Given the option, what would you do and why?
I’m looking for stories to help me make up my mind between buying a slightly older house that would cost less but probably be more square footage than new, or just caving in and building like my husband wants to do. I really don’t have much experience with homebuying, as our current home was purchased from family members.
I looked on and off literally for years for a house. I originally wanted an older home, preferably a ranch circa 1950, with some charm and character. Unfortunately, so did most of the retiring Baby Boomers loaded with cash from the sale of their two-story suburban kid factory. So, that drove the price up. Plus, in my area, people are notoriously and almost pathologically stingy when it comes to home improvement, meaning many of these homes had original kitchens and bathrooms and would requires thousands in renovation on top of commanding top dollar for the sale.
So, I decided to purchase a newer home. Mine is about four years old. I had the choice of building. Ultimately, I rejected the idea for three basic reasons: First, I wanted to see how the house had settled and whether there were any major defects. In my area, cracks in concrete and problems with damp basements are common, but some houses are simply built better than others. I wanted the better house. Second, I wanted landscaping and the like grown in. I was appalled at the brand new $400,000 homes sitting in the middle of a barren lot, with one scrawny tree planted in the front. Four years may not seem like much time, but it’s enough for a yard and trees and shrubs to mature to palatable states. Third, I’d heard many horror stories of dealing with builders–promises that weren’t kept, endless delays, errors that resulted in the buyer paying more (oops, we “accidentally” put another fireplace in your house . . . we could tear it out and start over again or you can pay another $2000 and keep it.) and even one builder declaring bankruptcy and taking all of the buyers’ downpayments with him.
So, I’m pretty satisfied. The previous owners made some great improvements, such as putting in hardwood floors and genuine tile, building a deck and stone patio, adding quite a bit of landscaping, and having a fourth bedroom put into what was essentially wasted storage space on the second floor. Oh, and a freak hail storm a year ago resulted in the roof being replaced, without any damage to the structure or interior of the house. So, I essentially got a brand new house. The best part was that I negotiated a purchase price that was only slightly higher than they’d paid for it, more of the result of timing than my efforts.
You really, really don’t want to build a house.
The only people I know without horror stories about building houses are my own parents. They’ve probably built 8 or 10 homes over the years. My Dad, of course, was a contractor - he’s retired now. He built the houses more or less from scratch, himself. He only contracted out the stuff he absolutely couldn’t do.
Even they say “don’t build a house.”
We built.
We built on vacant land, so we had to put in a long driveway, septic, phone, and power and that added significantly to the cost. It’s great seeing my ideas come to fruition, though. It’s a weekend/vacation home a couple hours away. We built because we could afford to. I don’t think we could afford to build within decent commuting distance. People do commute from up there, but man, what a commute.
The financing is a little trickier, because you have to do a construction loan before the actual mortgage. Your lender will walk you through it, though. You also want to have a lot of cash on hand for unexpected expenses.
Our plans went through several iterations before we settled on the final plan. Plan A was too expensive right off the bat, plan B was more in the ballpark but the bids from contractors I was getting told me it would ultimately break the budget, so we scaled that back and came up with plan C. One thing that helped us was that in going through this process we had a plan we could stick with. Sticking with the plan is good.
Regardless, someone is going to have to make a lot of decisions, so uh, be prepared to make a lot of decisions.
If you or your husband is an absolute stickler for punctuality you might want to think about buying an existing home.
From a finanical standpoint it makes sense to build only if you’re going to own the house for a while. Where I am, anyway.
My dad owned a construction company when I was a young teen to my twenties. He started when we first moved to Alaska in 1970 (we the family that is, he moved up during the earthquake, LITERALLY he was on a plane headed to Anchorage when the 64 quake hit, they turned it around and it came back to Seattle, but he was on another one within a day to come here and work on the rebuilding efforts)…
At any rate, in the early 70s, we moved into our first house, one he and my uncle, his younger brother, had built with the business.
When we moved in, there was, fulfilling local building requirements for habitation, running water in the bathtub, and a toilet downstairs in the basement. There was no carpet or even padding, and not all of the walls were finished, many just had framing and viscane. (visqueen).
We, as a family, gradually finished the house from the inside out I remember it as being fun and exciting back then. We had also had a hand in the construction, sweeping sheetrock, drilling holes in the framing for the electricians to pull wire, tarring the foundation before it was backfilled in, stuff like that.
My sister and I both grew up learning how to do all sorts of things girls normally don’t do. My sister later bought a little house in “the valley”. Another little house that was basically just a shell. Over the years, we, again as a family, finished it from the inside out. I remember at one point, squishing myself up under the one main roof beam so that she could jack it up and place shims and spacers to straighten it out. Damn roofs are heavy!
I’ve roofed several barns, roofed and/or repaired roofing on houses and sheds alike, hung sheetrock, taped and mudded (I hear the appropriate term for this is “pooping” ugh :D). I’ve painted, wallpapered, laid carpet and linoleum. I’ve even installed data and phone jacks for a company I worked for, thanks to all my building experience.
It’s hard, hard work, sometimes it’s frustrating. It seems like any task that “oh, this will only take an hour or two” QUICKLY becomes a nightmare of repeated trips for more material, or an aggravating puzzle to figure out or something. We even have a family joke about it “DON’T say it will only take X amount of time, it’ll take forever then”.
Not to sound all trite and gushy, but, the work is really hard, but it’s so rewarding to see something you’ve built and decorated with your own two hands.
We have added onto our house twice. The first time it was enclosing the garage (one where it didn’t look like it was enclosed) and soon added a separate garage. The second time was a major addition, designed by an architect. Just doing that convinced me that building a new home from scratch would be a headache. I had just retired and was able to spend every day with the builders. The first addition was a must since we had 5 kids and only 3 bedrooms. The last addition was made after we’d lived in the house and knew all its faults. By using an architect and our experience we turned all of those faults into pluses. So I suggest you look for an older house with the potential to be added onto.
We built.
We liked living in South Minneapolis, but our requirements for a house in the city made it cost prohibitive. Big. Charming (or why live in an old house), with new electrical and decent roof and a kitchen redone in the last ten years. And a good neighborhood. These houses are available in the Twin Cities, but expensive.
We found a new development going in a mile outside the St. Paul city limits, bought a lot and hired a builder. We built off plans and had seen the model - so our choices were things like “fireplace on the back wall or in the corner” and “what color carpet.” Those decisions were pretty easy for us and we did very little customization of the home. We had a long timeframe, as we bought the lot in September and had no intention of moving in a Minnesota winter - so the house was actually complete when we needed to move!
There are things we wish we’d done differently - customize the house further…but in general we were able to pick the floorplan we wanted and move into a house we wanted. It wasn’t as charming as some of those big old Crocus Hill homes - but it cost half as much for the same square feet.
I built (had built) my current house. It was something I wanted (read just had) to do and I’m glad I had the experience. I will never do it again though. You have to be committed to spending hours and hours each and every week going out to the home site during construction. I mean every single friggin’ day. You need to do that to make sure you’re getting what you’re paying for. Fortunately I had a great builder who took lots of care and put in lots of personal time but still I checked on progress constantly.
I never again want the err… joy of spending endless hours looking at door knobs, hinges, drawer pulls, plumbing fixtures, wallpaper, carpet, tile and paint samples, stain samples, brick and mortar samples and on and on and on and on. Oh, and the joy of modifying a plan because something that looked like it would work won’t work. Wallpaperers who put up the wrong wall paper in the wrong place. Thank Og I walked in while that was happening and stopped it. The wrong carpet being delivered. Linoleum being torn as it was being installed. GRRRRR… Scintillating discussions on where to put the septic tank. Spending days looking at sinks, counter tops, dishwashers, stoves, microwaves, vent hoods, light fixtures and on and on and on. Landscaping. AAAAAAARGHHHHHHH!!! Landscaping. Deciding on shrubs, trees, the type of grass. Then the endless watering, fertilizing, and general agony of getting the damn stuff to take root and grow.
It was six months of hell. I’ll never do it again. Buy something already there. With an established yard. I’ve done both. Trust me it’s better.
Oh, and let’s not forget the days of looking at shingles. And shutters. And windows. And vinyl for the eaves of the roof. Oh, and the joy of figuring out where to put outside faucets! It just never ends.
Done both and lived in a rolling construction state at times.
Before you get into what you should or shouldn’t do, what are your skills, What are your abilites, what are your needs. Where are you? Where would the 'hood be?
You already live in a house, so you have an idea of the maintenance involved. What is the need for a newer home that an older home won’t give you? What about the neighborhood?
I lived in an older house - my parents repainted many times to cover potentially leaded paint. When a pipe broke, they replaced it with new to further reduce our use of older lead pipes.
My parents have moved to a newer house, and it might have lead paint, but without any kids living at home, it is not so much a concern. But there are lawns to mow, exteriors to paint, and other maintenance factors of an older home (aside from a tiny kitchen that needs serious remodeling).
When I moved, I moved to a newer home, much like a condo. Someone else did the lawn and exterior painting and cleaning once in a while. Things were new, so they didn’t break much, but I could handle it when they did.
When it came time to move again - we looked and looked. Newer homes, older homes, fixer uppers - and we had to pick a neighborhood. In our travels we decided we wanted a newer home, partially to have a new neighborhood, partially because the home would be built to Hurricane Andrew standards (and weathered the three hurricanes that dropped through last year marvelously), to get away from lead possibilities, and because homes of the size we wanted were just going for outragoeous prices in nieghborhoods we liked.
So we got a huge ass house. But one that we can live in for 30 or more years, and house at least four children in if they bunk in together. And because of the astronomical market, we paid less than the house behind us is selling for, now that it is done. The house behind us is on more land (.25 acre, we are on .10) but is 8 years older and 1,000 less square feet.
That all said, if you build:
Wire for satellite. Not cable. Satellite.
If you have a security system, get a pad at each door. No need for one in the MBR.
Take pictures every week.
Document all problems in writing.
Decide which upgrades are worth paying for and when. We spent extra to get tile floors now, but we were able to move in straight away. Something other than formica countertops can wait and be done much later.
Expect it to be late.
Expect it to be late.
Expect it to be late.
9 Expect to deal with problems well after it is “done” and be hamstrung from fixing them yourself because you have to go through the builder for the first year or so.
Other than that, I am still glad we built instead of bought. I wish only that we’d wired for satellite instead of cable.
Swamp - maybe that’s why it wasn’t ‘so hard’ for me … I had two or three choices of floor plan, did some modifications (and regret not doing others), and had five or six dozen things to pick without going into outrageous price land.
Don’t get me wrong. I’m glad I did it, I just won’t ever do it again. And amen to regretting not doing things. I wish my dining room were bigger. I wish the master bathroom were bigger. No matter how hard ya try, there’s always something.
My next move will be to something already there with little to no maintenance. Think condo or townhouse, something along those lines.
I do love my acre and a half lot though.
I’m in the middle of building my own home now. I also have seen my parents build several.
Some advice:
Don’t create the plans yourself. Architects are expensive, the software doesn’t work as good as you think it does. In either case, you are unnessesarily re-inventing the wheel. Why worry about what will fit where and how to shape every room. There are thousands of designs available that can be purchased for cheap money. Find one that you like and make slight alterations and you will save many headaches down the road.
Use a general contractor. Unless you are a tradesman yourself, you have no business attempting to do it on your own. It is possible, but it aint easy. The subcontractors will eat you alive in many cases and you can end up paying more than you would have to just hire the general contractor anyways.
Go modular. Modular homes are about 40% of the new homes built now. They’ve come a long way from the boring boxes of old and can be built in any style. They are cheaper, built better, faster and more reliable than traditional or “stick built” homes. The more you research into them, the more sense it will make.
Beware zoning boards. At least here in New England, the local towns can be a real pain the the neck. Make sure that the town is OK with what you are doing and there are no zoning surprises or building permit issues. You’ll also have less problems with this if you use a good contractor.
Work with good people. I have a mortgage guy who moves mountains for me. Construction loans aren’t easy for a 28 year old kid like me to get, and modulars and multi-families add further complications (I’m doing both). My two lawyers are very good. My builder is great. I’ve got an engineer that I trust who tells me like it is. My mom is a broker with 25 years of experience who guides my every step. Find good people, and listen to them. Look out for your interests, but don’t micro-manage and get in everyone’s way.
Good luck.
What’s the difference? They both use the same coax cable lines, don’t they? Satellite you need a dish on the side of the house. Cable comes in from the street. Besides the point of entry, I wasn’t aware that there was a difference in how you would wire them.
Although make very sure this is OK by the deed restrictions on whatever land you buy. I was considering building (until I found a place on the size lot I was looking for that was considerably nicer then I would’ve been able to build), and “built on-site” was a very common stipulation on deed restrictions.
And, for resale purposes, you do want deed restrictions (unless you’re looking at a lot so big it doesn’t matter what the neighors do) to keep your neighors from putting something up that will drag your property value down, such as a mobile home.
We built. We just closed last December, haven’t even been in the house a full month yet.
The way I see it, each side has advantages and disadvantages. In a new house, you don’t know if some huge problem will pop up; in an older house, most major problems have already been found and fixed. With a new house, you can get exactly what you want, or close to it; with an older house, you get what you find. With an older house, you can get nice, big, old trees; a new house, not so much. A new house has modern wiring and appliances; older houses, not so much.
We built, because we weren’t in a hurry and we wanted certain things that we didn’t know if we could find. We also liked the idea of new appliances. We wrestled with the whole tree issue for a while, but decided we could be patient and grow our own.
As far as the experience, it wasn’t that bad, really. You do have to keep on top of your builder, visit the site often, and make sure nothing’s getting botched. Of course, I say it wasn’t that bad because I work in another town, which means my wife bore most of the responsibility of getting on the builder’s case about things, so she got a little stressed at times.
The biggest mistake they made involved the kitchen tile. We asked them to lay the tile in “diamond” fashion, rather than making it square with the walls. One fine Saturday, we cruised by the builder’s office with a check for the extra amount that this would cost. The builder, realizing that she had forgotten to let the tile guys know that we wanted it on the diamond, panicked and called the tilers, who were already at the house laying the tile in customary square fashion. The poor guys stayed late, peeling up all the tile they’d put down that day (fortunately, the adhesive was still wet), and started all over again the next day. My wife and I felt bad for the tilers, so we brought them cookies the next day, which they appreciated, and they didn’t blame us or anything. After all, it wasn’t OUR fault that they’d started the job on the square, it was the BUILDER’S for not letting them know. Anyway, visit often to prevent stuff like that from happening.
I put up a website to show the progress on the house, but if I linked to it here, I’d probably fly way over my bandwidth allotment. But if one or two of you are interested, email me and I’ll share the link. The website was funny in itself; when I started it, my wife thought I was nuts, since I was basically taking pictures of dirt. After a couple of months, though, all our relatives had links, and her dad was checking the site every morning to see if there was any new progress. heh.
Half acre? Punk.
Yeah, I pushed to extend the MBR but Ramit couldn’t see it. Now that we’re in it … it’s okay.
I hate the arrangement of some of the switches. A kitchen light switch in the dinigroom? Pantry switch in the pantry and not the kitchen leading to it? One switch in a two exit dining room? Pain. In. The. Butt.
And I should have sprung for double switching in the Master Bath - one for light, one for fan.
Ah, someday.
Cable vs Sat - yes, they both use coax. But cable is one “wire” system running through the whole house. For Sat you need one cable between the dish and each hole in the wall.
Cable - four outlets - one wire connected to all four and terminating outside.
Sat - four outlets - one wire from each outlet connected individually to the dish. If you wire it that way and get cable, just get an … “unsplitter” to send the signal from one wire through all four.
Max - yep, I did the same thing with pictures, but ended up emailing them out to people every week so my bandwith wouldn’t die and I wouldn’t have to keep explaining to people how to get to the website. (and some had email but no surfing access).
I have to third appreciating the contractors. We showed up many many weeks when they were on site with cases of cold soda.
Oh, and do what it takes to get wonderboard not GREENBOARD in your bathrooms. Well worth tthe cost down the road.
Thanks so much for the stories, and keep 'em coming - they really are helping!
That’s acre and a half thankyouverymuchandlearntoread. 
Max Torque on Thanksgiving Day the year my build started I had Thanksgiving dinner with a bunch of friends on my dirt piles at the site. It was a hoot.
Suse good luck with which ever you decide to do. As you can see, there’s good and bad in both building a new home and buying an existing one. There’s some really good advice here on both sides.
I think it also depends on where you are.
Here in Calgary there is a huge amount of new houses going up, so you have many choices of builder, and house, and area…
I would say the biggest thing is to make sure the builder you choose is a good one. Ask around - when people are upset they’ll be more than happy to let you know all the problems they had with “X” company.
We’ve built twice now.
The first was very much a starter home, and we knew that. That particular builder had a decent reputation for turning out well made, boring little houses. The plan was one of four they had, and we made only slight changes. We only turned up every couple of weeks to check on the progess (how do I know if something is framed right or not?) and didn’t have any trouble at all. We lived in the house for 3 years, and didn’t have any problems.
The second house was a bigger house, with many more changes. However, by this point my husband was working for a builder (the builder, in fact) so we were able to keep a close eye on things.
I think the biggest factor with construction problems is the on-site supervisor. (a person employed by the builder to supervise all of the trades) If you get a good supervisor, your house will turn out just fine.
And my own personal comments if you do decide to build…
-check out lots of showhomes, and ask questions. If you feel you are being treated poorly - leave. If the sales people can’t be bothered to treat you properly, you don’t want the company building your house.
-think, really think about where you want your phone and cable/satellite plug ins
-make your closet bigger then you think you will need…then make it bigger
-don’t be afraid to ask the salesperson questions
-make sure you know what the area will look like when it’s finished…you don’t want your dream home backing on to a 8 lane highway everyone “forgot” to mention was in the future development plans…
-keep copies of every slip of paper involved - sometimes it saves hassle later (on our first house when we went to see the lawyer to finish all the documents we were told we owed more than we did. The builder had told the lawyer they hadn’t received our final downpayment cheque. I had the signed receipt with me proving they had received it)
Cool! Much smarter than what we did. We closed on the house on December 20th, and relatives started arriving on the 23rd. So, by that date we had to have moved everything in, set up beds, scraped together some level of decorating, stocked the pantry, unpacked all those wedding gifts we decided not to bother with until we got into the house…it was nuts. All together, I think we had 11 adults and 4 kids under age five. I’m never gonna move, AND host Christmas, in the same week again.