Burgers

Prompted by this.

In New York City, I guess that price range is reasonable. $8.95 to $11.95 seems to be the going rate for a burger and fries in Seattle. Acknowledging that a restaurant needs to make a profit, and a low price may suggest lower quality, I don’t think price is a fair metric for determining the tastiness of a burger.

The best burgers I’ve had were in the early-'70s at a place that no longer exists. Joy’s was on the outskirts of Barstow, CA. It was a small place with only a counter for seating. ‘Air conditioning’ was a swamp cooler. The screen door was on a wooden frame and was closed with a simple spring. You don’t see those much anymore, and I wonder how many people remember the distinctive WHAP! whap-whap sound they made when they closed. Joy had an elderly mother who needed care, so she eventually closed her diner to take care of her. She made the best burgers, and a macaroni and cheese-chunk salad that I’ve never found successfully replicated. I recall the chocolate malts were good, too.

Anyway, the burgers. Hand-formed patty of meat cooked on a flat-top grill. She had a ‘cellar’ from which she’d season the meat. It must have had both salt and pepper in it, since she only used the one dispenser. Toasted bun, leaf lettuce, tomato, white onions, pickles, mayonnaise or other condiments. Meat, heat, salt and pepper. Why were these the best burgers ever? Because i was young and with dad? The ramshackle setting? No, they really were that good. I can’t explain it.

The second-best burgers I’ve eaten were at the Kittyhawk Café at Santa Monica Airport. They used in-house ground chuck. The place was sold and became The Spitfire Grill. (Trivia: The writer of The Spitfire Grill had an office above the diner, and that’s where he got the name.) They must have cleaned the grill, because the burgers weren’t as good.

Last year Dope Burger opened in Seattle. They weren’t as good as Joy’s, but their technique was similar to hers. These were the best burgers I’ve had recently. I’ve read that they’re like Red Mill, but I’ve never been to a Red Mill. Dope Burger had a fire, and are now gone.

The thing is, it seems that everyone seems to think their burgers are precious little meatflakes. Thick, half-pound patties. Now, I like beef. I’ve made some monster burgers at home. But if you’re going out for ‘a burger’, it’s overkill. A quarter-pound patty is good for a burger – if the restaurant doesn’t over-do it. Too much fancification and the meat gets lost. For a restaurant burger, one-third pound is good. Thankfully, many or most places do serve 1/3-pound patties. But they’re afraid to season them. You need salt and pepper. Oh, but salt is eeevil! Can’t put too much on, lest the patron collapse from a burst aorta or something! Pepper? Granted, I like lethal amounts; but people seem to be afraid of that too. The meat is always too bland for me.

The bun. Either the bun is bland and boring, or it has to be focaccia or ciabatta or a French roll or something. Two Bells Tavern in Belltown uses French rolls. The good news is that their beef patties are tasty. The bad news is that their beef patties are exceptionally greasy.

Why must burgers be served with aioli? Oh, yes; to show how hip the restaurant is. OK, it tastes good; but we’re talking a burger here! Cheddar cheese. I like Cheddar cheese. But for a proper burger you need American cheese. (Not ‘cheese food product’; actual cheese.) I’ve been to places where that is not an option. Blue cheese? I like it without meat. As I mentioned in another thread, there are a number of toppings I like on a burger. Avocado, bacon, Ortega chilis, fried egg with a runny yolk… It’s all good. I can even understand mushrooms, though I’m not into them on a burger.

The point is, a burger is a burger. People’s tastes vary, and burgers are made any number of ways to suit them. But sometimes one likes a ‘good, honest burger’. No fancy bread, not aioli, no truffles, no massive amounts of meat that dulls the taste buds by the time you’re finished, and no piles of toppings that overwhelm the beef. A burger doesn’t need to be ‘fancy’ or ‘special’. Concentrate on the meat, and the seasoning of the meat, and the cooking of the meat. Use a tasty bun, and toast it. And it doesn’t need to cost $10 (or $20 :eek: ).

As for cooking, it should be cooked on a flat-top grill. Flame-broiled? Charcoal-grilled? Those are fine in their own right. But the perfect burger should be cooked on a flat-top.

Clearly you’ve never had a burger with a 3oz slab of seasoned, seared foie gras on it…

:rolleyes:

:smiley:

No, but I’ve seen them on menus.

I was just teasing. I’ve had foie in many guises but I haven’t tried it on a burger, nor would I if I had to pay for it. But your OP mentions these “fancypants NYC burgers” that cost $20 (or more, in some cases, a LOT more) because they use ingredients like foie gras, truffles, kobe beef, etc.

I’m pretty much with you. Great burgers aren’t great because of an epic pile-on of expensive accoutrements…the simplicity is the beauty of the thing.

Next time you’re in Portland, try Killer Burger. Good stuff. They have all kinds of variations, including what they call a peanut butter burger (peanut sauce, really), but I like the “classic”, which just has bacon (they all do, unless you tell them otherwise) and cheese, with the rabbit food on the side and an unhealthy portion of fries. Add your own salt and peppah, mustard, etc. They opened one about a quarter mile from my house and I have to be forcibly restrained from going there twice a week.

I agree with griddle frying, rather than flamed. Even when I use the BBQ, I put my cast griddle on top and make smashburgers (I’m a recent convert to this method).

Depends on what you’re going for.

For me, burgers generally fall into two main categories: fast-food style burgers and pub style burgers. Fast-food style burgers are generally griddled (not grilled), and consist of thinner patties (usually 1/4 pound or thinner), and are often cooked to higher levels of doneness because of the thin patty. Pub style burgers are thicker styles (1/2 lb is a common size), often grilled, and easy to order to whatever level of doneness you desire (I’ll take mine on the rare side of medium rare.)

Now, I like both styles, but I generally prefer fast-food burgers, because I’m usually not in the mood for putting down a giant 1/2 pound-or-bigger burger. For those styles of burgers, I’m looking at a $3-$5 price point for a single cheeseburger, $4-$7 for a double.

For pub-style burgers, in Chicago, I generally think the $8-$14 price point is reasonable. I can’t even imagine considering a $20 burger unless it’s made with Kobe beef that is actually flown in from Japan, not some “Kobe style” Wagyu beef (which is good, but I wouldn’t pay that much of a premium for.)

Oh, and in terms of toppings: I won’t be ashamed to admit that I actually like American cheese food product (or whatever the hell Kraft and its ilk is) on a griddled hamburger. I like to mix it up from time to time, but I like the gooeyness of it. When I’m in the mood for real cheese, I like Munster on my burgers.

Now, for the 1/2 pounders, I am a big fan of blue cheese, especially Stilton.

I generally shy away from lettuce and tomatoes on the burger, unless I know the place has good lettuce and tomatoes. Usually, it’s just some watery cellulose with no flavor, so I just ditch it. Mustard, ketchup, onions, pickle.

In regards to bun, keep it simple, stupid. I don’t want my bun to have a lot of heft. I want something relatively pillowy and light. I know they’ve become trendy recently, but pretzel rolls do well for being appropriately squishy and lightly textured on the inside, while having a bit more flavor than a generic hamburger bun. A soft kaiser roll works well, too. But don’t give me anything that distracts or overwhelms the whole reason I’ve come to eat a burger: the beef.

I also like my burgers fatty. Minimum 20% fat, preferably around 30%. Don’t gimme this lean crap. Ground short ribs, in my experience, are my favorite cut for burgers.

Bit of a heretic here, but my go-to burger mix is 80/20 chuck mixed 3:1 with hot Italian sausage. You have to grill them at least medium, so they aren’t for the “I want it to moo” crowd.

For any burger, straight mayo is contra-indicated. 1000 Island, maybe. But I like mine with mustard, thin-sliced tomatoes, thin-sliced onion, shredded lettuce, pepper-jack cheese and pickles on the side. The key to the veggies is “Knock it off - this isn’t a salad!” Too many places put three inches of lettuce and a tomato slice that is an inch thick. Yes, it makes the burger look bigger, but now I have to take the bastard apart before I can eat it.

I do love me a good burger, but I can’t stand fast-food-style burgers. I generally have mine with lettuce, onion, tomato, mayo, spicy mustard, and if I can get it on a Kaiser roll, I’m a happy dude. Half a pound is a lot of meat, but as I’ve gotten older and fatter I can do it.

One of the best things my dad taught me was how to find the good burger places in a new town. Count the number of Cop cars, Linemen trucks, Plumber vans etc. ,(Basically any job where people drive around the city all day, and have a choice where to stop)in the parking lot at noon. whichever one has the most, go back at 1:30 for a burger, otherwise it will be too busy.

My grandfather was a cattle rancher, and he also owned the only restaurant in his hometown. He used to eat there all the time, so he made sure the food was excellent. His hamburger was unlike any I’ve tasted before or since. He didn’t just grind up whatever was left over after all the good meat was taken out. He’d throw the whole cow carcass into the grinder - filet, T-bones, and all. MAN that was good burger meat.

This guy:

Quote:
“The best ones fall between $10 and $20,” says burger enthusiast Keith Flanagan, who is also an account executive at a New York City public relations firm. “Anything less should make a foodie question the quality, and anything more should make a foodie question the restaurant’s hubris.”

Should piss right off. I’ll look for what I liken a burger and not what some “foodie” ( :rolleyes: ) says I should. Who do these people think they are?

The best burger in the world (and I say that having eaten a few in the US) is served at The Bird in Berlin, Germany. It’s owned and operated by American expats, they answer the phone in English, they address you in English if they think you can understand them, and their menu is bilingual as well. Their burgers are made from what other places would probably served as steak, ground onsite several times daily, so you can order a burger medium rare, the way god intended. They don’t use sponge dough buns, but English muffins that are just a little smaller than the patty, so they’re a bit difficult to eat, but yum! Fries are handcut and equally good. Their prices range from just over 10€ for a burger and fries to around 14€ for the fancier ones (blue cheese, guacamole, whatever), so pretty much in the range for NY from the OP. This is probably about 50-100% more than what most places in Berlin would charge, but still the place is packed every night, if you don’t reserve a few days in advance (which is pretty rare around here) don’t bother showing up, you’re not gonna get a seat.

Hmmmm, The Bird!

I don’t like anything cold and crunchy on my burgers. Onions? Must be cooked soft. Tomatoes? Nope. Lettuce? Heck no. Just cheese, meat, and condiments warmed to the burger’s temp. No ketchup. And mayo only if it has diced green olives in it.

I love a good rare steak but around here any kind of pink in a burger is “undercooked” and in pubs you’re never asked how you want it cooked and you always get a well done burger.

Is it safer to eat pink burgers now or are you guys doing it regardless of the risk?

When I want to find a decent Beef Wellington, I’ll ask a foodie. When I want to find a decent burger, I’ll ask a “chowhound.”

To be fair, the best burger I’ve had probably is a “foodie burger” - at Burger Bar between Luxor and Mandalay Bay in Las Vegas - but if you’re in the San Francisco area (especially north/east), my go-to place is Kinder’s BBQ, where you can get a double cheeseburger (somewhere around 10 ounces of meat, I think) for about $8, and make sure you get plenty of BBQ sauce with it. (The only drawback: no fries - but the one near where I live is next to an In & Out, so it’s not really a problem if it’s not during the lunch rush.)

Um, what? Who’s telling who what to eat? The quote is just someone saying that he feels the best burgers fall between $10 and $20. I, too, dislike the term “foodie,” but nobody anywhere is saying what anyone should or shouldn’t like.

Piling all that crap on a burger defeats the purpose. It should be all about the meat patty. If you need all that other stuff, you are doing something wrong.

I assume there’s always going to be some level of risk eating stuff like rare hamburger, steak tartare, sauces with raw eggs, etc., but I’ve never had any issue with it, and when I eat pub hamburgers, I always eat them on the rare side of medium rare. Ordering burgers to doneness at pubs here is pretty common (I can’t think of a bar off the top of my head that doesn’t ask me how I want my burger cooked.)

I didn’t even realize “chowhound” was an actual term (just thought it was made up for the website). Sounds even sillier than “foodie” to my ears. As I hear the term “foodie” used, it’s not specific to high-brow tastes. I hang out at one local culinary chat, and the foodies there are equally as interested in finding the cheap local fast food joints as they are the Beef Wellington. In fact, I would say moreso.