First off, I am a long time lurker/fan of the site and having recently found myself in a peculiar bind, I couldn’t think of a better place to receive some guidance.
A few days ago I was in my first automotive accident. Very minor incident, but I was admittedly at fault. I was wearing my size 13W boots and as I was braking my foot was also hitting the gas pedal :smack:. Traffic was slow luckily and I hadn’t built up any speed. My car moved in small jerky hops as I attempted to brake, wondering to myself just what the hell was going on. After three hops or so my car hit the bumper of the car in front of me. We pulled over to the side of the road; I apologized and took a look at the damage. My car was fine, his however had received some scratches and scuffs from my license plate. He immediately suggested we not get the insurance companies involved as it would only serve to jack up my rates. He had a mechanic in mind who he would take the car to and have an estimate sent to me. I assured him that so long as the estimate was reasonable, I wouldn’t need to have the car looked at by another mechanic. We exchanged information and were on our way.
Here’s where the problem arose. A few days later I get a call from the mechanic, telling me he had done the repairs and that the total was $365. Admittedly, I know little about cars but that seemed excessive. Moreover I was robbed of the opportunity of getting a second opinion as the repair was done, although no estimate had been provided to me.
So essentially here’s my question: In lieu of the lack of an estimate, which we had agreed would be provided to me beforehand; am I liable for the $365 bill?
Bonus questions: Is $365 reasonable for that sort of repair? Is it better to just take the insurance claim route? Is that still an option now? (I have Geico)
Thank you in advance. Don’t spare my feelings. If I’m wrong here, let me have it. I don’t want to stiff the guy, but I also don’t want to be taken advantage of.
I was recently rear=ended and the damage was estimated at $3550. New bumper, two new rear taillights, a new frame rail, and “pulling” out the trunk floor.
$365 sounds reasonable to me, but I’m not an expert at all. Plastic stuff might need to be replaced, and it ain’t cheap.
What were the repairs, exactly? Are you sure it wasn’t a body shop rather than a mechanic? Do you have an itemized copy of the bill?
If the bill is less than your deductible, you may as well pay it anyway. I had to get someone’s Lexus repainted - rear bumper - and that was $500 more than a decade ago. They have to repaint the whole bumper.
You made a mistake in not contacting your insurance agent. $365 would probably have been within your deductible (and unless you’ve made claims this year already, it probably wouldn’t have affected your rate.) The good thing about involving the insurance company is that they give you some protection against wild claims, and keep the bill reasonable.
That said: You said scratches and scuffs. If the other dude had to get his bumper or whatever repainted and/or reshaped, $365 is within what I would consider a reasonable cost. You did get a bit screwed here in that your “handshake agreement” to get an estimate first didn’t happen, but that’s pretty much unenforceable now since it’s just your word and his.
$365 isn’t a crazy price. If the other guy is honest, I’d say just pay it, and lesson learned. But do you have anything in writing stating that if you pay this, you guys are clean and even? What you really don’t want at this point is the guy coming back in a month and saying, “oh yeah, I found some other damage, and I need another $500”
IANAL - a signed letter from the guy saying you’re clear might be ok. Or it might be time to call the insurance agent. You’ve muddied things a bit by avoiding involving a third party. I’m sure other dopers have opinions.
We prefer that real-life situation questions involving legal/medical question go in IMHO, where posters can give opinions, some of which may be fact based. Moved from General Questions to IMHO.
You likely have no deductible on your liability coverages through GEICO so even if the dude had $1 of damage your property damage coverage would pay it.
GEICO would really prefer to have one of their auto damage adjusters inspect this dude’s damages before they pay. It’s doable if he’s already gotten the repairs done but it does put the company in a slight bind.
What I would suggest is to draft up a layman’s release for dude to sign and have notarized, releasing you, your family (serious here) and your lienholder (if financing) and GEICO from any further liability claims arising from the incident on date/location of loss. Thus you protect yourself and if he’s on the up and up he would have no issues with it.
If there is legitimate supplemental damage discovered at a later time, reserve the right to have your own shop of choice conduct an estimate and/or turn it over to GEICO with a copy of the executed release.
If this is truly your first loss as a GEICO insured, with such minimal damage, it is unlikely your rates will be affected (depending on your state, of course).
FWIW, I backed into a concrete pole (protecting a fire hydrant) and put a fist-sized dent in my rear side panel and bumper last summer. Total estimate for repair was just under $1000. I called my insurance agent immediately (before estimate) and things went pretty smoothly. My deductible was $500, so I had to pay that out of pocket. The rest of the repairs (and a rental car while my Mustang was in the shop) was covered by insurance. The insurance (State Farm) suggested the body shop, and this body shop did a really good job, so I was happy with the work.
I had a really good history with State Farm (on-time payments and no claims for the last six years) so this didn’t affect my insurance premium at all. Things may differ if you have made a lot of claims in the last several years.
$365 sounds perfectly reasonable, but why in the world did he care about YOUR insurance rates? You were at fault and were going to be paying no matter what. It shouldn’t have mattered to him how you were going to pay. The fact that he fast-talked you into cutting out the insurance company is, at the very least, a red flag. Maybe he just wanted his buddy to get paid faster, but you should definitely be on your toes.
In the future, always go through the insurance company. People are deathly afraid of the insurance company raising their rates, but they are there to protect you from large financial liabilities and unscrupulous people.
Thanks for the help and insight everyone, it really is invaluable.
A few more details:
I’m in New York and I have only the most basic bare bone coverage. I’m 24, been driving for 9 months or so. As you might have gathered, I’m really uninformed in regards to this stuff. Insurance prices in NY are terrible and it made sense to me at the time to avoid the claim process. I didn’t realize not going through my insurer meant I was effectively writing this guy a blank check :(. Thankfully, you all have assured me the price is reasonable and that puts my mind at ease in that respect.
I certainly have the feeling something is amiss, given the lack of estimate, the fact that I am yet to receive an itemized bill after requesting one and the guys eagerness to avoid the claim process for “my own good.” But at the end of the day I did hit his car. I’ll pay it, get him to sign a release and move on.
It’s not quite a blank check. Just make sure you keep all records of payments to this guy. And some sort of signed letter from him saying “You pay me this and we’re cool” would be very helpful.
Since you’re outside of insurance, just document everything so you can defend against false claims. If the guy is reasonably honest, your one time payment will be sufficient. But cover yourself.
Only agree to the sum you’ve been told when it’s been told to you in writing. This is a good general principle when people are asking for money from you. Email does count, but only if it’s a traceable business email (gmail accounts don’t count). Just ask for their email address, email them to confirm the sum, save their response, pay it, then job done.
Or he might not want to have to argue that the other guy really was at fault if the other guy changes his mind. It is also possible that he was just being a good guy knowing he’d lose nothing by it so doing his good deed for the day; it does happen.
It could also possibly be that the other guy was uninsured or driving a stolen car or something. You might end up paying nothing then, but only after so many hours of paperwork and hassle that paying the $365 would have been better.
Hi guys, new to the forum and I couldn’t help jumping in on this one.
I have worked in the Collision Repair Industry for over 30 years, based on the events you gave us the short answer is NO.
If the other party had repairs performed to their vehicle prior to consulting with you that means “the vehicle owner authorized the repairs”, he is responsible for the repair bill.
Every shop in the world knows you need an “Authorization” to work on someones vehicle and whomever gives that authorization is responsible for said repairs.
Now even if the Insurance got involved at this point if there are no Invoices and or photos of the vehicle during the repair process the claim would be denied.
This is probably your best course of action. The amount doesn’t seem unreasonable to me. But be aware, there is no deductible for liability. You would only be stuck paying out of pocket for a collision if you were at fault for an accident that caused damage to your own car. (or for a comprehensive claim, of course)
FWIW a collision claim under $500 would be pretty unlikely to affect your rates. If you ever have another accident, though, then they’d probably raise it.
Question for the claims adjuster: Why does your location determine whether or not your rates are affected by an accident? Are some states more accident prone, perhaps? Do the individual states get in on the action as to deciding whether and when insurance rates can go up? Just genuinely curious.
Do the individual states get in on the action as to deciding whether and when insurance rates can go up? Just genuinely curious.