Baseball: a couple of questions, and a bit of a rant

If i don’t catch ESPN SportsCenter (i know, it’s on about 20 times a day; how can i miss it?) or the evening news, i like to watch baseball highlights at the MLB website. I don’t subscribe, so i only get limited video highlights, but it’s usually enough to satisfy my appetite.

Anyway, i was watching highlights of yesterdays game between Oakland and the Chicago White Sox, and i was wondering if anyone else saw the incident in which Joe Crede was ejected, and, more specifically, the incident leading up to it in which Crede was denied a HBP walk because the umpire said that he leaned into the ball.

If you haven’t seen the play, and you are happy to view a streaming video, you can find it here. Just click on the game “Chicago White Sox @ Oakland Athletics” and then, on the right, click on the link titled “Crede ejected.”

I was wondering what people thought of this call. I still don’t know enough about baseball to know exactly how something like this should be called, so i was wondering whether people thought the umpire got it right or not?

I have a couple of friends who are huge baseball fans, and are very much into the rules of the game. They did not see the play, but when i described it to them, they both expressed considerable surprise (and a degree of praise) that the umpire had made such a call, because they both think that umpires generally tend not to make that call even when it’s warranted.

As i said, i’m not real clear on the exact requirements for an umpire to determine whether or not the batter leans into a pitch. It seems very clear to me from the video that Crede did, in fact, lean in. But the commentator insisted that leaning in wasn’t a problem, because the ball was in the batter’s box anyway and Crede was under no obligation to get out of the way. Both commentators insisted the umpire made a really bad call. Anyone have an opinion on this?

And the issue of the commentators leads me to my next question, and my rant.

WHO THE FUCK ARE THESE WHITE SOX COMMENTATORS? One reason i’m loathe to accept their interpretation of the rule in this incident is that these two guys are, in my opinion, about the most biased commentators i’ve ever seen on a sports broadcast (any sport, any country). I mean, they literally barrack for the White Sox during the commentary, and their “You can put it on the boooaaaard…YES!” cheer is ridiculous. Hell, i’ve even heard them refer to the opposition as “the bad guys.”

I know that all home-town commentators have a bit of bias, but they can usually suppress this enough to give a fairly even-handed commentary. Even the Yankees commmentator, who i find a bit annoying, still does his “See ya!” catchphrase when the other team hits a home run. By contrast, if any team hits a home run against the White Sox, these guys can’t hide their dissappointment, and often they don’t say anything at all.

Do White Sox fans really like this shit? I mean, i’ve got no beef with the White Sox as a team, but if i were a fan these commentators would annoy the fuck out of me.

Rule 6.08(b) (The batter is entitled to first base when) He is touched by a pitched ball which he is not attempting to hit unless (1) The ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, or (2) The batter makes no attempt to avoid being touched by the ball; If the ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a strike, whether or not the batter tries to avoid the ball. If the ball is outside the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a ball if he makes no attempt to avoid being touched. APPROVED RULING: When the batter is touched by a pitched ball which does not entitle him to first base, the ball is dead and no runner may advance.

The ump called it absolutely correctly and I wish more of them would start.

I never get to see the Orioles out here. Occasionally they are on WGN, and I cannot watch because the White Sox announcers would cause me to heave a brick through my TV in about five seconds. They suck beyond what we mere mortals dream of as suckitude.

Thanks, TYM. I guess i should have checked the rules myself.

From your citation, it seems very clear to me that the umpire made the right decision. It’s also clear that the White Sox commentator was either deliberately lying, or that he has no idea of the rules.

In case you didn’t watch the video, this is what the commentator said:

“You [the umpire] can’t make that call. It was right at him. It’s a different story if he leans over the plate into it. It’s in the batter’s box… Joe Crede does not have to move out of the way. He’s right there. Even if he leans, it doesn’t matter. How much did he move? Two inches? The ball is so far inside…That’s just ridiculous.”

Well, based on the rule you’ve cited, the commentator is an idiot. Crede does, in fact, have to make an attempt to get out of the way. And whether the ball is over the plate or not isn’t the issue. As the rule clearly states, this ruling can be made whether the pitch is a strike or a ball.

As for the Orioles: so far this year it’s been pretty sweet watching them. They’ve managed to beat the Yanks and the Red Sox convincingly on multipple occasions. But if i’ve learned anything in my five seasons of watching baseball, it’s that the season is very long, and that if the Orioles can find a way to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, they probably will.

Let’s Go O’s :cool: :cool: :cool:

One part that isn’t made clear in the video, is that Crede is not ejected for letting the pitch hit him, that pitch was simply called a ball. He was ejected for whipping his bat after he popped up, and mouthing off to the umpire afterwards.

And they didn’t even show the best part, after the ejections, the White Sox had to have Jermaine Dye play shortstop! He probably hadn’t played there since Little League, if even then.

Even I knew you had to make an effort to get out of the way, and I’m far from a rule head. They don’t generally call it if you stay still, on the presumption (I guess) that you misjudged the ball or got frozen by the pitch. This guy stuck his arm out into the path of the ball.

Pathetic that Crede and the commentators don’t know the rules of the game, sad that the manager couldn’t tell Crede that the ump was right and to just play his game.

That’s true. I probably should have made clearer in the OP that Crede was ejected for his actions later in his at-bat, after he popped out. He threw his bat aside vigorously, and started to abuse the umpire. His only penalty for leaning into the pitch was being denied the walk he thought he deserved.

Well, if I’ve learned anything in my 34 years of watching the O’s, you got your ups and you got your downs. Looks like this may be an up year. Sadly, an up year with Sosa on the team may seem like a down year to me. I’ve subscribed to MLB radio, but haven’t had much time yet to listen.

Our local Comcast office just started providing WGN last fall. The first time I turned it on, I saw these two idiots and immediately changed the channel.

I don’t think I’ve ever caught a Sox game on TV, not even when I lived in Illinois. That was long before 32 stopped showing the games and the only TV we had that could get UHF was a little B&W. Baseball should only be watched in color.

I assure you the White Sox announcers were well aware of the rule. They’re also aware that the rule is almost never enforced, and is frequently ignored even in cases where batters lean into pitches in a manner far more blatant than Crede. And it totally sucks when a usually ignored rule suddenly gets enforced at a critical time against your team, and then your player gets ejected for complaining about it.

Well, if it’s true that the commentators knew the rule, then they shouldn’t have acted like such dumbasses.

Instead of pretending that the umpire got the rules wrong, and proceeding to offer completely erroneous interpretations of the rules, they should have said exactly what you just said: sure it’s the rule, but it’s hardly ever enforced, so why are they enforcing it now?

I understand players and coaches getting frustrated if the rules are applied inconsistently. The comment by This Year’s Model in post #2 of this thread suggests that some fans also get frustrated by it. But the commentators just whined like petulant children rather than making intelligent comments about the problem.