“It’s a much better epic than theiliad.”
That it isn’t a problem, basically. Since I define love as the facilitation of goodness, I am able to define sin as the obstruction of goodness. Therefore, love and sin are opposites. Every act that is not loving is a sinful act, and every act that is loving is a good act. Therefore, two gay men fulfilling one another’s lives and edifying one another are doing good work in the eyes of God.
Evil does not exist, and I mean that in the pure metaphysical sense. I see the word basically as a euphemism for “the decision to sin”; that is, the decision to obstruct the flow of goodness. My experience, my understanding of the teachings of Jesus, and my logical analysis have all led me to believe that God does not destroy us, or judge us, or wish us any kind of harm. But if we are to be free, truly free moral agents, then we must have the same freedom that He has to choose as we wish.
So why would we ever choose evil over goodness (or more correctly, choose to obstruct goodness rather than facilitate it)? Because of what we value. Goodness, as I see it, is an aesthetic — something of great beauty and value — and morality is a matter of aesthetics, rather than ethics. We pursue what we value. As Jesus said, “Where your treasure is, there your heart is also.”
This is why Jesus warns us not to judge the morality of other men. We do not know, and cannot know, what they value most deeply. Actions give only a hint, and possibly even mislead! Consider witnessing a businessman giving food to a homeless beggar. You might think, ‘Oh, what a good man he is’. Unbeknownst to you, though, he is trying to lure the old geezer into his car, where he will rape and kill him.
God choses to be good because He values goodness above all else. Those who value the same thing are one with Him. Labels like Christian, atheist, Muslim, or what-have-you are irrelevant. That’s my take, anyway.
liberal: if as you claim, the Xian god is so interested in “goodness” why do you suppose that this god hasn’t made much of an attempt to instruct us human beings as to what “goodness” consists of. I suppose O Bin L is totally convinced that he hears from his god on a regular basis, and that killing infidels is an expression of “goodness”; we know that GW Bush thinks that bombing and torturing Iraqui civilians is a Good Thing.
You yourself are a fine example; I’m sure that you believe very strongly that Libertarianism is the highest form of “goodness”; those of us who disagree see Libertaria as based on a passionate interest in laying up treasure upon the Earth (which I believe a certain radical preacher mentioned with some disapproval) and a cold-hearted indifference to the sufferings of those less fortunate than you. Why doesn’t an omniscient and omnipotent
god at least give us some information as to who is correct? Has nothing to do with “free will”; I suppose that human beings could accept “God’s will” as being based on true principals and chose to do the opposite just because they want to.
We all have equal and complete access to all the instruction we need. We must only choose it. Easy to say and much harder to do. We surrender our illusions a little at a time. Sometimes giving them up seems like cutting off a piece of ourselves. Sometimes we are reluctant on a subconscious level to accept certain truths because once we accept them we have to be responsible for them.
Because, as I just pointed out, morality isn’t about ethics (right and wrong), but about aesthetics (value and worthlessness). It’s nothing to do with information, but with character. OBL may value murder and martyrdom. Someone else may value charity and peace. We all pursue what we treasure. That’s my take, anyway. If it doesn’t suit you, no hard feelings.
Where do we find this instruction? Certainly not in the Bible, unless you agree that “do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, infant and suckling” and so on, over and over, is teaching us about “goodness”.
And my question to Liberal was not trying to play Gotcha, but a serious inquiry into how Christians, especially, decide that they know anything about what God supposedly wants. ISTM that we are left with a limited number of options as to what can cause intelligent theists to hold absolutely contradictory opinions about highly important matters. Lib , could you kindly give your opinion on the following statements of possibilities?
1 There is more than one Jesus and they disagree among themselves as to what “goodness” consists of, and communicate these disagreements to their believers.
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Jesus tells you the truth, but lies to those who disagree with you.
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You can tell the difference between a message from Jesus and a hallucination, but others can’t.
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There isn’t any objective truth, and Jesus is trying to communicate that fact to his listeners.
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There is some other reason that I haven’t thought of why people who believe wholeheartedly that they are communicating with Jesus receive contradictory messages about what “goodness” is.
Thanks M