You have to wear all white to the temple, right? I gotta say, I take issue with guys in white shoes and belts - especially after Labor Day. What am I saying??? I always have issues with guys wearing white shoes and belts…
As for soda with caffeine, you have again enlightened me. All of my LDS coworkers (and there are quite a few in my line of work, I think because they can pass the background investigation fairly easily and all speak another language) do not drink soda with caffeine so I assumed it was church doctrine. That said, one guy said his grandmother used to drink Dr. Pepper out of a brown paper bag. I guess it was ok for people to think she was a drunkard, just not a soda junkie.
Yes, all true. Since Mormon missionaries aren’t supposed to engage in any sort of romantic or sexual activity, I guess pairing them up is intended to make sure they aren’t sneaking girls in through their bedroom window or jacking off under the covers or whatever. Also, it’s in emulation of the early Christians going out in pairs to convert people.
This is only partially true. Most religious education is done with both sexes together. A Mormon service on Sunday is three hours. For adults and young adults (12 and over), it consists of:
Sacrament Meeting, which is the typical church service: everyone together, singing, praying, hearing sermons, etc.
Sunday School, where everyone goes to hear religious instruction from teachers. Males and females go together; they’re separated by age group.
A third hour where members split by age as well as gender. Women go to a meeting called Relief Society. Girls go to Young Women. Boys and men go to what is called Priesthood Meeting, which is further broken down by age. They’re split because the instruction here is gender-specific.
Yes, that’s true. As far as the ban on polygyny, I think most Mormons believe that the practice will be restored one day, if not on earth, definitely in the next world, so it isn’t really inconsistent to their way of thinking.
Since the sealing power is supposed to be based on Jesus telling his apostles that “whatever they bound on earth would be bound in heaven, and whatever they loosed on earth would be loosed in heaven,” the idea that sealings can be undone is written right into the original rationale.
OneCentStamp, I am impressed with your candor and civility; I know you must harbor some very angry feelings for a few things. Most ex-members of my church that I’ve known have tended to express a lot of anger and bile, but not you. I tip my hat to you, sir.
Now my question: I know you’ve said that you don’t believe in the existance of a God, but are there any religious or quasi-religious philosophies (as in some kind of formally-stated belief in a higher power) that appeal to you now?
I just know this question is going to come across as creepy and ignorant, but isn’t that the point of these "Ask the … " threads? (Not to be creepy and ignorant, but rather to disabuse those notions)
Anyway, do Mormon people teach their kids how to be extra-polite and calm when dealing with non-Mormons? I work with a lot of college students, and those who are Mormon are unfailingly among the nicest kids I encounter. I have heard their fellow students ask things like “Mormon? Isn’t that a cult or something? Is that like being Amish?” (and the tone ranges from malicious to simply clueless) and every single time the Mormon student gives a polite, calm and reasonable answer. I always picture Mormon parents giving pep talks to the little ones along the lines of “Now remember, non-Mormans are ignorant and they can’t seem to help themselves, so you need to act extra-polite so as not to encourage them. Don’t let down the side and all that. We get enough bad press.”
Then after, when they are by themselves, do they talk about what a pack of idiots non-Mormons are (not for being non-believers, but for being dolts)? I certainly would.
Hee hee! Probably the reason you’re hearing polite, restrained responses is because the kids already heard all that in high school, and lost their tempers back then. Or maybe some of them are returned missionaries, in which case they’ve heard everything and then some (my husband was accused of being CIA, quite common, I bet OCS was too).
My family never sat around and laughed at doltish non-Mormons, but I will confess to a lot of giggle sessions centered around the mail we got from Peter Popoff (“faith gloves” that were cafeteria gloves, “faith capes” that were squares of gold lame).
How strictly is tithe-giving enforced? What happens if a member of the church cannot meet his or her obligation to pay ten percent of his income to the church? Is failing to pay tithes grounds for excommunication? Does the church look at one’s pay stubs or W-2s to prove the amount he or she is obligated to pay, or is this done on an honor-system basis? Is it based on pre-tax or post-tax income?
Also, because of all the restrictions on sexual activity, including the prohibition of masturbation, do you think many Mormon people grow up with hangups about their bodies and their natural inborn sexual urges?
At the beginning & the end of the 1980s, I was a John Bircher but AFAIK our chapters had no Mormons. However, I know that Ezra Taft Benson was on the main JBS council with Robert Welch, and that one of our more popular books was
written by W. Cleon Skousen, who apparently had a more active Mormon teaching ministry than I knew at the time.
That said, did you have any experience with Birchite influence in the LDS or vice versa?
Also, what are you willing to answer about the old Temple endowment ceremonies? (I’m referring to hand-gestures that seemingly copy Masonic blood-oaths).
And on one unofficial LDS site by LDS who think they should be more open but not totally so about the Temple ceremonies, I saw a reference to a hand gesture called “The Sure Sign of the Nail” which indicates a belief that Jesus was nailed both through the palms & the wrists. Is that accurate?
Sure there are, but most CIA agents aren’t 19-yo’s wandering around in suits, with nametags, in dusty South American cowtowns with nary a paved road in sight. (Lots of state secrets in those cowtowns, ya know.)
Secrets hide in the unlikeliest of places. And what better cover - who would ever think someone with a nametag was a spy?? (Hello, I’m Brother Smith and I’d like to take a few minutes of your time to talk to you about how covert operations can change your life.")
I know many LDS share some Danish heritage, due to long ago Mormon immigration from Denmark. But across the US most people of Scandinavian extraction are either Swedish or Norwegian. Question, then: are LDS the largest single group of Danish-Americans?
I am not sure what my question is, but would you mind talking a little about those doctrines (and other similar outsider doctirnes). How many of them do the church currently push, how fundamental are they to the relegion etc. I hear talk of such doctrines exising, but always in tones of voice that make me suspicious of their valitity. I would kinda like to know what is correct, so I know misinformation and ignorance when I see it.
Also what role does polygomy actually still play in the chruch. I know officially it is no longer accepted, but you mentioned that most people seem to think it will be reinstated, is it still an important concept for most Mormons?
Have you been (or perhaps “made a pilgrimage”) to Nauvoo? We’ve been there, as my BIL lives in nearby Macomb. It seemed like a very sacred place, not so much because anything spiritual happened there, but more because most of the people there had ancestors who helped settle Nauvoo only three or four generations ago. The guides and reenactors there also seemed to be living in the time of their ancestors, rather than in 2005 when we were there, which was a bit disconcerting.
Thank you. It’s actually the reason I opened the thread; I’m the rare example of an ex-Mormon without any real axe to grind. I figured it would be a unique perspective after all the apologetics and flamethrowing that seem to bedevil most LDS-themed threads.
I wouldn’t say that I’m sure there is no god. I am certain that I don’t believe in the Jewish-Christian-Muslim deity - you know the one: white, bearded, male, frequently vengeful. There may be some intelligent architect of the universe somewhere, but if there is one, it doesn’t involve itself in the daily affairs of one tiny species on one tiny planet revolving around an average star, and it* certainly* doesn’t demand abject worship from that species. That’s all MHO, of course, but that’s why I put the thread in here.
Now to your question: I actually answered it recently. I started a thread a little while ago titled “Church for Atheists (long),” and in the OP I detailed my falling away from Mormonism and my journey through Buddhism, among other things. I won’t spoil the ending for you, in case you didn’t see it the first time around. See if your search-fu can dig the thread up.
I know this will be hard to believe, but most Mormons really are just that nice. The religion fosters a culture of affability, approachability and openness. By the time I was 18, I had been fielding questions and wisecracks about my religion for so long that I no longer allowed myself to react negatively to it. That’s probalby what you’re seeing in your interactions with LDS members.
This used to happen to me all the damned time when I was in Ecuador. Whenever anyone confronted me about it, I would take my shoe off and start talking to it as if it was a phone, in English. Scared 'em shitless every time.
The tithe is based on pre-tax income, which sucks, but then it lowers your tax obligation at the same time, so I guess it kind of works out.
Nobody checks up on you to make sure you’re paying an honest tithe; there’s no “Mormon IRS” out there. In every event where your tithing is scrutinized (temple recommend interviews, end of year “tithing settlement” with the bishop, etc.), the member’s word is taken as proof.
“Brother Jones, does this represent a full and honest tithe?”
“Yes, it does, bishop.”
“Great.”
That’s it.
Oh, hell yes. I know I did. And the LDS Church is honestly much less repressive sexually than some other religions that I’ve encountered. Pretty much everything was prohibited, but at least it was discussed openly and without euphemism. But yes, I grew up feeling guilty for lusting after girls, ashamed for masturbating, and positively damned for copping a feel. I just thank my lucky stars that I’m not gay. I think growing up gay in the Mormon church probably would have broken me.
