http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030521/ap_on_re_mi_ea/israel_palestinians_394
Let’s hope so.
I think you’re being tremendously unfair if you think they all support the suicide bombings - most of them have had to deal with the repercussions of them for years and are probably aware how much good it’s doing. Not that I think this is a bad sign.
“Wising up”.
Did you ask yourself this question when Germany invaded Poland too? “Are the Polish people wising up? Let´s hope so, because if they aren´t, they deserve Nazi occupation.”
This is not a “two sides”-conflict, it is a matter of occupation and resistance against occupation, and a matter of apartheid and resistance against apartheid. People all over the world, including many US citizens, were appalled and disgusted by the Apartheid regime of South Africa, but today - owing a lot to Christian fundamentalism - lots of people support the oppressors. It´s truly absurd what religions can do to people…
This is not a “two sides”-conflict, it is a matter of occupation and resistance against occupation…
I like how you claim it’s not a two sided conflict and then describe it in terms of two sides…
i assume that Nagarjuna meant that it was not a matter of equal forces in opposition, or that there was moral, military, or political parity between the forces involved.
just my guess.
It sounded more to me like “Israelis = bad; Palestinians = good” to me. And if he’s got his mind that made up, no amount of logic, reason or historical background is going to convince him otherwise.
Wising up? What are you suggesting they were before? Stupid?
You make it sound like it’s easy to stop a load of nutters intent on suicide bombing, simply by virtue of being part of the same people.
I’m not sure I’d be brave enough to demand suicide bombers stop what they were doing …
http://www.jmcc.org/publicpoll/results/2003/no48.htm
around 60-70% support suicide bombings, around 30% don’t like them.
this is a hijack, but what historical proof, logic & reason you speak of? I have talked to alot of people who supported the Palestinians, and their views were usually motivated by emotions, not logic. Please inform me of the logical reasons why the palestinians are in the right, i would like to hear something new.
Not to speak for Eve, but re-read the thread and see if you can draw a different conclusion to the meaning of her post. I certainly did.
“Please inform me of the logical reasons why the palestinians are in the right, i would like to hear something new.”
—None of it’s new; go and search the many, many threads in the past that have hashed through both sides of the issue and the historical background—not just Nagarjuna knee-jerk “Israel is nothing but Nazi Germany” party line.
Oh, and you seem to have gotten me backwards—I am on Israel’s side, not the Palestinians’. Though I am fully aware that Israel has not always handled the ghastly situation in the most felictious way.
You might consider reading up on the concept of the straw-man, as well as “Godwin’s Law” (basically, that comparisons to Nazi Germany are too emotionally-charged to be considered a valid debate tactic).
Just a WAG, but perhaps after the appointment of Palestinian PM Abbas, the moderate faction in Palestine feels more free to speak out. I assume there’s always been a moderate Palestinian faction, but that before a viable foil to Arafat came on the scene, that faction was unable to make itself heard.
Thanks. Its just that i argue about the israel issue on another board and the pro-palestinian arguments arent that good. i assumed there was better info out there.
That’s a percentage of respondents to the site. And a number of the summaries they give contradict the idea that the bombings are massively popular.
I always wondered what would happen if they were to hold peace rallys, complete with a cleric who demanded peace instead of death.
Marley23:
I’d like to see those summaries, if you could link me to them. I’d love to see a glimmer of hope.
Magiver
Interesting that you should bring that up.
As a non-religious Reform Jew, from the time I started thinking about this issue in the mid 80s, all the history and experience I had led me to conclude that Israel was this heroic little country fending off hate-filled irrational Palestinians and other hate-filled Arab nations. Even with that messy little episode in Lebanon - and Sabra and Shatila - my sympathies fell toward the Israelis.
But the first intifada in 1988 really shattered my simplistic illusion. I saw a genuine grass-roots movement among those living in the territories. I saw regular, everyday Palestinians (many of whom were children) asserting what little power they had and not taking their cue from some of the disgusting Palestinian leaders. I saw many Palestinians making the extremely difficult decision to strike instead of working for their Israeli bosses.
I saw heroic and non-violent (relatively speaking, of course) resistance to the Israeli occupation, and I admired it. Not so coincidentally, Yasir Arafat’s role in the first intifada was muted - he was more a follower than a leader.
IMHO, if the Palestinians seek American sympathy to their plight, which might give a U.S. president the political cover necessary to twist Israel’s arm, they would be wise to adopt these tactics again.
I also suspect these sorts of resistance tactics will enable the evil crafty Jews (both Israeli and American) who run the U.S. government behind the scenes :rolleyes: to feel safe in returning to their natural liberal worldview and marginalize Sharon and the Likudniks in the process.
Ever heard of Mubarak ‘Awad? He tried that. He tried Gandhian nonviolent resistance. As soon as he started to have an effect, the Israelis deported him. Perhaps they understood that as long as they fought violent Palestinians, they could get away with murder, but once they were up against Gandhi they had no chance.
On the Palestinian television program A Message To The World a caller commented on the latest peace plan. “We will never accept any plan that is given to us, because freedom cannot be given, it must be taken!”
Is that a common belief for Palestinians