Perhaps you could explain what you mean by “too far”? What is so bad in today’s society that you can attribute to “the left” going too far?
Not. See post #317.
The problem IMHO is to try to make the positions of liberals in America to be the same as the extreme left, it is a false equivalency.
That’s not really a clarification, it’s more like backpedalling. Will you be making further references to Stalin and Mao (who, apparently, the American left isn’t actually “anywhere near”) as the thread continues?
Notwithstanding, I remain curious. What has the American left specifically done that in your personal taste has gone too far? If you find the American left distasteful, are you horrified by countries that are more left than the U.S.?
Your example is incomplete. To be even close to fair, the women in your story would not just have to reject the guy, but then go out with a series of lying, sadistic, minority hating, self-pitying whiners who blame all their problems on other people, especially the guy. These men the women go out with buy the women dinner once in a while, sure, but by and large make everyone around the woman miserable and actively spew hatred at a vast majority of the people around them. And, day by day, the women listen to the man, and the women become more hate filled, more vile, and less happy unless they are making others miserable. Until those women are nearly as bad as the guys they have chosen.
In that example, the guy is pretty damn lucky that the women rejected him, because they weren’t going to be a good partner at all.
Now, to complete the example, the guy then sees one of these miserable, spiteful women who had rejected him in the past, on the street. She mimics what her current partner tells her and calls him a series of vile names, accuses him of massive crimes, and says he is the cause of all her problems. When he wipes his brow and says “whew, I’m glad I didn’t end up with you”, she throws a massive fit, spews more obscenities, and runs away complaining at how mean he is for pointing out that her, and many other people’s misery, is her and her partners fault.
Now were getting closer to an actual analogy.
I think there is probably a lot of truth in that. Trump certainly does appeal to those seeking a charismatic authoritative leader.
However, that doesn’t exactly answer my question. To go back to my metaphor about the guy that can’t get a date, what you have is said is something like the guy saying ‘The jocks seem to get dates’
The question I think the left should be asking itself is ‘a lot of people out there must know how incredibly awful Trump is. A lot of those people must be disgusted with the pandering to white spuremacists that seem to have found a home in the radical right. Why aren’t those people on our side? As awful as it is, why do they prefer it to us?’
“a charismatic authoritative leader”
Holy fucking shit, are you even familiar with this fella Trump???
Yep, just another lie. Like everything else the liars claimed to care about. Family, morality, religion, freedom… It was all just a pack of lies and they gave up on it because Trump made them feel special, and they cared about winning more than they cared about hypocrisy.
They say, “We love Trump because X,” but when a Liberal does X they get all ass-hurt and cry about it. They say, “We hate Obama because Y,” and when Trump does Y they suddenly cheer.
Do these people think we will ever take them seriously again?
Yes we really are. That is excellent. That is exactly what the guy sees. ‘All the women are terrible, all the guys they go out with are terrible. I am lucky that none of them want to go out with me.’
It is possible that The guy who can’t get a date is correct. All the women are terrible, all the men who get dates are terrible. He is lucky they won’t date him.
If our guy is getting rejected all the time, and thinks that all the guys that get dates are awful, and all the women are awful, and he is the only good person, and he is lucky he is not getting dates, well, yes, he might be right. I suppose that is within the realm of possibility.
Even accounting for that possible, might it still not behoove our guy to look inward?
They don’t seem to care.
They aren’t.
Because they don’t exist. The Conservatives who actually had ‘morals’ and ‘values’ didn’t vote for Trump. Those who did vote for Trump are - at best - liars and hypocrites. At worst, they are complicit.
If getting those women - odious as they are - is worth giving up his morality, his values, and his self-respect… Yeah. Sure. Why not. :rolleyes:
I think this skips over those who are ignorant, stupid or deluded. And I’m not being flip, or mean…I really think there are plenty of conservatives who voted for Trump who are moral, have values but are ignorant rubes. Granted, the fact that many if not most of them still support him tends to dilute the statement, but I think that many here on this board attribute things to being evil, or liars or hypocrites or whatever instead of considering that not everyone is as smart or educated as they are. Also, I think a lot of folks who voted for Trump did so because, frankly, he was saying a lot of the same stuff they have heard for decades from the left…a lot of stuff that Bernie was in fact saying. The TTP was bad, we could bring those sweet, high paying low skill jobs back to the US by forcing US companies to see the light…all that populist crap. Many blue collar conservative types lapped that stuff up, along with the populist anti-immigration stuff (which, I’ll admit, they didn’t get from the left…that’s good old fashion right wingnuttery). There are certainly a bunch of folks who are conservative and Republican who are just what you and others are saying, but not all.
Fear. And ignorance. Plus a healthy dose of spoiled children taking their marbles and staying home instead of holding their nose and voting for Clinton. And here we are. Happy fucking days are here again…
Harris and Klebold would certainly agree
The whole theme of the board, really, is a group of people so infatuated with themselves that they’d break their own backs patting themselves so hard.
Again, if you think have the country is crooked you are ridiculous and that’s why your side lost. Period. This will be my last post on politics here because again I think it is futile.
You’ll continue being the kings of your echo chamber while the world evolves around you. You will your little arguments because they are insulated from the real world.
I’ll come back for some more politics on this board in 2020 when Donald gets in again and you are all baffled. But I’m sure you’ll just blame it on the entire country being ignorant because they disagree with you.
Irrelevant gibberish. What is your point?
How about you try telling me: What compromise am I supposed to make in order to win voters to my side? Am I supposed to lie? Be racist? Peddle outrageous conspiracy theories? Talk in indecipherable word salad? Because I cannot find even a single value in Trump’s entire fiber which might actually be worth emulating.
You fuckin’ promise? It’s a deal.
Sorry, but anyone buying Donald’s schtick at this point is either ignorant, delusional or they are liars and hypocrite’s. I don’t care if half the country agrees with him or not. The number of folks who think silly or stupid shit doesn’t legitimize their stupidity or make them right. It doesn’t work that way.
However, I think you are wrong. I think that the buzzards will come back to roost long before 2020, and The Donald will be lucky if he just goes down in flaming defeat and is allowed to slink away. Feel free to come back and make me eat crow if he gets re-elected and if our economy isn’t completely tanked due to his stupid, populist shit.
Well, I have yet to see any other comprehensible explanation for why ostensibly virtuous people would vote for a narcissistic lying racist.
This is literally the definition of being conservative, dumbfuck. The rest of the world is changing, and it is you who is trapped in your 1950’s fairy-tale moral universe.
“Black people! WAAAH! Cops held accountable! WAAAAH! Mexicans! WAAAAH! Gays! WAAAAAH! Why can’t things be like they were when I was a kid? WAAAAH!” Jesus fuck, you people whine and scream and bitch every time things change and then you come here and say WE have a problem with being left behind? What the epic fuck?
Well, the ignorant fucks voted him once and don’t seem to comprehend the mistake they have made, so I see no reason to believe they’ll figure it out in four years. Since we can’t get through to these fuckwits with actual facts and reason, there’s nothing left to do but out-vote them.
What are they seeing in us? Their defeat.
That is, to paraphrase what somebody pointed out in another thread I can’t remember now (but I think it’s related to this article), conservatives starting with Reagan have had three major policy pillars:
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Hawkish on defense (even if Democratic presidents have actually ended up presiding over more military actions) and “bayonet diplomacy” for aggressively supporting foreign regimes friendly to our aims (even if not so friendly to their own citizens’ well-being).
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Laissez-faire economics with low regulation for businesses, low taxes for the wealthy, and low support levels for workers’ rights, welfare for the poor, and environmental protection.
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“Family values” social conservatism, including legal marriage restricted to one man/one woman, “traditional” demographics with a solid white Christian majority and low immigration rates, and strong pushback against “political correctness” and government antidiscrimination regulations.
The problem for conservatives nowadays is that all those pillars are crumbling. Desperately trying to prop them up is not working, and they haven’t figured out anything else to replace them with.
Pillar #3 is a lost cause except for some rearguard actions like attacking abortion rights and immiserating immigrants, along with heightened belligerence towards protests against racism and sexism. Ultimately, the USA is getting less white, less Christian, and less socially conservative, and that ship will not be un-sailed.
Pillar #2 has been getting harder and harder to prop up since the 2008 crash, even despite the Obama/Trump growth economy, as so many ordinary Americans have had to contend with increasing career insecurity and workloads and debt, while the 1% have been absorbing ever larger proportions of wealth and income. More and more people are getting suspicious of the conservative mantra that what’s good for the wealthy is good for America, and the proportion of Americans who actually admit to having a positive opinion of :eek: socialism is larger than at any time since the 1930’s.
Pillar #1 was supposed to be triumphantly vindicated by the spectacle of flourishing free-market democracies (well, okay, America-friendly oligarchies, but potayto-potahto, right?) in Iraq and Afghanistan, and even the most ardent GW Bush hawks aren’t trying to sell that line anymore.
Conservatives had decades of ardent support and government majorities to make their vision of conservative governance succeed, and they failed on all counts. When they look at us liberals, what they see is a reminder that even though they had money and cronies and power, they couldn’t make good on their hollow promises to “return” America to their imagined golden age.
So they have now retreated to concentrate on a few basic goals that they do feel sure of achieving: namely, cutting taxes for the wealthy, sabotaging democratic principles in favor of shady backroom deals, and keeping their base riled up and their anger deflected by continually Pissing Off the Liberals. And from the point of view of those goals, Trump is obviously an ideal choice of President.
Of course they prefer sticking with Trump to joining us. Joining us would mean actually coming to terms with the fundamental defeat of conservative delusions that’s underlying their current extinction-burst tantrumming and chest-pounding. No way they’re going to sack up to confront that.
And that’s literally all they’ve got. For the last two years, they’ve controlled all three branches of government. Where is the Obamacare repeal? They had no problem voting for it when it couldn’t pass, but once it becomes possible suddenly they can’t muster the courage anymore. Where is the anti-abortion legislation? I mean, fuck, single issue voters just line up every election hoping to end abortion but I haven’t heard a peep about it. School vouchers? Remember when that was a thing? I know people who voted for Trump just because they wanted school vouchers I mean, Jesus Christ, I know one person who voted for Trump because he was the pro-war candidate, and I know someone else who voted for Trump because he was the pro-peace candidate. The dumb fuckers can’t even agree on what the hell Trump is for or against.
But I absolutely believe AnthonyElite is right. The retards will show up every single year and vote for the same dumb fuckers, over and over and over. Those anti-abortion voters have voted for the same party every year for decades and have precious little to show for it, but they’ll just keep on doing it because NEXT TIME they’ll have a leader who means what he says. NEXT TIME it will be different. NEXT TIME those RINOS will get kicked out. It doesn’t matter if the Republicans deliver on their promises or not because there is no rational connection between their policies and their votes. The only thing that seems to have any connection AT ALL is their desire to win for the sake of winning.
Well, you did it. You won. The dog finally caught the car, and he had NO FUCKING CLUE what he was supposed to do with it.
What are you even trying to achieve by voting for Trump in 2020? What part of the Republican agenda could there possibly be left to accomplish? Please, someone, explain it to me. You’ve had total control of the Federal Government for two years now, and almost nothing to show for it. I’m honestly stunned that Trump even has any unfinished goals that would require another six years to accomplish. We had the dumbfuck Ryan promising us that Republican governance would lead to some kind of Ayn Rand utopia, and now that his party has the power to accomplish all of his policies, where is he? Oh, he quit? Really? That doesn’t sound like something a man at the height of his powers and influence would do. Unless he was a massive bullshit artist who got more out of beating a drum than accomplishing anything concrete.
But, sure, you’ll vote for Trump in 2020. I have no doubt about that. It pisses off the libtards, and you get to win for the sake of winning. And that’s all that matters. And I know it’s all that matters, because every other single thing you claimed to care about has turned out to be a giant, steaming pile of shit.
Of course. Self reflection is an amazing thing. There’s a reason the Greeks out “know thyself” on their temples.
It is entirely possible the guy is the problem.
Except, here in reality, that’s where your analogy falls apart. Because, here in reality, the guy actually found out that a majority of women he asked would go out with him. Here, in the real world, the guy doesn’t have to rely on the first few poor choices he made, he actually convinced plenty of women to go out with him. Heck, more women went out with him than didnt. Does that mean he missed out on those other women? Sure. But he’s much better off without them.