And again, since this stupid thread was bumped, the problem people have with the claim is that no one has shown any evidence that a Black person would have suffered “negative consequences” for dressing that way.
You’re absolutely right that there’s no verified data we can consult from any controlled experiment on the effects of race on social perceptions of formality at outdoor presidential inaugurations.
But I haven’t seen anybody saying that we have to treat this situation as though such verified data exists. We do know that there’s a lot of anecdotal evidence from nonwhite professionals reporting that they get dinged for “unprofessional” presentation when their white colleagues don’t get the same reaction for making the same choices.
That should be enough, ISTM, to justify acknowledging the undeniable fact that it’s a privilege to be able to prioritize one’s comfort over one’s presentation without worrying about negative consequences, and recognizing that this may not always be as easy for nonwhite people as it is for us white folks.
The comment was that it was rarely something a white dude has to think about and I’m telling you it’s something I have to think about on a fairly regular basis. It doesn’t eat up a lot of my time or bring me anxiety, but how I dress is something I have to take into consideration on a fairly regular basis.
Yeah. I’m just not convinced this is an example of white privilege in action and I’m someone who is a fan of social privilege theory. You remember being an undergraduate, learning some theories in history, anthropology, or sociology and then applying that theory all the time? I think that’s what a lot of people do with white privilege. White privilege is a useful way to examine certain social dynamics but I don’t think it’s healthy to look at every situation through that particular lens.
I don’t disbelieve you, but as I said, the only actual example you gave of the sort of “wrong choice” that would actually have negative repercussions for you was so far outside well understood norms (the Hulk aloha shirt) that it makes your task of “taking into consideration how you dress” look fairly trivial. As does the fact that when it comes to cold-weather dressing, you can afford simply to ignore concerns about presentation altogether in favor of warmth.
I’m sorry, I didn’t think it was necessary to regale you with tale after tale of the times in my life I’ve had to consider how I dressed, looked, or otherwise presented myself in public. I just assumed such concerns were near universal as surly we all experienced them at some point in our lives, but clearly I was mistaken.
As an undergraduate I was among several students awarded a scholarship and one of my professors told me to show up to a presentation. It was scheduled in the middle of the school day, in a conference room not known for nice events, and I never actually received any formal invitation so I just assumed it was appropriate for me to wear my jeans and sweater combination as I was in classes that day. I was gently castigated by two of my professors for not dressing appropriately. As a teenager, I was a little self-conscious at times because my parents couldn’t always afford to buy me the fashionable clothes but I can’t say I was mercilessly teased or anything like that. I’ve always taken great care that my suit looks decent for job interviews so I can put my best foot forward. And right now, because of my role, I can’t really participate in casual Fridays because I never know who I might be meeting on any given day.
I hope those examples aren’t trivial enough to be beneath your consideration.
They are, of course. The point is not that no member of a societally privileged group ever has to think about such issues or is ever criticized for misjudging them.
The point is just that members of societally privileged groups often have an easier time navigating these issues (because it’s their cultural norms that are considered the default for “appropriate” presentation), and often are judged more leniently for “transgressing” them, than members of less privileged groups.
I don’t think anybody is seriously arguing that members of societally privileged groups never have to worry about their self-presentation at all.
Someone in this thread said white men rarely have to consider such things. I simply disagreed with that assessment as it’s something I’ve been concerned with for a great many decades now. It’s not an overriding concern nor is it something that particularly stresses me out on a day-to-day basis, but making sure I’m wearing appropriate attire for the situation is something I take into consideration.
Nope. They just said rarely. And hell, white women are a privileged group here in the United States and I’m given to understand that they often feel an enormous pressure to wear certain clothes and to look a certain way.
That seems to be a misunderstanding of the statement. Such a statement is comparative and about white men in general, not any particular person–just like all statements about privilege. It is arguing that the average white male has to put less thought into their appearance than the average black person.
However, what is stressed when learning those topics is the these lenses are all all valid. That’s why you can analyze these stories in that way. None of them is unhealthy–the question is more about how well supported they are, and how they fit in an overall wholistic look at the work in question.
It seems to me that there is no question of the fact that white men have a privilege of not being required to care as much about their appearance. It’s a pretty well known thing in black circles how they would have to dress more formally to be taken seriously.
And as long as that privilege exists, inherently any white man benefits from it, especially when they dress in a way that can be seen as not as formal. So it must inherently apply to Sanders.
The problem I had with the teacher is that she tried to make it some horrible thing that Sanders did, or at least something people shouldn’t be making memes of. And her description indicates she specifically pressed her class to look at it in that way. Not just to notice the existence of some white privilege, but to actually find it a “gross example” of it and to be unable to look at it through any other lens. People should be offended by the meme.
This is her error: not in bringing up the concept of white privilege, but of giving it a much higher degree of prominence than warranted for this particular incident. Sure, it’s fine to discuss it as part of the wider topic, but it’s not an excuse to look down on people because they didn’t consider it when making him a meme.
What I won’t do, however, is deny the white privilege lens altogether, or act like there is anything unhealthy in using that lens on any subject. What’s unhealthy is (ironically) privileging that lens above all others, or using these lenses to denigrate others.
Also, I do note you seem to ignore the concept of relative privilege. Yes, white women are privileged, but less so than white men in many cases.
nm…
I think BigT’s post above is an excellent overview.
What I will point out, since nobody else seems to have, is that Bernie has dressed this way for every inauguration since he’s been in Congress. So he clearly felt comfortable rocking the parka before he was either old or particularly well-known. I think it fits his brand nicely; “I’m the no-bullshit guy who does the practical thing and doesn’t care about fitting in with the others”. Vermont voters seem to like it.
It’s no doubt true that a black person would have legitimate concerns about sending that message through dress that Bernie doesn’t have; they would run a much higher risk of attracting negative attention for doing so. So the concept of white privilege isn’t entirely irrelevant here.
But, especially in light of the pictorial evidence that in fact at least one black woman has worn a parka to an inauguration without apparent consequence, viewing this as such a clear-cut example of obvious white privilege that we should make a teaching moment out of it is weird.
That’s actually my biggest problem as well. But it’s indicative of the time we live in where we’re supposed to be outraged by everything. (Not that there aren’t things to be genuinely outraged by.)
I’m not sure if I actually used the world intersectionality in this thread but I’m quite aware of it. And I still maintain that white women are a fairly privileged group here in the United States. They might not be as privileged as white men but they’re up there.
A relative of mine who is very politically active in Iowa, and has met many political figures, said that Bernie is … uh, kind of a jerk. He had some specific stories and examples that I found credible.
I have no skin in this game, I’m neither for nor against Bernie, but I don’t think he’s super “likeable”, which I do believe matters a lot in politics for candidates that actually want to win.
I don’t think that’s true. He wore the parka to Trump’s inauguration in 2017.
He appears to be wearing a dark wool coat to Obama’s 2009 inauguration.
He also wore a wool coat in this photo from 2016 near the time of the Iowa caucuses.
So it’s not like he never wears a wool overcoat.
How cold was it at Obama’s inaugeration, compared to Biden’s inaugeration? Parkas are warmer than wool coats.
Was he having to spend considerable time outside at the Iowa caucuses, or was he just going from car to inside buildings? And again, how cold was it ?
I’d just seen the photo before. The claim was he always wears the parka to inaugurations. It doesn’t appear to be true.
That doesn’t mean I’m saying he did anything wrong. I don’t care what the temperature was, because the claim wasn’t based on temperature.
Thank you, ignorance fought.
Has anyone, white or not white, ever had more people discussing how they dress at an inauguration?
Calling this white privilege is belittling the whole idea of white privilege, which is a problem. An old man wore a parka when it was cold out? Alert the media, I guess.
In truth, I haven’t heard anyone make a big stink about it outside of the article linked in the OP. I’d say it’s pretty much a non-issue.
Me either, but I was just talking about how some people in this thread seem to think this is white privilege. If this is white privilege, the category is so broad as to be meaningless.
Or perhaps white privilege is so pervasive as to be unavoidable.