Yes, but interestingly not all of Christianity’s symbols have power in the buffyverse. In Conversations With Dead People the newly-risen vampire Holden removes a statue of the BVM from a headstone and whacks Buffy with it. I thought it was an angel at first, but on a second viewing it’s definitely Mary in her woman-of-sorrows pose. (In truth, I seriously doubt this means anything other than sloppy props.)
Another thing I just thought of is none of the crosses used in the buffyverse have the suffering Christ on them, one might argue that the cross is also a symbol of a non-Christian religion. Thor’s Hammer is cross-shaped, for example.
Actually, it’s not canon that Spike’s gone by Spike since he’s been turned. We don’t know how soon her changed his name to Spike, but it certainly wasn’t immediately.
ALso, remember when Spike came to town in School Hard? Giles couldn’t find any information on Spike but he found information on William the Bloody .
So Wood may not have necessarily thought to look for a vampire named Spike. And the writers have been playing fast and lose with the William the Bloody moniker. Before Spike rarely went by it, but several times in S7 they said things like “William the Bloody is back…” Which could mean either the writers forgot their own canon (which wouldn’t surprise me) or they were being clever and really meant the audience to think that William the Bloody Awful Poet is back.
Whatever.
Dammit, since when are you so smart?
Although I will pathetically defend myself with a wet noodle by telling you that in These Our Actors, Spike chooses his new moniker as soon as he rises and uses it as commonly as Angelus used his upon rising.
Take that! And that! And THAT! Oh no, my noodle broke
No, no - that doesn’t fly. The crosses they use are all proportioned as the Cross of Christ traditionally is, not the more generic cross that pre-dates Christianity. In any event, the holy water is clearly a Christian sacramental.
There’s nothing in vampire mythology that suggests a statue of Mary would be particularly damaging to them. Indeed, even in Christian thinking, a statue of Mary might be treated with respect, but not viewed as possessing any particular sacramental significance. But holy water, at least in the Roman Catholic tradition, has sacramental significance; it is a sacred sign which in a sense imitates the sacrament of baptism.
I don’t think there’s any dodging this issue: Christian symbology has actual power.
In the Buffyverse, of course.
- Rick
Re: religious symbols.
Wasn’t there an episode where a Star of David also worked? Or am I thinking of some other vampire movie/show?
I guess you’re right, Bricker, Christian symbols do hold power in the Buffy universe. Of course, they only hold power over vampires. One could argue that pagan symbols are even more powerful (The mask in Dead Man’s Party springs to mind immediately, or the Seal in the Basement this season). Willow has used some pretty obviously pagan rituals before in order to work magic that went beyond merely discouraging vampires; notably, in Something Blue, she did a spell that would allow her to reorganize the entire world according to her will. Heh. Will’s will. Er.
The show has, of course, made blatantly obvious non-Christian references. In the second episode to the series, The Harvest, Giles says that “contrary to popular mythology,” the world did not begin as a Paradise. Also, in The Freshmen, upon being asked if she’s accepted Jesus as her personal savior, Buffy replies, “Y’know, I always meant to…”
So, what I’m basically saying is that just because the crosses and what-n-not have power over vampires doesn’t mean that the show as a whole promotes Christianity anymore than the fact that the hyena ritual turned Xander’n’company into The Pack means that the show promotes the Massi, or Maori, or whoever they said…
You may be thinking of The Fearless Vampire Killers, where someone brandishes a cross at a vampire who replies…
“Oy, have you got the wrong vampire!”
Right you are, A wizard song for thee, and I acknowledged this very point above. The show is by no means a Christian promotional vehicle - but it does include the idea that Christian symbols wield some power.
Since we’re clearly hijacked now, I might take this opportunity to wonder what the limits are. The Master acknowledged that the cross fills him with fear, and tries to force himself to touch it, with some success. The crazy vamp in Helpless actually relishes the pain the touch of the cross brings - altough he’s ultimately felled by drinking holy water moments later. When the Master’s bones were buried in “consecrated soil” it burned the hands of the vamps doing the digging, but ultimately was no barrier to the extraction of said bones. As a rule, neither crosses nor holy water are an effective tool of vampire destruction - at best, they’re repellents, nothing more.
I wonder if a consecrated host would be painful, or deadly, if touched or swallowed? We see copious quantities of holy water - I wonder where they came from? Were they blessed by a never-seen priest and sold to the magic shop, or can anyone create holy water?
I always preferred the mythos that had the cross/religious symbol serve as a general repellant. It has always bugged me in the Buffyverse when a character brandishes a cross only to have the vampire bat it away. Based on the burns crosses inflict my assumption has been that given long enough exposure the vampire would burst into flame at the site of contact. Same with holy water; it acts like battery acid.
No, I’ve never seen that. Upon further consideration, though, I realize that wherever I saw it, it wasn’t Buffy. There was that scene in season 2 where Willow and Buffy are doing the “uninvite Angel” spell on their houses—Willow remarks that her Jewish father wouldn’t like it if he knew she was hanging crosses in her room. I imagine she would have used Jewish symbols if that were possible.
I think this episode proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that Andrew is not a wanker.
And which dream sequence was the Cheeseman in?
The first time the Cheese Man appeared was in Restless–he appeared in all fourof the (main) scoobies’ dreams. Then he appeared again to Andrew when he was in Mexico. His presence has not yet been explained–and may be a mystery for the ages.
It’s proved beyond shadow of a doubt that he was a wanker.
The only proven wanker is Anya. “Why can’t you just masturbate like the rest of us?”
AFAIK, the only proven non-wanker in the Buffyverse is Willow, with the * I Touch Myself * non-gettingness.
What about the miracle Snow in “Amends”?
— Has anyone else noticed that the “previously, on BTVS” leadins are getting longer and longer? —
Well, it was particularly bad given that Andrew had a painful additional several minutes recapping out the whole lame First Evil plot. I assume that since it was crucial to the ep, and they want eps to stand alone without being to confusing to newbies, it was needed, but was by far the worst, most awkward bit in the ep, redeemed slightly only by the funny quick cut to Andrew tapping on the seal.