Ask the casino dealer....

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
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I’m a newbie, so bear with me if I make any grand SDMB faux pas! I figured I might as well make us of my month long free trial, and introduce myself right off the hop.

I’ve seen a bunch of “ask the…” threads, and figured my job was as ridiculous and bizarre as any as far as human misbehaviour goes. It will also allow me to poke fun at the ridiculousness of people and situations, which is definitely in my top five fave things to do.

So if anyone has any burning questions, or mild intrigue about what goes on past the Godly hours on the floor, or in the back of the house, ask away!!

I deal Blackjack, Sic-bo, Spanish 21, Caribbean Stud, Roulette, Hold’em Poker, Three Card Poker, and Let it Ride (aka Let it Die, the worst game ever!).

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[QUOTE=Northern Thalia]
I deal Blackjack, Sic-bo, Spanish 21, Caribbean Stud, Roulette, Hold’em Poker, Three Card Poker, and Let it Ride (aka Let it Die, the worst game ever!).
[/QUOTE]
Welcome to the boards!

Why do you call Let It Ride the worst game ever? I personally consider Casino War the worst table game.

Spanish 21 sounds like it’s a Blackjack variant; I don’t think I’ve ever seen it. What’s it like?

Everyone “knows” dealers make most of their money off tips. How accurate is this? What’s the pay like, and how good do the tips get?

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How is your pay determined? Are you paid by the hour? According to how much money your table makes for the house? Some combo of the two?

What kind of training did you receive?

Is it your job to watch for people trying to cheat? If so, what are you supposed to do when you see something fishy?

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How do you prefer to get tips? I usually tip by “playing” the tip - placing a chip at the corner of my playing box; if I win the hand; the dealer pays that as part of the bet and then takes the whole thing as a tip; if I lose the hand, obviously the tip is lost too. Is this OK, or do you find yourself thinking, “Just gimme the freakin’ money already!”

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[QUOTE=Scuba_Ben]

Why do you call Let It Ride the worst game ever? I personally consider Casino War the worst table game.
[/quote]

Every dealer ever will agree with me on this. It’s just SO BORING. The only people that play it (usually) are the people that really shouldn’t be in the casino. You lose your money very slowly at Let it Ride, making it appealing to people without a lot to spend. Essentially, you make three bets, and if you don’t like your hand or your chances, you are able to pull back your first two bets, and only stand to lose $5-$10 minimum, while if you have a good hand you stand to win $15-$30 minimum.

So essentially, you’re stuck for your shift with grumpy people, SLOWLY losing their money and not tipping. Plus it’s not very popular, so you spend the majority of your time staring off into space.

It’s essentially blackjack with ridiculous bells and whistles, which I’m convinced was designed to make dealers look stupid. If you have a suited 5 card 21 you win a boatload, if you get a blackjack you can choose not to get paid out and double down, 5 card 21 pays 3-2, etc. etc. The problem is that the players who play this game are dedicated, and they play way more that you will ever deal. There’s so many little things to check for, that they are obviously going to notice things before you, especially when you deal that game once in a blue moon and they play daily.

Let’s just say that the job would NOT be worth it without the tips. That’s what I always say to players if they ask me. Your base rate of pay depends on how many different games you can deal, and how long you’ve been there but there is a cap. What sucks is you have to take game training on your own time, sans pay. I have worked for a year and a half, and the casino pays me around $15/hour. However, tips supplement that, and it works out to being around $22/hour total, after being divvied among the other dealers, and of course, the government!

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[QUOTE=freckafree]
How is your pay determined? Are you paid by the hour? According to how much money your table makes for the house? Some combo of the two?
[/quote]

How much the table makes doesn’t affect our rate of pay. However, when it’s time to start closing tables, the cheap tables also go down first. By this I don’t mean the tables that are down cash for that night, I mean the games and limits that over time do not make as much money. So Let it Ride would always be closed before Roulette.

Aside from typical corporation propaganda, once you get started there is 3 weeks of training to learn basic casino policy and procedure and blackjack. That training is paid. After that, whatever games you elect to take you do so on your own time, and the course can take anywhere from an afternoon for Caribbean Stud, Let it Ride, Spanish 21, 3 Card Poker, 6 weeks for Roulette or Hold’em and 3 months for Craps.

Yes, it is definitely our job to watch for that. Although, the most common “cheating” is accidental by either new players, or drunks, which is really not a big deal. You just call your boss over, explain what happened, and fix it. The main way to watch for cheating is to watch the most vunerable bets. So in blackjack, or any other table set up the same, you memorize the two end bet amounts. The most common way people try to cheat is by either “pinching” money off that bet if it’s a bad hand, or “capping” if it’s a good hand. In roulette you just watch the outside bets, the columns especially, because they are easiest to grab back if you lost. You also watch the big play, and tell your boss about exceptionally large bets, or suspicious play, so that they can call surveillance.

If I think someone is cheating, I obviously don’t want to cause a scene. So what I’m supposed to do is grab a “lammer” which are the little clear plastic discs kept in the tray to separate stacks of chips, and place it behind the box where the money is dropped. This alerts surveillance and my boss that something fishy is up, and they’ll pull me off the table to find out what’s going on.

At every table, there are a minimum of 7 cameras trained on each dealer, because obviously if dealers decide to cheat or steal, they can do the most damage, so if I place a lammer behind the drop box, it doesn’t take long at all to get noticed.

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[QUOTE=Bricker]
How do you prefer to get tips? I usually tip by “playing” the tip - placing a chip at the corner of my playing box; if I win the hand; the dealer pays that as part of the bet and then takes the whole thing as a tip; if I lose the hand, obviously the tip is lost too. Is this OK, or do you find yourself thinking, “Just gimme the freakin’ money already!”
[/QUOTE]

There’s two different thought processes on this. In my casino, if someone asks you if you want the $$$ or to play, we’re supposed to say that we’ll take it, because (a) it’s not my money specifically, it’s ALL of the dealers’, and you shouldn’t gamble their money and (b) the odds are, surprisingly, stacked against you, and in theory you’ll make more $$ just taking it.

HOWEVER, at the casino I worked at previously, you could say whatever you wanted, and I always played the tip for two reasons. One, it shows the patrons that you are in fact rooting for them, and do want them to win, which I think definitely helps because it’s SO EASY to hate a dealer. And two, if someone wants to tip you, they are going to tip you. They notice that their tip went in the casinos’ padded pockets, and not mine. So if they are winning, and having a good time with me, I’m sure I’m going to get tipped eventually. I find it to be a lot more fun that way.

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[QUOTE=Scuba_Ben]
Welcome to the boards!

Why do you call Let It Ride the worst game ever? I personally consider Casino War the worst table game.
[/QUOTE]

Casino War is probably the worst game, but thankfully my casino doesn’t have it. They also don’t have The Big Wheel, which doubles as an information desk. :stuck_out_tongue: I’ve spoken to other dealers about the mind numbing soul sucking exercise that is dealing war, and I’d have to concur that it is worse than Let it Ride. I can’t believe people play it.
Here’s a tidbit that I always share with players while dealing Caribbean Stud. People usually start to whine within about 10 min of playing this game, asking for a royal flush, and I promptly tell them that the odds of getting a royal flush are 1 in 649 351. :eek:

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Welcome Northern Thalia. I’ve dealt table games for about three years now. I know we have at least one other poker dealer around here. Forgot who she was though.

It’s a great job but also one of the most misunderstood. I know MANY players that have tried to become dealers and most just don’t realize how much work actually happens and just give up.

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[QUOTE=Cyberhwk]
Welcome Northern Thalia. I’ve dealt table games for about three years now. I know we have at least one other poker dealer around here. Forgot who she was though.

[/QUOTE]

I think it’s Auntbeast, but it may be Snakes Cats Lady. No matter, I’m sure she’ll drop in. We’ve had these threads before (not to imply that we don’t need another, though).

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Where do you live?

Indian Casino or private? Is there competition that doesn’t tip pool? What kind of action do you generally get?

What’s your favorite game to deal? I’m assuming Let it Ride is your worst. Let me nominate Pai Gow Poker as competition.

So you’re trained in both pit and poker? Which one do you like better? Do you deal live or just tourneys?

What’s the funniest thing anyone’s ever said at your table?

Biggest mistake you ever made? (I mucked my hand on a $1200 payout once :smack: )

That’s all for now.

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[QUOTE=Cyberhwk]
Where do you live?
[/quote]

352 King Street W.
Burlington, ON
N3D 2M8

…just kidding! I do live in small town Ontario, and have dealt in 2 OLG (Ontario Lottery & Gaming) casinos.

Neither, 100% the government getting their cut. No competition that doesn’t tip pool, but there’s every other kind of pool imaginable. I don’t know about you, but in my experience a ton of dealers, supervisors and pit bosses LOOOOVE to gamble. I was once at a casino (not one I worked at) and ran into one of my pits, and he was running around like a chicken with his head cut off about losing $4, 000 at holdem. It was pretty surreal, because part of his job is to track profits and losses of each table in his pit, and I’m fairly certain he’s at least intellectually realize the trend of the tables making a profit.

My favourite game to deal is roulette, but, since I have hold’em, I rarely get the chance to. I’ve heard that some US casinos use hold’em as a reward for good dealing?? And that once you get in, it’s run separately from the rest of the casino??? Which would be awesome if you dealt it, but I know would kill the toke rate for the rest of the casino. Anyway, at my casino, nobody wants to take the training for hold’em because of all the abuse you take from patrons. It can get really bad. I’ve had to take dealers off the table before that were CRYING on the table. :smack: Which is like letting them smell your fear, and circle you for the kill!

So, since nobody wants to take the training, you’re stuck in there every day. However, I kind of like being in there, because it’s much more relaxed than the rest of the casino, and your bosses expect you to dish it out to the patrons. :smiley:

We have waaay more cash games than tourneys, so tourneys are always fun when you get the chance.

it wasn’t the funniest, but most ridiculous. A player came up to my $25 blackjack table, put down a brown envelope full of money, with the word, “RENT” written across it. He then says, “I can’t lose this money”. I proceeded to pick it up, slide it back across the table to him, and say, “There you go, you didn’t lose anything and you can go home a winner”. He stood there, looking confused for a couple minutes, and I proceeded to ignore his rent, and he eventually wandered away confused. And no, it wasn’t a joke, I could tell by his demeanor, and basically frantic, hopped up on gambling state.

Biggest mistake you ever made? (I mucked my hand on a $1200 payout once :smack:
[/QUOTE]

I was dealing a high limit game of holdem, with all the chronic and mean players. And there was a player at the table that I had several previous problems with, which is always fun. So anyway, someone had money behind, and at our casino my boss is supposed to run it to the cage because you can’t play with cash, only chips. However, they were really busy that night, so I had to do a money change in the middle of the hand. So the board was up (meaning the flop, turn, and river) I did the money change, then I mucked the board, with two people left in the hand, and about $2,500 pot in front of me. OOPS!!

The best player mistake I’ve ever seen was holdem. It was a $5,000 pot easy. The board was out, and the 2 remaining players had to show their hands so I could determine who won, and push the pot. They were too busy talking to each other about who had won to turn their cards, and player A says to player B,“you won you won, I just wanted to see what you had” Still holding onto her cards. Player B, after hearing the concession, assumes the hand is over, and tosses his hand into the muck, not wanting to show his hand (they were both bluffing, and playing crap hands, but the pot was so big they were trying to buy it). Player A still has her cards, meaning she wins the pot. Player A never showed anyone his hand. So I start pushing the pot toward her, and he FREAKS OUT. Starts screaming at me, reaching into the muck to try to find his 2 cards. Chaos ensues. The best part?? He was a jackass that never tipped and treated dealers like shit, and she won with a 6 high. :smiley:

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[QUOTE=Northern Thalia]
I don’t know about you, but in my experience a ton of dealers, supervisors and pit bosses LOOOOVE to gamble.
[/QUOTE]
Yeah, same here. In fact when I went through class they even had a day where we all we did was sit around and discuss problem gambling and other pitfalls that usually befall people in the industry.

Kinda. Usually, yes, the poker room is very much separate from the rest of the rest of the gaming department since it’s not house banked. As far as working in one, you kinda just gotta know someone. I’m sure I could move to poker if I just wanted to talk to our Poker Manager, but I’m actually OK where I am and the dealer’s haven’t been making enough money off the tournaments to equal what I’m making now in the pit (we keep our own tips in the pit, the poker room pools).

Now I DO know someone that deals poker where they regularly get a live game going, and they can make BANK with a good table! But they need the $200-$300 nights to make up for the nights where they can’t get a game going and make $0.

HA HA! That’s a good one! Yeah, sometimes things get so mechanical that when you skip a step it’s all over before you know it. What was that? 100/200? NL? They’ve all got way too much money anyway. :smiley:

Awesome! I love it when we get to dish out a little poetic justice. Saw one jackass slam his cards down so hard they bounced of the table. “Dead hand…sorry sir!” :smiley:

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[QUOTE=Cyberhwk]
I’m sure I could move to poker if I just wanted to talk to our Poker Manager, but I’m actually OK where I am and the dealer’s haven’t been making enough money off the tournaments to equal what I’m making now in the pit (we keep our own tips in the pit, the poker room pools).
[/quote]

Keeping your own tips must force people to dial down the bitchy eh? I work with so may people that don’t talk to players, and are just generally assholes. If you keep your own tips, how do you decide which dealers have to take the tables that don’t tip, and the lower limit tables that generally don’t tip as much?? At my casino, newbies are stuck dealing $5 progressive blackjack until newer newbies come in. Where do you deal? Vegas?

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What’s the most obvious case of cheating you’ve seen? What’s the most clever?

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[QUOTE=Flander]
What’s the most obvious case of cheating you’ve seen? What’s the most clever?
[/QUOTE]

Most obvious and ridiculous was on roulette. At a roulette table, the each player has their own colour for the inside. The player can make each chip be worth $1, $5 (the two most common) or sometimes $25 or $100 (rare). Anyway, each table’s chips have their own pattern on them, and are to be used only at that table. The colours are repeated on tables though, because there are only so many colours. Each table has an inventory of how many chips of each colour they have, you start at 200 chips per colour, but then they wander off. Anyway, a group of young guys were going to one table, buying chips for $1 apiece, then pocketing some of them. They would then come to my table and request the same colour (remember, same colour, different pattern) but for $5 apiece. So they just gained $4 on each chip. That doesn’t sound like a big deal, but with the odds on roulette, it is: 35:1, 17:1, etc etc. But I noticed fairly quickly, because as I’m cashing them out, there’s 10 extra chips, and lo and behold, with the wrong pattern. They got kicked out. :stuck_out_tongue:

The most clever is absolutely ridiculous. It didn’t happen to me, but it happened at my casino. The dealer was in on the cheat, and they helped by doing a false shuffle on bacarat, keeping the cards in essentially the same order shoe after shoe. A player sitting in one of the end spots would mark certain important cards with an infrared marker. Another player at the table had INFRARED CONTACTS on, and was able to tell when the sequence would begin, and alert the other players in on it. Crazy eh?

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I like stories of cheaters, got any more?
What’s the most you’ve seen someone win in one hand? Most lost?

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I like stories of cheaters, got any more?
What’s the most you’ve seen someone win in one hand? Most lost?

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[QUOTE=Flander]
I like stories of cheaters, got any more?
What’s the most you’ve seen someone win in one hand? Most lost?
[/QUOTE]

The thing is, most people don’t cheat. Most cheating happens because people don’t understand the rules, and unintentionally cheat. I’ve had a guy bring a HUUUUUGE wad of $5 bills. He pulls them out, and I’m like, you’ve GOT to be kidding me. So I lay them all out, and when there’s a large amount of bills, I have to call my boss over, to verify the amount, so I can lay out more bills and keep counting. Anyway, the majority of them turned out to be counterfeit, so he got arrested at the table. It was oh so awesome.

The most I’ve ever taken in one fell swoop was at roulette. The player had essentially the entire board covered, with huge stacks of $5 chips. The were only missing the 0-00. In comes 00, along with around $2,000. I’ve taken in $5,000 in a shoe of Blackjack, but I didn’t feel that bad about it. The shoe before, the guy won all that money off of a $500 buy in. So, when the shoe was done, I was like, “you made a ton, good time to get going, may I point you in the direction of the door?” The guy was having none of it, and handed it all back to me, continuously, for the next 12 min. :confused: 12 min is pretty quick to say goodbye to that kind of cash!

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Just a question around how you physically accept the tips players give to you.

From doco’s and what I’ve seen from personal experience, dealers have specific movements they have to make with their hands to be clearly seen by the cameras to not be pocketing anything, right?

So what do you do with the chips a player gives you for a tip? Is there a little section to put tips which clearly indicates thats what it is, and then you collect them at the end of yuor shift at the table? I guess basically what do you do so the cameras know you are collecting a tip and not trying to steal from the house?