Been a lurker for a LOONG time, but I figure no better place to ask for some intelligent input.
We’re currently in the US. I am a US permanent resident (citizen of India), wife is US citizen, we have 3 kids 6 and under. Our finances are strong (about $300k in assets + I have my business that generates a good monthly income in the $5000-$8000 range).
We’re looking to relocate to a different country and have shortlisted the following in no particular order:
South Korea
New Zealand
Japan
Costa Rica
Thailand
Ireland
Singapore
The primary things we’re looking for are:
Low to no taxation on income from outside of the nation (happy to pay taxes on any income generated within the country).
Safe and family friendly (I shouldn’t dread having wife take kids to park thinking some hoodlum or thug might be lurking)
English or accomodation for english (happy to learn local language but it does take time!)
Good for homeschooling
Good medical system (that means freedom in choosing treatment plans, not controlled by big pharma)
Good/quality food (organic/raw if available would be awesome, but really don’t want chemical laden sludge that a lot of food here is becoming!).
Good roads/transportation for family is a plus, alongside lower cost of living
Finally, the biggest factor would be how much it would cost and what the demands would be from any nation on allowing immigration of a well-to-do self-employed family that will not be a drain on the society nor be taking up jobs from natives.
For South Korea, you cannot simply relocate there. You must have gainful employment in South Korea (meaning your income must be generated in Korea) or be a dependent immediate family member of someone with gainful employment in South Korea. Same goes for Japan. Of course, there may be some, as in very few, exceptions to this general rule but don’t count on it applying to you without your already having some connection to the country.
Another thing to consider: your American citizen family members are taxed by the US on all income earned, whether earned in the US or in other countries.
Many countries will take this into account, but they may also have specific billateral treaties with the US regarding taxation and double taxation. You may have to file taxes in both countries even if all your income is from the US.
Costa Rica has some schools in English, private ones located in expensive areas; you meet the criteria to be able to relocate there (enough independent income to be able to basically move in). Many people speak English albeit often of the “for tourism” variety; there are quite a few expats from the US. You mention homeschooling - is that a requirement? It looks like there are people doing it in CR; what I can’t find is actual legal information about how the CR government views those. Well, I do find sites that claim it’s legal, others that claim it’s against the law… if I were you I’d contact their embassy. In fact, I’d contact the embassies of each of those countries, as assisting people with immigration processes is part of their job.
What is your primary goal? Is it simply to reduce taxes?
Because some of the countries you mentioned have a high cost of living. And I think that the English-language schools in those countries are going to be private ones for which you have to pay tuition out of pocket. In the US, of course, you can choose to live someplace with great public schools the cost of which are covered by your taxes. (But of course those are typically more expensive towns or cities in which to live.) So your lowest cost of living might be here in the US.
And your financial assets aren’t that strong. Assets of only $300,000, income of $60,000 to $96,000 per year. With three dependents, I doubt that your effective tax rate is all that high.
That’s not enough money to get you into Australia on a business investor visa (you need something like $800k investable assets and business earning $500k annually) - if you are skilled you might get in on a skilled migrants visa but that has a number of criteria. I don’t remember the NZ visa rules but assume it’s somewhat similar.
NZ is small, so job opportunities are lower, and it’s very remote so cost of living is high for imported goods of which there is a lesser variety. Wonderful place to bring up kids, mostly safe but like anywhere you need to have a degree of caution.
Offers ACC, universal injury cover for all residents and visitors (workplace as well as outside) which is a great scheme and unique in the world. Apparently the Swedish would come out regularly to investigate it but decided it’s too hard to implement from scratch.
Food varies from completely organic and wholesome to 100% crap, regardless of what the 100% Pure NZ tourist ads tell you. But the country is generally cleaner and less population dense and benefited by the strong Tasman winds so very little pollution.
Tax rates relatively high, have to pay US taxes as well I think.
Ireland fails on this one. If you are tax resident in Ireland, you will be liable for income tax on all income, regardless of where it is “generated”.
Safety
There are some hoodlums and thugs in Ireland, but it is generally safe and you won’t have to worry about your wife and kids in the park.
Language
Ireland is an English speaking country (although you are welcome to learn the local language if you wish!)
Good for homeschooling
Homeschooling is permitted in Ireland.
Good medical system (that means freedom in choosing treatment plans, not controlled by big pharma)
I don’t fully understand the part in brackets (I suspect it’s something to do with US politics). But Ireland has a good medical system; you can have private health insurance or you can rely on state-provided healthcare.
Good/quality food.
Good food is available in Ireland, including organic food. Bad food is also available.
Good roads/transportation for family is a plus, alongside lower cost of living
There’s a good network of motorways and national routes. Some rural and minor roads are not so good! Public transport varies from good in some parts of the country to nearly non-existent in remote rural areas.
That won’t serve as a basis for residency in Ireland. You have two main options:
Get a job in Ireland and apply for a work permit (in that order!)
Qualify for Irish citizenship on the basis of your (or your wife’s) ancestry.
Safe, clean and English is widely spoken in the business community.
Your housing, transportation and food costs will not be cheap, but I think you’ll find these expenses are worth the price of living in such a comfortable environment.
Public schools are some of the best in the world as are the first class medical facilities.
Food? Also world class from great (and safe) street markets to fine restaurants that feature cuisines from China, India, Europe and the USA.
The only problem you may face is being accepted as an immigrant, but its definitely worth looking into.
Thailand is also another good choice if things don’t work out in Singapore.
Thailand is lower cost than Singapore. Indians are traditionally discriminated against by Thais, but there are a lot of Indians here, and I’m not talking violence, just bad looks and smart-ass remarks for the most part. Private schooling will be essential, and that is fucking expensive here. Public schooling would not be an option, because A) it’s Thai language only; and B) the education system is complete shit.
A New Zealand citizen currently living in Singapore - lots of questions that you haven’t addressed in your post but…
a) Cost of living in Singapore is really high - $300 k in assets? Pfft - even a 90sq m public flat costs more than that to buy - as a “foreigner”, for something big enough for the five of you, you’ll be wanting at least $1million (SGD)
b) Transport - we have a good road system here, and great connectivity to Malaysia, but you’ll be looking at about $130,000 SGD for a Toyota Corolla - for something like an Mercedes E200 you’ll be wanting around $240-$260k
c) Education - there system here is strong, and assuming that you can get the appropriate residency permits (which are hard to come by now) your kids can attend local schools. If so - they will expected to learn Tamil as their “mother tongue” (pending a really good reason not to) - and the standard expected is full fluency in both writing and speaking (note - if you want to send them to an international school, this point will be moot)
d) Really really safe here
e) Good public transport, and relatively cheap taxis (the typical ride is around $10)
f) Food - hmmmm - there are enough vegetarian options - but when it comes to organic / free range etc you will have problems, Singapore is not very “enlightened” in such areas.
For New Zealand -
a) Yep - you will get good support for home schooling, and it is certainly an option
b) Not sure why you are so keen on homeschooling though - schools in New Zealand are fine, and I would not expect any “meaningful” bullying / drugs / gangs etc
c) Housing is cheap - if you go to one of the more rural / extra urban areas you should be able to get into a family home for around $200k NZD
d) If you have the “desired” skills, you can get the necessary residency permits - and if you can sell your business as a going concern and then restart it in NZ you should be able to qualify for the investment category
e) You will be able to get lots of natural food, although there is not as much of a critical mass for such things outside of the main population centres
I would choose NZ over Singapore in a hearbeat - mostly because of the cost factor, but also because you will have a much better quality of life and lifestyle in New Zealand, unless you have pretty serious “fuck you” money (I’m thinking in the likes of $8-10 million + a strong ongoing income stream)
Also, there is a lot of “anti immigrant” emotion in Singapore at the moment - and the way that things are going, it’s just going to get more crowded, with housing and cars for foreigners getting more expensive.
I understand that Tamil is an official language of Singapore, but why would their kids be forced to learn Tamil? Especially if they speak English?
It seems bizarre to me that the OP hasn’t factored in language and climate. He is also going to have real trouble with visas considering that his business is based in the US. If you don’t have enough money for a capital investment scheme, then you need to be sponsored by an employer, pretty much wherever you go.
It’s not a matter of his kids being “forced” to learn Tamil, it’s a matter of education in public schools being partly in Tamil. Why should every other child in the school have to be educated exclusively in English? There are many countries where if you want your child to be educated exclusively in English it’s possible, but requires paying for a private school.
But there is a mother tongue policy. Every child has to study a second language. This follows the race of the father. For an indian national father mother tongue default is tamil. You would have to appeal to change it. And the appeal is not a rubber stamp.
Given your criteria, i honestly think staying in the US meets them better than moving elsewhere:
Really, taxes in the US are pretty damn low compared to most of the countries on your list, especially in your income bracket.
In the vast majority of the US, this is not even remotely a concern.
Goes without saying.
You are perfectly free to homeschool in the US.
The alternative to the US system is usually a socialized medical system, which goes hand-in-hand with high income tax. I’ll give you this one though.
Nobody is forcing you to eat fast food / crap in the US. You have plenty of other options. I’d go as far as to say the variety of options and quality of food available to you here in the US is unmatched.
Given the sheer amount of infrastructure in there US, what you are getting for your cost of living is pretty damn good.
So out of all your criteria, Unless you just want a change of scenery I don’t see a huge advantage of moving, aside from the healthcare system.
