Can people in committed relationships have opposite sex friends?

In My Humble Opinion
41

[QUOTE=featherlou]
I see the opinions here are almost 100% against what the author is saying, but as I mentioned in an earlier post, North Americans aren’t doing very well in the long-term happy marriage category. Among our Doper group, there are thousands of divorced people, and thousands of those marriages ended because of infidelity. At the risk of going Dr. Phil on you, you all believe you can safely have opposite sex friendships, but how’s that working for you?
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featherlou, I’m pretty sure that the vast majority of divorces are for reasons *other * than infidelity.

I’m not married, but I’ve been in a relationship for ten years, and (each of us) having friends of both genders is working out fine, thanks. It’s called trust. People should try it. I hear it’s what good marriages are based on.

42

[QUOTE=featherlou]
Some other things we’ve thought of;

  • the United Statesian divorce rate is around 50% (the divorce rate for Canadians is lower at around 40%); this opposite sex friendship thing might not be working out that great for anybody.
    [/QUOTE]

So then people would find non-friends to commit infidelity with - coworkers, for instance, or someone they scoped out at a bar. Infidelity doesn’t wait around for you to make a friend, then beat you over the head until you screw that person.

And as was mentioned, there are plenty of other reasons for divorce. Personally, I think unrealistic attitudes about romantic love plus lack of communication skills are huge contributors.

43

[QUOTE=featherlou]
At the risk of going Dr. Phil on you, you all believe you can safely have opposite sex friendships, but how’s that working for you?
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Working great, thanks. Both my husband and I have good friends of both genders. We’re also each other’s best friend. Married for nearly 9 years.

44

The reviews of this book on Amazon are quite mixed. There isn’t much middle ground–people either love it or hate it. Folks might want to look at the sample pages for direct info from the author.

45

[QUOTE=Linty Fresh]
No, as far as I can tell, your idea of marriage is more or less the same as everyone else’s, if a bit more controlling. <snip>
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I don’t think that’s fair; my discussion so far has been about what I expect of myself, not what I make my partner do. If anything, you could say my idea of marriage is more controlled, rather than controlling, and I wouldn’t argue with that too much.

According to this article in Wikipedia, extra-marital affairs are the leading cause for divorce at 27%. Another statistic from another book I’m reading, “NOT Just Friends” by Shirley P. Glass indicates that for men, their affairs are 62% with co-workers and 12% with friends, and for women, 46% are co-workers and 22% are with friends (page 27). I’m thinking that we should clarify the definition of friends to include co-workers who have indeed become good friends - I think it would be a meaningless distinction to exclude them from the definition of friends for this discussion, since they are indeed preferred sex friends* rather than simply co-workers that you just say good morning to every day.

I realize that to go from these statistics to “having preferred sex friends causes all divorces” is a leap that even I as Devil’s Advocate am not willing to take, but they are a very significant factor in the breakdown of an alarming number of marriages. I think it really would be a good idea for North Americans to take a look at how we’re living our lives, and how it’s affecting our most important relationships.

Those of you saying that having preferred sex friends is working fine for you so far, are you willing to bet your marriage on it continuing to work for you, given these somewhat frightening statistics? If you are, of course I have no problem with that; there are many, many people for whom this will never become an issue, regardless of how many preferred sex friends you have, and you know yourself, your spouse, and your marriage.

*I don’t want to exclude homosexual people from this discussion - could we take it as written that this discussion is about friendships of the same sex as your preferred sexual partners (sorry, bi-sexuals, I guess that does mean everybody for you. :slight_smile: )

46

Yes, because my partner and I have explicit conversations about the quality of our relationship, as well as our relationships with others.

47

[QUOTE=featherlou]
Those of you saying that having preferred sex friends is working fine for you so far, are you willing to bet your marriage on it continuing to work for you, given these somewhat frightening statistics? If you are, of course I have no problem with that; there are many, many people for whom this will never become an issue, regardless of how many preferred sex friends you have, and you know yourself, your spouse, and your marriage.
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I’m trying to imagine this, featherlou, I really am. I’m trying to imagine that I have a friend at work who happens to be a girl, and one morning I have an argument with my spouse, whom I love dearly, and later that day, I see the friend at work and go, “Hi, Gladys, that’s a new shirt. By the way, do you want to go over to Pancho’s Hotel of Humpty after work and have hot sweaty monkey sex? I’ll bring the paddle.”

There’s nothing particularly frightening about those statistics in my eyes, particularly after I consider the fact that those percentages are percentages of couples who get divorced, which doesn’t include the successful couples, obviously. Add to that the fact that cause != entire reason behind the divorce, and I’m even less worried.

Yes, extramarital affairs caused 27% of divorces. What I want to know before getting worked up about that is what caused the extramarital affairs? It’s not like most extramarital affairs just happen out of the blue, at least not just because you happened to have that friend. OK, maybe some extramarital affairs, but not with most people, and trust me folks, I wouldn’t tell you that if I didn’t want to believe it.

Of course you’re right that we should be careful around those opposite-sex friends. Of course if I started having feelings for Gladys, I should back off for a little while, or if Gladys comes on to me (Jesus, Gladys, are you blind?) I should end the friendship. But as long as I’m prepared to do that and I’m honest with myself, I don’t see the problem.

There is such a thing as the slippery slope of infidelity here, but that doesn’t mean everyone with an opposite sex friend is necessarily on it. The slippery slope of infidelity can be countered with the politely worded warning sign of common sense and blocked with the clean white picket fence of a loving and open relationship with my wife, as well as guarded by the friendly retired ex-policeman of “I don’t want my balls cut off and sewn on my back.”

OK, I’m being snarky. But still I think you’re worrying a bit too much.

48

[QUOTE=featherlou]
Those of you saying that having preferred sex friends is working fine for you so far, are you willing to bet your marriage on it continuing to work for you, given these somewhat frightening statistics?
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I’m not “betting my marriage” on anything. My marriage depends on my choices and my husband’s choices to maintain it, not on any of this other random stuff.

49

[QUOTE=Lilairen]
I’m not “betting my marriage” on anything. My marriage depends on my choices and my husband’s choices to maintain it, not on any of this other random stuff.
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Exactly. There are lots of things that can fuck up a marriage, and trying to cut out all of them would remove any semblance of a life.

I’ve gravitated towards having both male and female friends since I was a toddler, basically, and cutting out a friend from my life just because I have a wedding ring on my hand and he has a penis is silly and, frankly, unnatural. We often see our friends together - should we cut out married couples from our social circle because that’s an opportunity for both of us to cheat?

50

I think what’s being missed here (or perhaps I’m too far gone on a Saturday night to see it) is this:

Infidelity is not the cause, it’s the symptom. If a person’s needs are being met within the marriage, infidelity doesn’t happen.

This has NOTHING to do with the folks you pick as friends. If your marriage has issues such that you look elsewhere hard enough, some opportunity will arise.

51

[QUOTE=Unintentionally Blank]
I think what’s being missed here (or perhaps I’m too far gone on a Saturday night to see it) is this:

Infidelity is not the cause, it’s the symptom. If a person’s needs are being met within the marriage, infidelity doesn’t happen.

This has NOTHING to do with the folks you pick as friends. If your marriage has issues such that you look elsewhere hard enough, some opportunity will arise.
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That and if you have to give up important friendships just to keep your marriage going…is your marriage really WORTH saving?

52

If there’s one lesson I learnt too late in life, it’s that no single one person can meet all the needs of another person.

To begin, I’m not married myself, but expecting that a marriage to meet all our needs is kind of…shaky to me, IMHO. Yes, it shall meet the most important needs, such as intimacy, among many, but for some needs you still need friends – and sometimes they’ll be of the opposite gender.

As long as the spouse is not having needs that shall be met in a marriage met by his opposite-gender friendship, it shall be okay.

53

ExtraKun, that really wasn’t my point, but looking back at my post I didn’t make that distinction. Of the things nessary in a marriage, if those needs aren’t met, for a long enough period of time, then infidelity is bound to occur.

My wife doesn’t provide my gas, groceries or electric power, doesn’t mean I’m gonna leave her because of it. :slight_smile:

54

Well, I’m with **Sam Stone ** and featherlou here. I do have some old friends from high school and college who are male, and they are people I am not attracted to. Even then, I would expect my husband to be uncomfortable (and he would be) if I spent a lot of time alone with any of them. I would also not be thrilled if he wanted to spend time alone with female friends from his past, but we don’t live where he grew up, so this isn’t really an issue for us. Maybe it’s the alone thing. Why wouldn’t I be invited?

I love my husband and my marriage very much, and I am really happy, but I am also the type to develop crushes somewhat easily, and I have to be careful about that. You might say that the fact that I can be attracted to other men means my needs are not being met in my marriage; I would disagree. I have never cheated on my husband, and won’t, but relationships are dynamic. I think for a lot of people it is a mistake to have intimate preferred sex friends–some people claim they can completely turn off the whole sex drive thing when they’re in committed relationships, and maybe they can. I think most people can only turn it down.

55

The way I see it, spending time with opposite-sex friends alone is skating along the edge. No, when your marriage is strong and happy, you’re not likely to start an affair. But every relationship has ups and downs, and when you hit a boring patch, or your husband is working too much, or whatever, it’s very easy to start talking with a friend as you would with your husband at a better time. You start telling him how much your husband’s little quirks annoy you sometimes (and what spouse doesn’t have annoying traits?), and confide a few things. Your connection with him heats up a little, you start looking forward to seeing him at work more than you look forward to seeing your husband…if you don’t put a stop to it, which isn’t easy for everyone to do, it’s simple to become infatuated, start an affair, and tell your husband you’ve found somebody else. All of it is easy, human nature stuff that only requires some lack of thought and a little frustration to start, not a conscious intention to cheat or a bad marriage.

Many, many affairs with co-workers or buddies start this way–I bet there are some here on this board–because people with perfectly good but temporarily un-exciting marriages start confiding in friends instead of doing the harder work of focusing on the marriage.

I don’t see it as “sacrificing friendships for a shaky, worthless marriage.” I think it’s important to keep friendships to an appropriate level, which often means having them in public, with others, in a group setting–not going out to lunch alone daily. I suspect that all marriages have shaky periods, but mostly they recover with a little bit of work and endurance–two traits that do not always come easily to people.

56

[QUOTE=dangermom]
Your connection with him heats up a little, you start looking forward to seeing him at work more than you look forward to seeing your husband…if you don’t put a stop to it, which isn’t easy for everyone to do, it’s simple to become infatuated, start an affair, and tell your husband you’ve found somebody else. All of it is easy, human nature stuff that only requires some lack of thought and a little frustration to start, not a conscious intention to cheat or a bad marriage.
[/QUOTE]
Wow…that’s one heck of a leap, in my opinion. I ask you this genuinely: do you honestly believe that all people, or even the majority of people, are THAT blind to signs that they’re on a slipperly slope and just fall into affairs so easily as all that?

I actually find it a bit depressing that there are so many folks in here who feel that spending time alone with a preferred-sex friend is an automatic red flag. I realize that we’ve all been raised differently and have different life experiences, but I don’t know that you can reduce any friendship to such broad generalizations.

I recognize that each of my friends possesses some quality or combination of qualities that I might find attractive, whether it be beauty, talent, fame, money, refinement, top skill or brains (sorry, I couldn’t resist). But this only serves as a reminder to me that my wife possesses the greatest combination of traits that I’m attracted to, in the greatest quantity and of the highest quality, of anyone I know. I spent a lot of time chasing this woman for a damn good reason, and there’s no fight or bad day that’s going to make me forget that. My friendships just make me appreciate it all the more. My wife is not replaceable, period.

It is up to each individual and each couple to set boundaries. When it comes to YOUR relationship, statistics are absolutely meaningless.

57

Good thing I’ve already slept with any of the male friends I’d have been interested in. :smiley:

58

Or, it requires a complete lack of boundaries, self-awareness, or discipline.

Seriously folks, if you lack the impulse-control skills of your average toddler, then I suppose you *should * avoid opposite-sex friends. Or, even better, you should avoid marriage.

59

I’d not have any friends if I couldn’t have friends of the opposite sex, especially since my one good female friend went all born again on me. I am ‘one of the guys’. Maybe because I didn’t have such a great relationship with my mother, but I just get along with guys better.

My husband had to accept certain things about me when we got together and that was my group of friends, who were all male (and the one girl before she went wacko). These guys acted like the big brothers I never had. 25 years later, that group of guys I hung out with in high school are still in my life. We’ve all spread to the 4 corners, but still meet on a semi regular basis, rent a beach house, and spend a week getting back in touch and drinking truckloads of beer. I don’t see this changing at all. (Granted one guy dropped out, but that’s because he married the wacko, and they hang out in some basement church.) My husband went to one of these vacations once, many years ago. He thought it was boring and hasn’t been to one since. There was never any discussion about me not attending.

Fast forward to the present: Hubby’s job moved us out of the home state away from all of my friends. We didn’t know anyone here, but as it stands right now, the group of people I hang out with are guys with one or two girls who tag along sometimes (they really are nice girls, and I can take them in short doses, but I honestly think I’d have to shoot myself in the head if I had to carry on an conversation about tampons again).

So, about twice a month, I go out and have a few beers with them, sometimes stay out too late, sometimes come home tipsy. While I might get a ration of shit for that, I’ve never heard the ‘who you fucking’ card. I’d like to say that my husband has his fair share of female friends; but can’t. He always seems to end up developing feelings. So, all of his friends are now guys.

You marry someone because s/he has the combination of traits you find attractive. If you look really hard at your opposite sex friends, you will see these traits spread out. I think it boils down to what people want out of their relationship with a specific person. I’m not saying that the line has not been blurred ever, as there guys I no longer am in contact with because we just got too close and feelings developed, at least speaking for myself. But really, who wants to fuck up a good, lifelong friendship with sex? (Ok, so yes I had sex with one of my high school buddies while we were in high school, but for us both it felt ickky afterwards. Several hot showers and a bottle of Scope later, we decide, yup, we’re just going to be friends.)

60

I’m going to take the unpopular stance and say I agree with the book.

To clarify, I think it’s absolutely fine to have FRIENDS of the opposite sex, but not necessarily CLOSE friends.

I also consider myself to be friends with my fiance’s best friend. But he is primarily my fiance’s friend, and I would never call him up to hang out one-on-one. I wouldn’t call him up at all.

Every single time I’ve had a close friend of the opposite sex, he has invariably professed his desire for “something more”. Every single time. Even when I was in a committed relationship with someone else. And every single time, it ruined the friendship.

While I believe it may be entirely possible for two members of the opposite sex to be friends, I think the chances are good that in most cases, one of them will have feelings that go above and beyond friendship. And whether or not those feelings are acted on, it makes things a bit sticky emotionally, at least for the significant others, and I think it’s best avoided.