Brazil presidential election run-off (10/30/2022); 2023-01-08 Insurrection

I’m glad you did, because that brought me here and I had no idea this was happening. Perhaps @What_Exit could modify the thread title so that when it pops to the top other posters will be made aware that this is a big deal, not just about the election run-off?

Done.

I was nervous about the military holding the line on 1/06. That’s surely the key here too. Is it going to be the State (police & soldiers if necessary) vs chumps, or (to any degree at all) soldiers vs soldiers?

Bolsonaro was/is a right wing Populist, which can be viewed as a “proto-fascist”.

The electorate tossed him because- as with every right wing Populist, he made promises to the masses that he could not and did not keep. This sort of reaction is to be expected, as some of his followers are reactionary hardcore. They believe the lie about the lie (“I didn’t do xxx as my enemies did yyyy”).

I was thinking that rightwing populism was on its way out (trump gone, Boris gone), but Israel brought back Netanyahu.

Looks like they’re following the United States Republican “How To Be A Sore Loser Entitled Crybaby” playbook.

Like I said: Steve Bannon.

Sure, but I’m not going to assume this resolves until it becomes clear that none of the crybaby sore losers hold any significant influence over any part of the military.

No doubt. This could be dangerous, indeed.

Security forces have arrived in Brasilia following the assault by pro-Bolsonaro supporters.

Another picture shows that after just one hour this started, the police are in force now, controlling the access to the main building.

Man, it’s Sunday, I just wanted to drink scotch and play videogames and out of nowhere Signal and Telegram messages pop up from my overseas friends asking what’s going on, and suddenly I have to catch up :smiley: First I thought it was just about the first lady’s tour of the presidential palace with a Globo reporter earlier today, showing that Bozo had trashed the residence and damaged artwork that belongs to the people. Now that story has been pushed down a bit.

One thing to clarify/reassure right away - from JohnT’s link:

No Brazilian media that I’ve seen is suggesting that the police is assisting the rioters in any way. The “accompanying” here appears to be to keep a (then) peaceful protest out of the way of traffic. JohnT’s second link with the horseback police being assaulted shows that, just as with the US 6 Jan. riot, it’s rioters vs police.

President Lula has come out and ordered the feds to take all necessary action against the rioters.

Yep, fled to Florida, can’t imagine why :wink: He fled right before his presidency was up, so it’s clearly an attempt to escape justice. His family is applying for Italian citizen as mentioned upthread.

This meant that the passing of the presidential sash, for the first time in the modern republic (first time ever?), was not done from ex-prez to prez. Instead the sash was passed by cross-cultural representatives of the Brazilian people. In what has to be an intentional metaphor the physical passing of the sash itself to Lula was done by a black woman who made her living collecting trash off the streets for recycling.

Bozo himself has been silent for several weeks, but his twitter handle still has him as Brazil’s president and (presumably a staffer) is still posting about the (imaginary) good things that came out of his presidency.

Correct, gangs of idiots have been setting up camps to protest for a good while now. Some were being dispersed by the police before today’s riot (e.g. I saw a video of that being done in Belo Horizonte, can’t remember the date). Right now (as in, I’m hearing it from the TV in the other room) they’re reporting today’s riot is from Brasilia’s campers.

What’s “proto-” about it? Bolsonaro is a corrupt fascist racist misogynist reactionary dumbass disorganised criminal. Agreed on your second paragraph.

State vs chumps for sure. The military has been clear on what side it’s on.


To add my own perspective for a moment: This riot shows, yet again, that the right-wing “Sore Loser Entitled Crybaby” contingent is, above all, idiots. It’s Sunday. This is Brasilia we’re talking about. I’ve lived and worked there. It’s a frickin’ ghost town Friday evening until Tuesday, because virtually everyone leaves town when work is over. It’s an artificial city with no native population other than some shop staff and a few university students without funds to leave every weekend. Even most wage workers bus in from Goiás every day rather than live in the federal district. In the Dilma presidency it was said, not as a joke or irony, that one of the most effective things about her administration was scheduling one of the principal meetings of all ministers with the president for Friday afternoon, as it forced the ministers, politicians, and public servants to be at their workplaces on Friday as well. Previously the weekend was, in effect, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday, possibly Tuesday… traffic on Tuesday mornings and Thursday afternoons (later Fridays) on the road to/from the airport was a nightmare. The only thing that the rioters could possibly accomplish was destruction of public property, which they/we pay for in taxes, and possibly harming a few cops, who are not as polite about assault on their persons as some other police forces are. Lula was just holding a speech where, besides the obvious returning to Brasilia and calling in all the feds, he pointed out that for all the elections he ran in and lost, neither he, his supporters, or indeed any leftists were accused of attempted rioting against government buildings. If anyone was on the fence about which side of the political divide is violent, not counting the self-delusional, they’ll be climbing down that fence right quick.

Oh, and the Congress is a public building. I’ve been inside a bunch of times. There’s some visible security, but it pales in comparison to e.g. US embassies. Storming Congress on a weekend in practical terms isn’t much harder than storming your average carioca supermarket (the latter is probably more likely to get you shot).

I may very well be wrong - but I’m not worried. In my opinion a bunch of reactionary idiots have started an ineffective riot that will hurt their cause, or at best for them make no long-term difference at all, and I’m confident that order, such as it is in Brazil, will be restored shortly. The right-wingers in government will continue pooping on everything in favour of corruption and chaos, but I’m not concerned about the risk of a successful coup or an extralegal return of the Bozo.

Postscript: News reporting that the police are now confronting rioters.

I wonder how Glenn Greenwald is going to spin this

I vaguely know the name, but what is his relevance to this exactly?

Modding: Keep this sidebar to a minimum please.


Reading as a poster, Thank you for that summary Toffe. Greatly appreciated.

Nice, thank you for the report.

It could be the military stepping in to quell disturbances and then just using the situation to carry on with a military regime. It has been known in Latin America.

In Brazil, in 2023? I recently purchased a new hat. If this leads to a new military dictatorship, I will eat it.

News reporting 150 people arrested so far. Sources I’m seeing and hearing are calling this terrorism, not a riot, or protest (manifestação) or similar. The leader of Bozo’s party is condemning it, even while positively remarking on past peaceful demonstrations in front of military installations in the same statement. So far I see no significant figures coming out in favour of the terrorism.

Thanks, and please don’t take any concerns as doubting your analysis. I hope we’re being overly paranoid. I think the place it’s coming from is recent history in the U.S. of us thinking over and over again that X could never happen, and then seeing it happen.

There’s plenty of awful things that can happen. There was a nonzero chance of an attempt on Lula’s life before inauguration - now that he’s president I think it’s too much effort though. Riots, perhaps a mass shooting or three, all possible. There was an attempt at bombing a truck in Brasilia ahead of the inauguration. And the military has been used against civilian disturbances on the request of the civilian government, notably in Rio de Janeiro before Bozo was elected. But installing a new military dictatorship in Brazil in 2023? I see no realistic path of that happening. The military supporting an alternative civilian government after a longer period of worse chaos than this, OK, I’d say the chances are nonzero, but close to zero. A new military dictatorship? Won’t happen.

Putin, as a dictator, is fascist . Bolsonaro was not (yet) a dictator. Nazi Germany and Fascist Italy started as right wing populist, but then Hitler and Mussolini became fascist dictators. That’s is why right wing populism is a sort of 'proto-fascist"- the semblance of a democratic government is there- and it doesn’t always change into fascism- even Boris Johnsons detractors didn’t really think he was gonna become the next “Lord Protector” of GB. With Bolsonaro, of course, the change to dictatorship was (and still is) possible.

This isn’t great…