Stories of bad moonshine or simply “tainted” alcohol sometimes result in the drinker going blind.
Blind? As in “totally dark ‘who turned out the lights?’” blind? or more of a “really badly blurred vision” sort of way?
How rapid is the onset of this condition?
How long does it last?
What’s happening physiologically to cause the blindness?
Blindness brought on by methanol poisoning is indeed permanent. Methanol is converted to formaldehyde by an enzyme the liver; and formaldehyde in the bloodstream attacks the optic nerves.
You know, this Thread had one reply before I posted here, but 128 views.
Makes me wonder ‘bout them hard-drinkin’ Dopers…
Had to get m’specs before I could reply [hic!]
That’s the answer to the question.
Here’s an interesting fact: the enzyme that converts methanol to formaldehyde also converts ethanol to acetalaldehyde. To prevent a dangerous building up formaldehyde in the body, ER teams treating methanol poisoning will introduce an ethanol IV drip, to outcompete the methanol → formaldehyde pathway.
Which is why some hospitals, at least in Sweden, are frequently visited by alcoholics who have purposefully ingested methanol to get the ethanol treatment.
It’s also why intravenous ethanol was one of the critical products where I worked - we (QC Lab) needed to get the lots tested and out the door to the hospitals ASAP, because there is a relatively constant, high demand for stock. I had to work overtime one weekend in 2006 because there was a shortage in British Columbia (I have no idea what series of events led to that; that’s just what my supervisor told me at the time).
So is it total, in the dark, blindness?
I have always understood “blind drunk” to have nothing to do with methanol poisoning.
Instead, it refers to a state you can get to using plain old ethanol where, shortly before your BAC crosses over into unconsciousness territory, you lose some or all of your senses, vision usually being the first to go. IOW, you’re upright, conscious, talking / haranguing, but unable to see, and not really very worried about it.
Recovery comes as your BAC drops down, or you get an adrenaline jolt. These are sometimes called “blackouts.” The term blackout can also refer to amnesia-style experiences: the apocryphal “How did I wake up here & whose pants am I wearing?”. Good bet some blindness occurred somewhere in the part you don’t remember.
To add a bit: I have read that making moonshine is a tricky business because, if you don’t really know what you are doing, you get methanol in addition to the desired ethanol, in varying percentages.
I was under the impression that the “permanent” part of the blindness was death. When I was a kid they took my neighbor away on a stretcher who was crying out that she was blind. It was a one way ride. Very sad story that I won’t go into.
You’re right. The phrase* blind drunk* is simply an expression meaning very drunk indeed, stumbling into things as if one couldn’t see, etc. It has nothing to do with literal blindness or methanol poisoning.
From OED:
Who is this people who have access to methanol but not to cheap booze?
They can slurp up any old antifreeze from any vehicle. Some people are such bad alcoholics they will do it.
Maybe in the 1920’s, but nowadays antifreeze is ethylene glycol. Window washer fluid and fuel system de-icers (e.g. Heet) may have methanol, but antifreeze does not.
Not exactly true. Some unscrupulous souls hae sold moonshine that was cut with methanol, which has had the expected untoward consequences; but to actually make actual booze, you start out with fermented fruit or grain, and fermented fruit or grain (generally boosted with sugar to increase the alcohol content) produces ethanol. Then you run the mash or crude wine through a still which comcentrates the alcohol content from 6-12% (ballpark estimate) to anything from 60 to 95%. The heat can’t turn ethanol into methanol.
The main danger to moonshine consumers seems to come from dumbass cookers who either use a “worm” made of any metal tubing besides copper – copper being the only safe one to use, or else use a car radiator to condense the distilled alcohol fumes back down to liquid form; these invariably are contaminated with gasoline chemicals, including a nasty serving of lead – which is, of course, totally not good for anyone’s health.
NB: I’m no chemist, and have only dabbled in home distillation in the most perfunctory and experimental way (i.e. using a pressure cooker on the stovetop); however I come from a locale where the art and science of handmade liquor (some of it of a highly enjoyable quality) is still the demesne of a small, skillful and dedicated clique of clandestine practitioners, and I’ve drunk my fill of good 'shine on occasion…
Of course it’s not permanent. All you need is Fezzik to dunk your head in alternating hot and cold water barrels.
Whether or not methanol poisoning is the source of the term “blind drunk”, it can cause blindness, and it is permanent.
From here:
Onset time is between 40 minutes and 72 hours! The blindness is caused by formic acid acting directly on the optic nerves.
Formic acid is produced by the body as it breaks down methanol. If you’ve also consumed ethanol, the body breaks it down first so formic acid isn’t produced while your ethanol level remains elevated. This is probably why the onset time is so variable.
Ethanol can be used theraputically to treat methanol poisoning, keeping the patient’s ethanol level elevated so the methanol isn’t broken down and is excreted safely through the kidneys. This involves keeping the patient drunk for a considerable period of time.
The easiest place to get methanol is from methylated spirits - a form of denatured alcohol. It’s cheap and easily available. Jungle juice was the name given to a mixture of cordial powder, water and methylated spirits (maybe filtered through white bread to remove the dye) reputedly drunk by street alcoholics when I was younger (70s-80s) - not that I ever tried it, I hasten to add. Jungle juice was a common brand of powdered cordial at the time.
However, the treatment options for ethylene glycol can be the same as for methanol - IV ethanol to prevent ethylene glycol metabolism until the kidneys (or dialysis) can excrete it all. There are other drug treatments that block the metabolic processes involved (basically blocking alcohol dehydrogenase) - this works for both methanol and ethylene glycol. However, this may not be the treatment of choice for an alcoholic, as rapid withdrawal from alcohol can be lethal.
And some anaerobic bacterial (as opposed to yeast) fermentation can produce methanol, so if the mash is not fermenting correctly, a level of methanol can be produced. During distillation, the first alcoholic fraction should be discarded, as the methanol comes away first. But a cheap unethical moonshiner may not wish to discard that fraction of product. Plus there is adulteration with denatured alcohol for effect and using inappropriate equipment (like the aforementioned radiator). :smack:
Si
I think you’d be hard pressed to find methylated spirits that contains methanol these days. Many years ago industrial alcohol was denatured using methanol but itsl just to dangerous and these days various bitter tasting agents and emetics are added instead. So it’s perfectly safe to drink but tastes foul and will make you ill.
It’s still called methylated spirit because that’s the name that everyone is familiar with.