by New Zealanders. This was not a co-incidence”
From the venerable Fred Dagg (aka John Clarke) prior to when he also jumped the ditch to become an icon of both countries.
John Clarke is by birth a Kiwi, though he’s made his career in Australia, in case that’s not clear. And he’s a brilliant comedian, who transcends trivial trans-Tasman rivalries.
Here’s something I noticed when I was growing up in NZ, and it wasn’t until I came to Australia that I understood.
New Zealanders know a lot about Australia, its people and culture and place names and certain historical events.
But Australians do not know an equivalent amount about NZ. If they haven’t visited on a ski trip they know barely anything at all, even post-Lord of the Rings when NZ entered the world consciousness.
My family lived in NZ before I was born, and I think there is a huge difference between Aussie men and Kiwi men. Australian men are really into that “macho” culture and such.
Many NZ also go to Aussie to “Seek their fortune” or to better themeselves financially. The same way Canadians do.
NZ has about 4.3 million people to Australia’s 22.1 or 19.45%
Canada has 34 million to the USA’s 308.7 or 11%
So NZ actually has a bigger ratio of people compared to Aussie than Canada has to the USA
I’m not really Canadian, but swapping New Zealand & Australia with Canada & the USA and everything you said is still true. Maybe replace “sky trip” with “school trip to Quebec” since Quebec is a popular desintation for high school French clubs in the Northeast and college students who can’t afford to fly off to Europe.
I admit that the Māori and French-Canadians aren’t a very good parallel since NZ doesn’t really have a large province/region where Maori are dominant and Pākehā are the minority.
The Canadian Indians, or First Nations, are an exact equivalent to Māori culturally. My brother, who is a significant figure amongst Māori, visited Canada on a cultural exchange, and the similarities in both history and plight was remarkable.
The second part is true. My hypothesis is that the more remote parts of the British Empire retained their love of the home country most. So, the most English-looking part of Canada is Victoria, B.C., and the most English-looking country in the former Empire is New Zealand.
Speaking as an Aussie, I do see our Kiwi brothers & sisters as more progressive than us. Having said that, Americans probably wouldn’t be able to tell the difference as they’d probably consider the both of us godless communist welfare states.
Australia is bigger in terms of population, area and economy but really the America-Canada analogy ends there.
I’ve known plenty of Kiwi ex-pats who’ve moved to Australia and none of them fit your stereotypes. And, obviously I don’t see all Aussies as matching the respective stereotypes. Oh sure, you could probably say that Aussies are like Americans when you’re comparing us to the Japanese, but that’s a pretty big stretch from one extreme to the other.
Last but not least, I don’t know how close Americans and Canadians are. Aussies and Kiwis are very much like siblings who’ve shed blood together. We’ll sledge each other till the cows come home but god help anyone else who decides to come between us.
