Biden White House fires and otherwise ostricizes staffers for acknowledging they used marijuana in the past

In 2020, there were over 1,000 Federal convictions for marijuana trafficking, and marijuana was the primary drug in 7% of all Federal drug cases..

Now it’s true, that’s trafficking, not simple possession, which it’s true the Federal government rarely prosecutes. The most recent statistics I could find for that are from 2017, when there were only 92 convictions for simple marijuana possession. Note, however, that accounts for 43% of all Federal convictions for simple drug possession. The Federal government rarely prosecutes simple drug possession cases overall, but it’s still illegal.

People did something illegal and are being chastised for it? No way!

Maybe he fired them before Kamala could put them in jail.

Wait… Didn’t Kamala admit to smoking pot in the past? I wonder how the people fired for the same thing feel about that?

And what did you expect from one of the authors of the 1994 crime bill? Joe Biden has been a drug warrior and authoritarian his whole life. And his VP is a prosecutor who delighted in throwing small time drug offenders in jail. She bragged about it, just as Joe bragged about his bill being so strict it nearly threw jaywalkers in jail.

The mystery is why anyone expected something different.

In the states where it is legal at the state level, it’s not being prosecuted, but it’s still illegal at the federal level everywhere.

I very much want to see it legalized everywhere. I have a strong aversion for multiple reasons to breaking the law. It’s legal in my state, but I don’t use because it’s still illegal at the federal level. I am not surprised that other people don’t view it that way, but if you’re going to work in the White House, I think you should. I think far past use should not be a problem.

Also, it’s not legal at the state level in plenty of states. It’s possible people who admitted recent use also admitted using in states where it’s illegal. Lots of people may think those laws are dumb (I do) but we want people in the White House who don’t think they get to pick and choose which laws to obey.

As the Daily Beast article in the closed thread says, people whose use was exclusive to states where cannabis is legal were blackballed along with everyone else.

For those who say use in the “far” past is OK but “recent” past is not, where’s the line, and why there and not somewhere else?

If your stance is that you don’t want people who have broken Federal laws in the Whitehouse, isn’t breaking the Federal law X years ago (or whenever) just as wrong as breaking the law X years minus one day ago (or whenever)?

Why not draw the line, say, at the day you were hired? Biden could have done that, and I wager few outside of the Tucker Carlson crowd would have fussed, and they are in a perpetual state of apoplexy anyway. Conversely, the majority would have either lauded it or said meh.

And that’s the point: The continued proscription is pointless, opaque and arbitrary. In other words, BS.

I haven’t seen or read anything from a closed thread.

As to the far past issue, I think if someone can show that they have a solid history of obeying the law and using good judgment going back for some time, then marijuana use, and other similarly petty offenses, in the past can be viewed as not a reflection on who that person is now.

The problem is that cannabis is illegal in all the states, regardless of what that state has to say about it.

No it isn’t.

Article from first locked thread

How do you figure?

As an example, here’s some of what Colorado has to say about it:

My bold.

https://www.colorado.gov/pacific/marijuana/federal-implications

So “recent” disregard for the rule of law (insofar as marijuana use is concerned) is the basis for axing these staffers. But aren’t things like “solid history” and “some time” rather opaque and arbitrary, and aren’t opaqueness and arbitrariness the opposite of the rule of law?

I used to be involved in background investigations for security clearances. Just to be clear: I was not an investigator, nor was I involved in deciding to issue or deny clearances. I handled the initial applications, reviewed the final determinations, and had contact with the investigators. This was also about 15 years ago. With all of that being said:

There were a lot of kinds of derogatory information where there were no bright lines. If you had a shoplifting conviction 10 years ago and no other criminal record, you’d almost certainly be cleared. If you had two convictions in the last five years and were currently awaiting trial for a third arrest, you’d be denied. It’s always a judgement call. It’s not always “fair”, but that’s how judgement calls work.

From what I understood of the process, there are a number of factors taken into account. Marijuana use was always treated more leniently than other Schedule I drugs (and this was 15 years ago, before decriminalization and legalization were widespread). Occasional or casual use were treated differently than habitual use (and yes, that distinction was also a bit squishy, but there were questions about frequency - once a week, two or three times a week, daily, etc.). Recency was a big thing - as I recall, one of the big bright lines was use within the last six months (I may well be misremembering, but I think there was actually an explicit and formal question on the SF86 about drug use in the last six months).

Now, that was all for security clearance applications in the U.S. Army, which is not the same as the background investigation for a White House position. But it’s not entirely different.

And this is all well-established procedure with decades of precedent. It’s not like the Biden White House decided on this policy out of the blue. Drug use, including prior drug use, has been grounds for denying and terminating White House employment for decades. It’s been a standard element of background investigations and background questionnaires throughout the Executive Branch for decades.

What’s new is that most states have decriminalized or legalized marijuana use or authorized it for “medicinal” use (wink, wink, nudge, nudge), and there’s been a sea change in public perception of its use. A lot of people (including many in this thread) don’t think twice about recreational marijuana use, so there are a now a lot of ambitious young would-be staffers who have openly used marijuana, and are running into trouble when they apply for sensitive positions in the Federal government. Because it’s still a Federal crime, and the policy on that hasn’t changed in decades, and can’t change until the Federal law is changed.

Are you a lawyer? I’m not either, but your statement appears to be incorrect.

@Smapti is absolutely correct. Marijuana use is not a violation of state laws in all states, but it’s a violation of Federal law in all states. Marijuana use is not legal anywhere in the United States. It’s a Schedule I drug. There are other activities, such as espionage, that aren’t violations of state laws, but I don’t think anyone would argue that someone that admitted to espionage could reasonably claim they shouldn’t be fired from the White House because there was no state law against it in the state where it occurred.

It is illegal in every state according to the Federal Government. Federal agents could go in and pile up a mountain of arrests in any state allowing marijuana use. They don’t, but they still make it a headache for marijuana enterprises to operate even when legal at the state level.

Don’t the board rules limit discussions of marijuana because it is not legal in every state? Or because it is illegal in every state at the federal level?

But marijuana is a political issue, this isn’t about how to obtain marijuana or how to use marijuana.

The point that I and others are making is that this in an opportunity for President Biden to take a stance on marijuana usage and get off of the fence. Apparently he is sending a clear message about which side of the fence he is on and some people are not happy with it.

If he is not sending a message that there is zero tolerance for marijuana usage in his administration then he should go into more detail about why these staffers were disqualified. I know he doesn’t have to, but if he wants to clear up the issue he should do so or face political backlash from his own supporters because he is creating internal strife in his own party and at time he should not be doing so.

I was pointing out to a mod (acting as a regular Doper) that not only is it illegal in every state, the board rules are affected because of that.

Of course it’s a stupid law. Every state and federal marijuana law should be removed. Other drugs can be discussed but at this point it is absurd to maintain this stupid attitude about marijuana. This attitude about weed is the only thing to point out about Biden where he is just too old and totally doesn’t get it.

From the OP’s article:

It’s not at all clear that anyone was fired just for “acknowledging they used marijuana in the past.” I, for one, don’t feel like I have enough information to decide whether the White House’s actions were justified or not.

Just a bit of anecdotal information.

My sister-in-law, a former regular user of cannabis, was in-line for a Federal job that required a security clearance, and at that point, she stopped using. Some 3 - 4 months later, after admitting to being a regular user on her security paperwork, she was called in for a security interview. She admitted again to being a former user.

The reaction from the interviewer was along the lines of, “Being honest about the use was a good thing, stopping was a good thing, and because you were honest, it won’t be a problem for your clearance. However, you will need to test clean today, and we will periodically check to be sure you stay clean. You ok with that?”

She has the job, but has had to be tested roughly monthly. Perhaps some of these sidelined workers failed one of these criteria? Details are quite lacking.

Besides the specifics of marijuana, I personally think part of the issue is that a lot of the “security risks” are based on “what could be used as pressure”. I think that US drug policy is such that they set themselves up for this to be an issue. After all, if the stigma isn’t there, or the threat of prison isn’t there, there’s no pressure. Of course, I also generally don’t want to hear about the “threat” of an individual person somewhere when the last four years under Trump was a massive national security nightmare.