I will bite my tongue and not say what I actually think.
Any labour where the baby was crowning for 4 hours before delivery and was able to be successfully resuscitated was nothing short of a goddamn miracle.
That is NOT the happy tale you think- that is a story of a narrowly avoided tragedy.
Breathing is a reflex- it doesn’t require brain power or effort- if a neonate doesn’t take a breath something more than “tiredness” is going on.
I don’t doubt she is a good midwife, but stillbirths occur in 1-2% of all pregnancies. If she hasn’t encountered one it is more likely to be due to chance than special skills.
Babies get tired during birth. There are a thousand factors that can account for a tired baby, moms pelvis is malformed due to something in her past, or from birth, or she is small stature…all kinds of things.
I am not going to argue about whether or not our midwife is experienced or not.
And for the LOVE OF OG, I am not someone who thinks hospitals are horror shows! Jeez! And if you had you baby in a hospital [this is directed at everyone] GOOD, I am happy it went well and you have a happy baby.
Getting over the fear to me means being informed of options. OF COURSE I know giving birth is risky!
Yes, all kinds of things that cause labor not to progress and therefore can cause oxygen deprivation. When I said what does “tired” mean in this context, I meant what is actually causing the tiredness? Babies do not crawl through the birth canal, they are not working their own way out, they aren’t tired in the sense that someone who just ran a marathon is tired…they pretty much just are curled up in there getting pushed out. If they appear “tired,” it’s because they have not been getting enough oxygen, which is a very very serious situation.
I believe that your midwife is experienced, I believe she has good skills. I do not believe she has good judgment, if she says that there is little that would necessitate transfer once the baby starts to come and if she allows the pushing stage to continue for 4 hours once the baby’s head is crowning.
And I’m not against home birth, I think it’s a reasonable choice in a lot of situations.
Pardon me for saying so, but you really don’t seem to understand the risks at all. I don’t mean a vague idea that birth is risky, but rather that you understand the specific risks that are the most likely to occur.
On the one hand it’s certainly safer to give birth in a hospital in the rare chance that something bad happens. And certainly if it is a high-risk pregancy that’s what should happen.
On the other hand we had our baby in the hospital and it was a miserable experience for my wife. Loud noises all night long. When she wanted to sleep the nurses were intrusive; when she wanted some water the nurses ignored her. I can totally see why someone would want to avoid going through that.
If I was planning a home birth, it would concern me how blase and unspecific your midwife is being about the possible risks (as you describe it). For instance, the question about when a transport would be required was answered with “There are very reasons.” Did she actually give you some? Did she discuss the warning signs leading up to these, and what opportunities you would be given to make the decision to go?
Also her use of the word stillborn - that has only one meaning I have ever heard, and that is a dead baby. She sounds like she is saying a lot to convince you of all the upsides, and not being totally realistic about the downsides.
Anyway, hope everything goes well. I have a friend who did a home birth - piece of advise is that if you are planning a water birth, buy a strainer/colander as you may well need it to fish out feces - and you really don’t want to be using your own strainer for that!
And just a data point for the other side - I had an ob who was really supportive of my no-medication birthplan (no medication so as to not impact the baby unnecessarily, not because of any ‘primordial bonding hormones’ - oxytosin through lactation is more a factor as far as I know), laboured at home with my mum and partner for 38 hours and arrived at hospital ready to push in case anything unexpected happened. Half and hour later and there she was. So hospitals and medical staff can be very supportive, just in case you end up in that situation.
Me too, but mostly because we don’t have the midwife’s words or experiences here, just a layperson’s understanding and interpretations of them. I know patients have got some weird misunderstandings of things I’ve heard doctors tell them myself.
Yeah, I really didn’t mean to imply that it was stupid or silly. I understand full well, having experienced it, the comfort that comes from familiar and loved music, etc. Phlophr is clearly an invested and active partner, but is not the one who is actually going to be going through the labor. He can have any vision he wants, but these things don’t always go as planned, and seemingly innocuous things can turn out to be irritating or nauseating or make a person homicidal. That was really the source of my (mild) laughing.
Yes, yes it did. It was actually something I’ve always thought about when home births come up, though. I know what a freakin’ blood and poop and vomit show my labors were, and I was pretty grateful that someone else was cleaning it up.
Really? My apologies that ‘consideration of any tact when speaking to others’ was not taught to you in kindergarten.
[QUOTE=Girl From Mars]
If I was planning a home birth, it would concern me how blase and unspecific your midwife is being about the possible risks (as you describe it). For instance, the question about when a transport would be required was answered with “There are very reasons.” Did she actually give you some? Did she discuss the warning signs leading up to these, and what opportunities you would be given to make the decision to go?
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We just met with her for the second time and all of my responses are only from my understanding of what is about to happen to my wife and me. I trust her, but I am not speaking for her, in fact, I am probably only getting a fraction of what she said to me correct or at least accurate. The bottom line is her stories, and her experience coupled with her track record both anecdotally and with the state of Colorado are enough for me and Mrs.P.
[QUOTE=Sarahfeena]
Yes, all kinds of things that cause labor not to progress and therefore can cause oxygen deprivation. When I said what does “tired” mean in this context, I meant what is actually causing the tiredness? Babies do not crawl through the birth canal, they are not working their own way out, they aren’t tired in the sense that someone who just ran a marathon is tired…they pretty much just are curled up in there getting pushed out. If they appear “tired,” it’s because they have not been getting enough oxygen, which is a very very serious situation.
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Not that I do not believe you, but I’d love a cite for this as it is the exact opposite of what I have been told in the “Birthing from Within” book and class. And my Doc said that baby is going to be “tired” when s\he comes out, both baby and momma are going to be completely spent.
Meh. There’s one person in this whole fiasco I give a shit about, and it’s not you, wife, or your midwife. Too bad you don’t give as much of a shit about this person as some stranger on the internet, but odds are everything will turn out fine anyway.
During the first hour or so after birth, a newborn is typically in a “quiet alert” state. This is a good time to try the first breastfeeding, if the mom is up for it. After that, the baby usually goes to sleep.
It is not normal for the baby to already be asleep, or not breathing, when first born.
Cite (but just one of many I could have picked from): AboutKidsHealth
Something else I recalled from my friend’s home birth - she had a team of 2-3 rostered midwives as it was expected that labour could be long, and they wanted the midwife on duty to be alert and well rested - that perhaps is a question I would have for your midwife. Is she planning on being up and awake for what could be a couple of days?
Your comment struck me because my hand is used to being on my wife’s belly feeling the “one person” kick and move etc…they are on the forefront of my mind. It bothers me not to read insensitive comments, especially from a public message board, but it is my own folly to think *this *message board had fewer people making inconsiderate comments.
She and her back-up take turns at night. They are on shifts during the day, I wondered this as well, and we have a large down stairs with it’s own bedrooms and living room for them to sleep in or take a break in.
Then maybe ask yourself (and discuss with your wife) the following: is giving birth at home the best choice for the baby?
Personally, if I decided to home birth because my wife wanted to eat grapes and drink tea and have some mystical cosmic birthing experience and then something happened with the baby that could have been avoided with a hospital birth, I’d feel like a complete shithead for the rest of my life.
I have no idea what your Doc means by “tired” in regards to the baby. MsWhatsit’s cite is a good explanation of what the baby’s reactions will be like in the first few hours, I personally have never seen it described as “tired,” and my experience with my two babies were that they were both wide awake for quite a while after birth. Either way, I know for sure that the baby is not supposed to be grey, floppy, or in need of resuscitation.
Me too. However, my wife is not asking for grapes, tea or anything like that. She may just want quiet, then a walk on the porch, then a dip in the tub, then…who knows??? I certainly don’t. You speak as if we have done zero research, like we have not spoken to a physician and a midwife and a doula…home birth has a bad rap but not because of people like us. We are not militant about hating hospitals or anything, when weighing the pros and cons we find home birth a viable, and safe method for bringing this baby into the world. It’s not for everyone and we are completely aware and respectful of that fact.
[QUOTE=Sarahfeena]
I have no idea what your Doc means by “tired” in regards to the baby. MsWhatsit’s cite is a good explanation of what the baby’s reactions will be like in the first few hours, I personally have never seen it described as “tired,” and my experience with my two babies were that they were both wide awake for quite a while after birth. Either way, I know for sure that the baby is not supposed to be grey, floppy, or in need of resuscitation.
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I am pretty sure the doc meant that some births can take a toll on the baby irregardless of where they are born. And for some newborns…they are tired. I wish I had done this before so I could give it a better name, but this is my first rodeo when it comes to supporting someone giving birth.
The story my midwife told is second hand and if that little boy was one of the statistics for things going horribly wrong at home, then I guess she has seen quite a lot, not just the happy endings. But the child survived because of whatever this midwife and her team did. I do not have the medical knowledge or personal experience to say much more about that story.
I had all three babies in a hospital with wonderful staff and doctors. Home birth would never be my choice (I HATE PAIN!). So many choices exist and so many factors are at play.
I wanted to ask:
How far are you from a hospital “just in case?”
Have you toured the birthing facilities at the hospital? Some of them are truly amazing with an atmosphere that is much less hospital, and more home-like? The hospital I was in encouraged walking, showering, any position for birth ect.
Has your Dr. worked with your midwife before? Do they work well together and trust each other?
IMHO I think that as long as you are willing to stay flexible and adapt to whatever may come, things should be OK.
