Generalissimo Franco?
Beautiful people are more valuable because beauty just happens to be an attribute that most people value - the statement is tautological.
However, there are many ways to define ‘beautiful’ - I was more profoundly affected by the death of, say, Freddie Mercury than I have been by the passing of many others, simply because his contribution to [that which I consider valuable] was very significant and his absence is the more deeply felt for it. Every untimely (and maybe even timely) death is in some way a tragedy, for some people, but the amount of impact that their loss has on the wider public is variable.
…Although I do think the Princess Diana thing was rather an unusual phenomenon and probably out of all proportion with the nation’s actual level of admiration for her.
Would you prefer that we did it like orson scott cards speaker for the dead ?
She was not a beautiful person , she was born fell out of the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down ,and this is her 15 minutes of fame ?
Some things we need to do diplomatically ,so that all concerned can get on with life
Declan
I agree. If Diana had applied to a modeling agency when she was 20, she probably would have been turned down. It was her grace and charm that made her so beloved, not intrinsic beauty. (Well, that and the best cosmeticians, hairdressers, style consultants…)
I think that in a lot of cases, people ascribe beauty to a victim when they wouldn’t have called that person “beautiful” under normal circumstances. When Nancy Kerrigan was just another Olympic hopeful, I don’t remember anyone commenting on her looks, favorably or unfavorably, but almost every report about her being attacked made some remark like “her beauty was marred”. I’m not convinced that Laci Peterson turned heads on the street while she was alive, but since it’s not utterly ridiculous to say she was beautiful, that’s what people do say. Polly Klass wasn’t a beauty contestant like Jon Benet, but unlike Jon Benet, she had lived long enough to prove herself to be a wholesome, well-behaved young girl, and, like ArrMatey! says, it’s easier to condense “polite and a good student and kind to animals” into “beautiful”. I even remember a case, in the mid-80s, where the media went out of their way to describe the female victim of a terrorist attack as “attractive”, when photos showed that she was far from it. But it must have been considered an insult not to compliment her, out of respect for the dead.
I noticed this myself when I was about ten years old. I asked my mom, “Why is it that only beautiful children choke to death or die in fires?”
“Huh?”
“Well, whenever someone talks about their kid or grandkid or neighbor’s kid who died in some kind of an accident, they always say ‘a beautiful child’. Is it like, beautiful, perfect children are cursed, and nothing bad happens to bratty kids?”
“No…These kids who died, people probably did think they were brats, some of the time. But now that they’re dead, all anyone can think of is the good things about them.”
I’m really rambling here. But I think what it comes down to is, an early death means lost potential. And since now no one will ever know what that kid would have grown up to be like, or, if it was an adult, what they might have gone on to do, they are now a blank slate on which people can project the potential for magnificence.
Wasn’t Lynch the first female American POW? Maybe that was a factor in all that hoopla, ya think? 
I meant Di, of course. Byt the way, did you hear that Princess Di was on the radio … ?
>>Matchka ducks rotten tomato, scurries out of the room<<
I meant Di, of course. By the way, did you hear that Princess Di was on the radio … ?
>>Matchka ducks rotten tomato, scurries out of the room<<
While I don’t consider Mel to be an ugly guy, I don’t think of him as a paragon of male beauty. He has a sort of rugged attractiveness like John Wayne, but I don’t see as one of the beautiful people. He gets by on real talent, unlike certain other actors. But maybe I’m alone in my opinion
[QUOTE=smiling bandit]
He gets by on real talent, unlike certain other actors.
[QUOTE]
I always had the opposite opinion. I always saw Gibson as a contrived personality consisting of the “sexy/cute” guy whose acting style ranged from painfully silly to over-the-top melodrama. I think a lot of his current martyr complex stems from the guilt of becoming obscenely rich by the repetition of the shallow formula of "cute hero sacrifices self and is ‘resurrected.’ "
Here’s a suggestion for the title of Gibson’s next movie about the Second Coming:
Mad Messiah: Beyond Golgotha - see how many souls the swashbuckling Savior can swing into his flaming tanker truck of glory before everything explodes.
While I agree that people often use “beautiful” as a shortcut for “really wonderful person” or “really sweet person,” the physical attractiveness of a person is also a definite element.
Her grace and charm were a big deal, but she was always attractive. Not fat, not with bad skin and teeth. Attractive or pretty, at the very least.
No, I think you are underestimating the attractiveness of all these people. They were pretty, attractive, pleasing to look upon. I have no doubt that Laci Peterson did turn heads. She was obviously very cute. Not fashion-model, drop-dead-gorgeous beautiful, but neither is my sister—and she turns heads. Same with Nancy Kerrigan and Polly Klass. Very attractive people. Not fat, not with uneven, goofy features. Not with spotty skin and skanky hair. Attractive. Well, more than that. I think that all of them are very pretty, at the least.
Can anyone name me the last highly-publicised victim that was obese? Or with a huge honking nose or really gross teeth or skin? Can you? I can’t think of one.
I am no longer surprised when the latest highly publicised victim is attractive. They all are. Chandra Levy, Laci, all of them. I can’t think of one that wasn’t. Oh sure, a few will get some time on the local news, but not much more than that.
It is not news to me that beautiful (or at least attractive) people are deemed more worthwhile. This has been going on forever. There have been extensive studies on it, even. And I’ve lived it. I’ve seen how I’ve been treated when I was heavier and less attractive, and when I was thinner and dolled up. Boy, the treatment is vastly different. If I look like a troll I am more often ignored or treated like I’m not entitled to exist, but if I look halfway decent, I’m more likely to be treated like I’m a worthwhile human being.
This may be more pronounced depending on where you are from. I’m from L.A. and it’s definitely an issue. In fact, one of my friends moved to LA for a year and was shocked by the attitudes. He’s an “average” looking guy—not tall, kind of skinny, thinning hair—but an okay-looking guy and sharp as a whip. He said he’d never been treated like such a sub-human until he came to LA (he’s from Seattle). It was very unsettling for him. Now he’s back in Seattle so I presume he’s being treated more like a whole person again.
Going back in the thread a bit:
Funny, because of an interview I saw on FoxNews (yes, FoxNews), I was very aware of Shoshana. Her aunt (I think it was an aunt) was interviewed on Fox and she asked for everyone to pray for Shoshana’s safety. The aunt’s plea was so heartfelt and I was very moved. I made a point of praying (seriously) for Shoshana about every day. I didn’t forget about her. I was really, really pleased when she was found alive.
You know, I’m just mentally going through all of the people that I know, and almost every single one of them is attractive in some way or another. I would not think it odd, in fact, if everyone of them would be described by someone as “beautiful” after their untimely death. Most of them are physically atractive (don’t get me wrong, these are not movie-star types or models and there’s probably plenty of people who would consider some as ugly or “not my type”). The odd couple who aren’t attractive well and trully make up for it in personality.
My feeling is that there are actually a lot of people in the world who are beautiful to someone. So you will always be able to find someone who remarks on that person’s beauty after they’ve died.
OP has a point, and this business about “inner beauty” is just whisslin Dixie. I speak from experience.
First of all, take it from a skinny dude beat with an ugly stick. Ugly dudes don’t get the hot babes, no matter how sweet he is. Just forget it. Now go to your room … and take your magazine.
Second, in Mardi Gras parades, the float dudes preferentially throw beads to good-looking girls, even without flashing. It’s not rocket science. You look at the end of the parade and see who has beads nearly over their ears - it aint the fat, homely chicks. This used to upset me and I swore if I got on a krewe, I was going to throw to the homely people, especially dudes standing alone. Well, I got on a krewe this year, and guess what … I threw to the hot babes. Couldn’t resist. And there’s not much time to get acquainted with peoples’ inner beauty in that situation.
My guess for the answer is that beauty is valuable, but assuming everything humans do boils down to food and reproduction (=sex) the outward physical beauty of women is of value (to men) in partner selection for having sex/kids. The specifics of its value in mate selection? That I haven’t a clue, but surely someone has tried to figure it out.
You just haven’t met the right person, or maybe you are not as nice as you think you are. It’s not necessarily a matter of being “sweet”, it’s more about being trully confident (not just acting confident). I know a number of so called ugly people who have very nice wives or husbands.
Exactly. Because you only get a fleeting glimpse at these girls you naturally throw beads to the ones who are the most attractive physically. However, if you’d seen your mates homely girlfriend who was a really nice girl, then you would have thrown beads to her because you know her and value her, regardless of what she may look like.
Beauty is valuable yes. But beauty is not a particular arrangement of facial features and a certain height to weight ratio. Beauty is what ever it is about someone that makes you cry if you lose them.
If I try to look at this strictly logically, I think we come up with some unpopular and non-pc notions.
There are certainly cases where physical beauty is useful. Who do you want as your thong model, Ernest Borgnine, or Anna Kournikova? Which would you pay more for?
Rarely is it a drawback to a given endeavor. If it is, it’s easily disguised.
What this means is that physicl beauty is often and advantage and seldom a disadvantage. This makes it valuable.
Next up, we have to consider what it is that creates a value proposition:
What makes something valuable is a combination of it’s scarcity and desirability.
For better of for worse physical beauty is certainly a desirable attribute. Were it not we would not be spending all this money on Cosmetics, plastic surgery, fashion, etc etc etc. Nor would we be putting all the effort into gyms and exercise and all the other things we do to make ourselves beautiful. Since “Beautiful” is a relative term we can simply define it to mean those people who are more physically attractive than the norm, let’s say the top decile of attractiveness is “beautiful.”
Certainly there are extremes that we denote as beauty that are certainly unhealthy, like extraordinarily thin, but physical beauty is a useful measure for what it tells as about the person we are gazing at.
Presuming we have some kind of a rational idea of beauty, a beautiful person will appear to be healthy and fit, a person who takes care of themselves and is able to balance themselves and thrive in their environment.
What I’m saying is that most people have the potential to be physically beautiful, but simply aren’t. Now for some people being physically beautiful is simply not an issue. They just don’t care. Most people, as has already been established, would like to be physically beautiful. Those that are, are demonstrating success. That success may have been hard won, or it may have come at no effort whatsoever. Others may not succeed through any fault of their own. Nevertheless, since being beautiful is a desirable goal for many, achieving beauty denotes a form of success.
A person who is able to acheive their goals and realize their desires often a valuable person.
Now these things I describe are by no means universals. They are just tendencies and indicators. However, we take our cues about others from the physical signals they send us. We find a genuine smile to be beautiful, a frown to be ugly.
I don’t consider physical beauty to be the be all end all of human existance, but to dismiss the idea that it represents some kind of value is not really correct either.