Here’s a question: A good friend of mine has a brother who is a police officer in a medium-sized city (Suburb of Denver). I’ve met him several times and he seems a nice enough guy. My friend claims that since becoming an officer (6 years ago) he has changed. He has (allegedly) developed a kind of “us versus them” mentality. He seems to feel that everyone is scum and a potential criminal unless they are also a member of the law enforcement community. I have heard of police developing this attitude in other places also. My brother-in-law’s sister married an officer in Indy that seems to have this attitude.
To the question: Do you think this is accurate? Do cops develop this attitude? How prevelant and to what extent?
Ya know, one of the first people to offer me a joint in Vancouver was an off-duty cop… I declined (as always).
Why don’t more officers use their indicators while driving?
and… How do you deal with people who have had really horrible encounters with police (such as myself-- who was abandoned on the median of a Highway during a blizzard after being hit by an 18-wheeler…)
I’m glad you started this thread, I contemplated hijacking the other thread with an “ask the cop” type question, so it’s a good thing I waited.
On TV (my only source of information, as I have never been questioned by the police and have every intention of keeping it that way), the police officer informs the suspect of his/her rights, and then, oftentimes, the suspect decides to talk anyway, even without a lawyer.
This astonishes me. If you are guilty, you should want a lawyer, and if you’re not guilty, it seems like a good idea to have a lawyer anyway so you’ve got a professional on your side. Why would anyone in his right mind waive his rights and answer questions without a lawyer?
Do the suspects you question often opt out of the lawyer thing? I can see why it is helpful on TV, to move the plot along, but in real life, do people fail to see the benefit of legal counsel? I know it would probably make your job harder, but, hypothetically speaking, what advice would you give to a friend or relative who was being questioned about a crime that he did NOT commit? Clam up and wait for the lawyer? Full cooperation?
Yes, it does happen. I read a study once (many years ago) in which officer’s spouses were interviewed. They found that in the first five years of employment, several things happened to almost every officer. They became more suspicious of everyone, developed worse tempers, became controlling and critical of family, did not want to socialize outside of the law enforcement community, and several other things I can’t remember right now.
Knowing that, I’ve tried to watch myself on these topics. However, I must admit that I’ve been effected as well, though certainly not to the extent of some cops I’ve known. It’s an occupational hazard.
In light of some of the more threatening ‘Bad Cop’ stories, I’ve always been advised that if I am being pulled over by a cop on a deserted stretch of road, or if I don’t feel safe that I should wait until I reach a more populated area to pull over.
Is there any way to signal your intent to the officer that you’d rather pull over in a more populated area, without making him think that you’re trying to ignore him or get away?
Badge, My questions may come across as confrontational - for that I apologise in advance. It’s not my intention, I just can’t think of a better way to phrase them.
Have you ever heard of a “prayer meeting” as in “After apprehending these subjects, we conducted a “prayer meeting” during which time these gypsies came to the conclusion that they were not welcome in Wise County.”? If you have heard of that term, what does it refer to?
Do you have a “gypsy and traveler crime” department? If you do, what percentage of those investigated by it are actually Roma (Gypsy)?
Have you undergone any training on “gypsy and traveler” crime? If so, my understanding is that officers are taught that there are overwhelming numbers of Romani Gypsies in the United States, have you found that to be true? Also, once again if you’ve received this training, what exactly were you taught?
Amazingly, most people do NOT ask for a lawyer. I am constantly amazed by this. Even when facing very serious charges, they don’t take the lawyer when offered!
I think there are several reasons: they want to appear cooperative; they don’t it to look like they are hiding anything; and they think they are smart enough to outwit the cop.
Even more amazing to me is the people who consent to a search when the know they have something illegal in their house or car. I tell the person that they do not have to allow me to search, but they still give permission. I guess they do this for the same reasons, and maybe a hope that if they say OK to the search, I’ll figure they have nothing to hide and I won’t actually look.
I guess for the same reasons other people don’t - just being lazy. Only we have the advantage of know that no one will be writing us a ticket!
(seriously, I believe we have to obey the laws, or it’s hypocritical to enforce them)
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I ask the person to remember that I am not the cop who did the bad thing to them, then I try to make their experience with me as positive as possible.
I have a USMC sticker in the driver’s side back window, just where an officer would see it if I were ever stopped and approached. Do things like this, and the popular “I Support Police Whatever” stickers have any impact on your first impressions on an approach? As I open my wallet, my military ID is quite visible. Would this affect your impression? Negatively or positively?
You don’t come across as confrontational, but it obvious what your slant is. I have heard of prejudicial treatment of the Roma by law enforcement.
However, I have never had any dealings with anyone that could be called (accurately or not) as Gypsies. I’ve never had any training in that specific area of investigation, as I’ve never heard of any Gypsies ever coming through my county.
I’ve never heard the term “prayer meeting”, but I have heard of things like “we had a chat”, or “we came to an understanding”. Basically, the subjects were threatened to get them to leave. This is used on people who either have been a constant problem or seem likely to continue to be a problem. I’ve done this myself, though the threats were never of violence or anything like that. I promise the person that if we have any further problems, I will charge them with anything I can possibly hang on them, with zero leniency. And I NEVER bluff.
I can’t think of a way to signal to the officer. The best thing is to just drive on at the speed limit, being careful not to do anything that looks like you’re trying to get away (stranger turns, and especially reaching under the seats).
I especially recommend not stopping if an unmarked car tries to pull you over. Anyone can buy a blue flashing light. Keep going at the speed limit and wait for a marked unit to pull you over.
Why are the cops allowed to speed, but we can’t? I can’t tell you the number of times I’ve seen a cop car go 100+km/hour in an 80 zone, only to pull over at (you guessed it) a donut shop (obviously not chasing/responding to a call etc)… In cases like these, I go the same speed as the cop, but I once followed a cop this way for nearly 20km, and then saw him slow down and pull over the car that passed me at a VERY SLOW SPEED relative to me. It REALLY made me wish I’d paid enough attention to get the department/car number, because I think it was totally bloody wrong for that cop to pull over someone who was basically going the same speed as he was!
What might have happened if I did report it? Nothing, I;m guessing…?
Personally, the USMC sticker and the military ID carry more weight that the “I support the cops” stickers. Those stickers just strike me as a way of trying to influence me to be lenient, and that tends to push me in the other direction.
Sometimes we have to speed to get where we’re going in hurry, but lights and siren aren’t appropriate for some reason (such as the bad guys might hear us coming.
In most cases, however, the cop is speeding because he knows he won’t be stopped. It’s wrong, and I can’t defend it. I strongly feel that we have to obey the law if we’re going to enforce it.
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Probably nothing, but you can never tell. Depending on the department and if the officer has a history of problems, he could get in trouble.
My department is very conscious of this problem. A few months ago a man called to report one of our police cars speeding through a school zone in a nearby city. My lieutenant was set to suspend the officer for this, then we learned the car was being driven by our city mechanic as he was taking the car for repairs. His boss got an earful from my boss.
It’s a big problem, no doubt. I certainly don’t have any guaranteed solutions. Profiling, in general, can be a useful tool. For instance, a junker car in a wealthy neighborhood can be suspicious and should be looked at. But a black man in a predominantly white neighborhood? Should he be watched because he doesn’t fit in, or should he be ignored because we shouldn’t consider race at all. It is a very slippery slope, and I can’t think of a way to separate valid suspicions from prejudices. I guess the best we can hope for is for administrations to develop policies that clearly demonstrate to their officers that any type of prejudice will not be tolerated, and train the officers to look past race to more concrete facts.
Badge, I am a fellow resident of Washington state, a little southeast of Ellensburg. I have a license to carry a concealed pistol in Washington state. To obtain the license I had to undergo a background check and police file check, both were clean of course. Does it bother the police force that Joe Lawabiding Public may be legally packing a pistol? What is the best way to inform the officer that you have the license and you are packing a pistol if you are stopped? The absolute last thing I would want to do would be to alarm the officer and maybe escalate the officer into going for his own weapon.
