On your first point, how is a government sponsored “happy pill” not a violation of privacy…particularly if use thereof is mandated or even encouraged? What happens between my ears is none of your damn business.
On your second point, huh? Blues ain’t necessarily about “evil”. Hard luck happens. Spouses/SOs cheat. That ain’t gonna change when everybody drinks the kool-aid.
Who said anything about force ? You sound like you would have condemned the invention of aspirin as the incoming wedge to a mind control based fascist state.
Well if it doesn’t change then it won’t go away and you have nothing to worry about.
Well, the OP did talk about making it a major funding priority, and trying to get the whole world on board. Guess I sorta read some form of coercion into it. I’m cynical that way. Sorta like you on religion or military stuff, but with a staunch libertarian twist.
Were you cynical about the successful worldwide effort to eliminate smallpox too?
Smallpox erradication didn’t involve rewiring the brain, now did it?
Why is living at the whim of the Darwinian dice roll so much better than an “intelligently designed” brain?
Because I don’t want anybody designing my brain. They ain’t smarter than me, probably not as funny, and they may defang this curmudgeon into some kinda candyassed do goodnik.
I wanna keep my fangs. Never know when I might wanna eat a starry eyed liberal.
Except that in the long run it will be the people who are willing to redesign themselves that inherit the Earth, barring some sort of collapse of civilization or a worldwide tyranny. They won’t care about your “fangs”; they’ll be far too superior to consider someone who chose primitivism a threat.
Yeah right. And peace will guide our planet while we seek our destiny among the stars.
“Primitivism” is the way the world has worked throughout history. There ain’t never gonna be a “Heaven on Earth”. Wide-spread brain design just makes it easier to control the masses. I choose to live free, or die trying.
Since the alternative is the destruction of the species or a collapse of civilization, most likely.
Well, duh, given the lack of genetic engineering and such. It’s not like anyone has had a choice in the matter.
Yes, yes, only the greedy and malignant conservatives stand for freedom; people who mean well are always tyrants in disguise. Standard conservative nonsense.
The lack of genetic engineering preserves choice. Free will is a good thing.
Yes, yes, only the pablum puking liberals who think the world owes them a living and government should solve all their problems know truth. Standard liberal drivel.
“Free will” is a nonsense concept". And we are controlled by our genes quite extensively anyway; you don’t need genetic engineering for that. And I note your automatic assumption that genetic engineering would be used to further restrict and not expand our freedom.
My comment was in response to your statement; yours is just a mirror of mine. Not an actual counter.
So you’re saying genes = God? I’m afraid we’ll have to vote you out of the atheist club for that one. Well, we would, if we had a club, with meetings, and stuff.
I’m controlled by my own will, which is, in fact, free. I evaluate alternatives, and make choices. those choices are not always wise…but they are mine. The far left are agenda whores same as the far right. Fuck labels. A lefty can have a good idea. So can a righty. All liberals are not evil. Misguided, naive, and entertaining sometimes…but not evil. Same for conservatives.
A pill that changes “I hate mowing the lawn, but I gotta do it else I’ll get fined by the city…” to “Cool! Its time to mow the lawn again.”? Sign me up please.
We are all controlled in a variety of ways, almost all of them negative. If I don’t mow, I will suffer an escalating series of responses that will eventually result in the forfeiture of my property. This is control, or lack of it, depending on your perspective.
So, lets pretend you had a choice. Choice 1 is If you don’t mow your lawn, the city will come by and fine you, thus motivating you to do it with an unpleasant penalty. Or, Mow the lawn, or the city will come by and give you a pill so that you like mowing your lawn, thus motivating you to do it with a reward.
You have no choice in either circumstance. The lawn has to be mowed. But option 1 is a punishment. Option 2 is, well, perhaps reward isn’t the correct response, but at least you’d enjoy it.
(Yes, mowing is trivial, but substitute any activity in there that you dislike but have to do anyway if the example bugs you.)
I’ve known a few people throughout my life that were always happy, always chipper, willing to help, eagerly attacked their books when it came to study time, had fun on their off time. Perhaps they just put on a good act, but perhaps, their brains are just wired a bit differently than normal, and they were just genuinely happy almost all the time through some quirk of upbringing or brain chemistry. Why is it wrong to wish for that?
Wishing for it, and trusting the government to provide it are two very different things.
If you really need to get your mellow on, it’s got to come from within. As for me, I can endure the bad times as they come. Makes me appreciate the good times even more.
What makes you think otherwise? Do you really trust the government, and all future governments, to do what is ethical?
I’m pointing out the simply fact that we are heavily influenced by our genes.
No, it’s not. “Free will” is an impossibility, a nonsense concept. We are ignorant of most of our mental processes, and we label our ignorance “free will”.
We have some control over the government, and they are known to often be well meaning. Evolution is neither benevolent nor under our control. We aren’t free NOW. And improving our minds when we have the opportunity could make our enslavement at the hands of a future tyranny less likely, depending on the improvements made. Doing nothing certainly won’t protect us.
And a government that intends to use such technology for tyranny isn’t going to bother asking permission. So the “I don’t want to !” position is fairly irrelevant.
Happiness is something that is very and to measure. There are effects of one’s past that can also block happiness. If one is exposed to such things as you should find happiness in your freedom from children then you start believing it. And start feeling resentful when you find one who is truly happy with children and take delight in cutting them down by word and deed (i.e. saying they are setting back women’s rights etc.) .
Some people, particularly women, take great delight in the raising of their children. It is in giving of themselves selflessly that they receive so much happiness. In our society we have unfortunatly learned to be selfish, even having children as a status symbol. All these selfish efforts do not obtain that level of happiness. The first group will be happy while the second will not, though they may statistically appear to be the same group.
Biologically we are ‘programmed’ to preserve our young, as most animals are (i.e. getting between a moma bear and her cubs), which means we are biologically programmed to give of ourselves for others, sometimes to our own death. It is society and the way of the world that distorts this into a selfish act of self over others. A lie we are taught very young.
I see this as a fantastic idea for animal agriculture. These are creatures we’re going to kill and eat eventually. We expect nothing of them, no accomplishments, except that they get fat and tasty. I would love to have an inexpensive treatment for these animals to make their lives be filled with bliss and happiness.
For humans? Not so much. The law of unintended consequences would wake up and throw a crazy party if people started doing this, I think.
If we can come up with a method to get rid of biological depression (that is, unhappiness that has little connection to the outside world and that cannot be cured by changes in behavior), that sounds wonderful. But coming up wtih something that gets rid of situational depression seems like an awful idea.
I’m reminded of Wittgenstein, a wonderfully miserable philosopher who never smiled. His last words were, “tell them it’s been wonderful!”
Unless we understand what he was saying, we shouldn’t even think about abolishing unhappiness.
Daniel
If we are all blissful and suffer nothing, then what makes us individuals? Yes, we have no absolute free will, yes genetics plays a role but, each person’s moments of pain define who they are, more than each moment of joy.
Adversity defines us as individuals not joy.
Sure, it seems noble to end human suffering but, at the same time why bother if you end up killing the patient with the cure? End suffering and what is left isn’t human. What is the point?