Bizzaro world of Canadian Politics

This is just stunning
So Belinda Stronach joins the Liberal party over “a matter of principle” ?!!?!
What the hell is happening?!?

With her defection it looks more and more likely that the Liberals will not only remain in power but are likely to consolidate and eventually gain a majority again.

Here is a woman that joined a party and ran for its leadership and now suddenly shifts over to a party who supposedly has a different set of values and vision of the country. It makes no sense aside from pure political oppurtunism.

So two questions:
Should Belinda be punished by her constituants for her betrayal?

Will Canada survive this Government with the likely hood that Quebec will go to the Bloc and the West will go to The conservatives. Can confederation survive with two regional parties in Parliment and no real National Party?

It does if you know a little about her political views. In retrospect, I’m surprised this didn’t happen earlier. She’s been increasingly at odds with the Tories on all manner of social issues, she thinks that the budget needs to pass because of the measures it contains that would benefit her constituents, and she’s uncomfortable with the Tories’ alliance with the Bloc.

It’s startling, I grant you, but it’s not implausible. If she wanted to be opportunist, she would have stayed with the Tories and gotten handily reelected in the next election. As it is, she’ll have a fight on her hands, as you note.

And if I can point out, when she ran for its leadership, the Conservatives didn’t have any principles at all – literally; it was a new party with no policy document. She ran in order to help set the course for the party as a fiscally conservative, socially liberal party. When that didn’t work and the party began to move away from her own positions, she sought a different party. There’s nothing unusual about that.

Budgets come and go. Or if you’re a liberal they show up every so often, it’s not like they’re really needed. :slight_smile: Ok that was a few years back.

Of course I’m looking at this as a cut the cancer out first then figure a way for the federal government to expand into a provincal sphere. I suppose Ms. Stronach is looking at it as … well not my way.

C’mon you really think that she didn’t cross because of the Cabinet post offered her? If she wanted to satnd on principle then she should have either become an independant or vote against her party.

shrug. I would’ve held out for a better spot than HR.

The interesting thing about this picture is not Stronach’s personal choices but the fact that there apparently is no place in Canadian politics for a fiscally conservative, socially liberal party. Why is that?

(In the U.S., the Democrats are a fiscally conservative, socially liberal party – or at least they were in the Clinton years.)

We had a fiscally-conservative, socially-liberal (or at least libertarian) federal party: the Progressive Conservatives.

Most people would say that the former Progressive Conservative party (before it folded and merged with Reform into the current Conservative party) fit your description pretty well. I would also add that many consider the current incarnation of the Liberal party (at least in the Chretien era) to be fairly fiscally conservative and socially liberal, having partially occupied the ‘space’ vacated after the implosion of the Progressive Conservatives in 1993.

I’m not all that surprised that Stronach left the Conservatives. It was increasingly clear that her outlook was at odds with the rest of the party. Stephen Harper must be freaking out at the moment.

That used to be the territory of the Progressive Conservatives, or at least their rhetoric (Mulroney spent more than Trudeau). The new Conservative party likes to put on the air that they’ve inherited the same territory but clearly they haven’t. The PCs technically still exist, but have about 15 members. I’d argue that the Greens come closest to that combo, but they don’t have a profile yet with most Canadians other than “environment”.

She’s taken the quick and easy route to power. Soon she will betray the Jedi and embrace the dark power of the Sith.

(Fans of Montreal morning radio may have heard me make a similar comment to Tommy Schnurmacher around 11:35 a.m.)

I am constantly amazed at the acceptance of those who “cross the floor”. In Stronach’s case (as with Bouchard) it’s nothing more than crass opportunism. Stronach has done NOTHING other than be born fabulously wealthy and is exploiting this singular gift for her own gratification. The Liberal party’s sobriquet “the natural governing party” says it all. If you are principled you do not believe in a one party state, she was elected to oppose until such time as her party can form a government. My hope is she’ll wind up like Garth Turner. (who dat?)

If she’s a crass opportunist (and she may well be), she has a funny way of showing it: there will be a general election, if not next week, then at least within the next six months, and she’s just guaranteed herself a much tougher time at the polls.

Yeah, we get some of those here, too . . .

Our ballots are better designed, though, so we have fewer excuses.

I’ve got mixed feelings on this.

On the one hand, I really, really don’t like Harper, and so anything that’s bad news for him is something I like to hear.

On the other hand, I would very much like to see the Conservative Party’s position moderate (at least on social issues) so that they can gain credibility and become a truly national party, and for that to happen there need to be prominent caucus members advocating socially progressive views. Stronach’s defection certainly doesn’t help this cause.

The gripping hand is that she was born with a silver spoon in her hand and it’s not clear that she actually merits being anyone of importance.

Looks like Thursday might be interesting. Now there’s a story on the Globe and Mail’s site that says Danny Williams (Newfie premier) has been pressuring the Tory MPs from Newfoundland to vote for the budget, and they aren’t saying that they won’t.

If my math is correct, a tie is now likely, which means the budget passes.

This would also explain why the Liberals fought tooth and nail to reject a non-confidence vote a week ago and demand that one be held this week, even though some very sick MP’s had flown in from their cancer treatments. In short, they managed to buy another vote and keep their pathetic hold on government intact.

The Liberals have added something like 20 billion dollars in spending in the last three weeks in order to buy votes in Ontario. So much for ‘fiscally conservative’. Now they’ve bought a conservative vote by promising her a cabinet position.

Frankly, if the Liberals consolidate their power after all this, I hope a revived Alberta separatist party rises, and I’ve never been a separatist. But the craven levels of corruption and desperate clutches at power at the expense of the country by the Liberals is making me sick. We’re turning into a freaking banana republic in front of my eyes.

budget math:

lib 133 - 1 (speaker) - 1 (effords, pairing) + ndp 19 + ind 1 (parrish) = 151

con 98 - 1 (stinson, pairing) + bloc 54 + ind 1 (kilgour) = 152

it still comes down to ind cadman, who has apparently not made up his mind yet as to which way he’ll vote.

interestingly, there is also the possibility of the two st. john’s con mps voting w/ the government, or least abstaining. plus who knows if any libs may come down with “diplomatic flu” on thursday, as libs are far better positioned for election than the cons, at the moment.

I thought Kilgour’s current position is that he’ll vote for the budget.