Not picking up a health pack happens. We’ve all done it, even the OP. It is a mistake, one that doesn’t matter at all.
The AI Director in L4D looks at all the player stats, including the amount of ammo and health each player has. If the numbers are low, the game actually reduces the challenge. Therefor, the negligence of the health pack has NO IMPACT on the game. However, the AI system in L4D doesn’t know if a player isn’t “playing” any more.
So to extend the analogy, a player fumbled the ball and didn’t care. The OP yelled at him for it and the guy still didn’t care. The game went on and the team reached another down. The fumble had no effect on the game. However, the OP was mad and went and sat on the sidelines and pouted. With a man down his team lost.
I said 99% of people treat internet gaming like a game of pickup football. Even in pickup everyone likes to win. We just don’t freak out when someone is goofing around. The people who treat online gaming like serious business are the ones who need to adjust their perspectives.
The OP intentionally griefed the other players by not leaving the safe room. His action was more harmful than the player who forgot to pickup his health pack. He griefed the other players because they weren’t treating the game as seriously as he would like. That is utter insanity to me.
Ok. Maybe this is game-specific. If people accidentally miss a health pack, and their weapon, and accidentally can’t go back and get them when reminded, then you have a point.
First, if you’re playing with anyone verbally abusive, you’re not supposed to learn. You’re supposed to leave. Life’s too short to play with jerks.
Second, in group settings, you learn mostly by doing, but you can also learn by reading. It doesn’t take much time or effort to learn your role in a group setting. All you need to know is what class you are, and what spec you are. I, for example, am a healing paladin. So I would go to my MMO-info site of choice and read up on what a healing paladin’s responsibilities are instance play.
Most of your learning is done in a group. You learn by having experienced players around you who tell you what you need to do. You learn by asking questions, and discussing what is expected of you and what you in turn expect of others. You learn by doing the group activities, and reacting to whatever happens. Each group and each instance will be different, so you won’t be doing the exact same things every time, but you can still get into a rhythm and know the basics of what you need to do.
You also learn by failing, by making mistakes. You learn what you did or didn’t do that led to that mistake, and then in the future do or don’t do that.
Ogre, cite for what? That MMOs lend themselves to the OCD types? I wouldn’t think that needs one. Sure, City of Heroes and WoW and some others have been working to make themselves accessible to the casual player, but you get the real money from the folks who have to explore everything, have to earn all the achievements, have to get the best equipment, have to do everything they possibly can in the game. Casual players can walk away any time they want.
Miller is bang on as usual. Kicking someone for a single mistake from inexperience is a dick move. Kicking someone for refusing to learn or even communicate…not so dickish. They may want to have fun their way, but if we’re playing together there needs to be some sort of compromise, and that means listening to and respecting the people you’re playing with.
For what it’s worth, the guys who treat WoW deadly serious scare the crap out of me. My brother recently related a tale about how he was in a raiding guild and was the lead Warlock; best one in the guild, got first pick of new loot, all that. But he missed a single scheduled raid – and keep in mind, these guilds schedule raids just about every damn night – and they kicked him from his position. A game should not be worse than work.
This is exactly what I entered this thread to rant about. My husband complains about this “I was in a group and some noob didn’t know how to play and screwed it up for everyone!” I ask “So did you explain what he did wrong?” and he says “Of course not!”
I just don’t understand how otherwise reasonable people expect new players to instantly know the “right” way to play. Hell, even if you’re high level, you might not have done much group play - in games like WoW it certainly isn’t essential for levelling. So whe joining a group you don’t necessarily know the roles the various classes should play, or the tactics they’ll use.
Since I joined a decent Guild it hasn’t happened much, but I always used to make a point of explaining to players who fucked up and caused a dungeon wipe what they had done that had led to everyone getting killed. And not in a mean way either. Example, I was the highest level player in a group running Shadowfang Keep. We had one player who was probably a bit too little for the instance. I’d run the instance before on other characters so I was kind of shepherding everyone along, bailing anyone out who got in too deep etc. We get to this big old room filled with mobs and, despite being repeatedly told to stay away from the door The Littlest Toon kept running up to the door to look inside, pulling every mob in the room and getting his ass killed. I’d lay on the heals, get lots of aggro, and well, once the healer wipes, bye-bye party.
Some of the other players in the party were getting really abusive with this guy, and to be honest, it was really aggravating that he was ignoring (at first) polite request to stay at the back of the group until we’ve pulled. Eventually, people were leaving the group in disgust and the party fell apart. But unless someone has explained to you how aggro works, how will you understand? You just see you party buddy walk up to the door and figure “well, if he’s doing it, why can’t I?” So I took a few minutes to explain how aggro works, and how healing attracts aggro etc etc. Hopefully it helped make his next group experience better.
I’ve played a number of Korean-based MMOs, the time-sucking black holes known as Ragnarok Online and Maple Story being the two most (in)famous.
People I find annoying in game:
*“Give me (money/item).” No. You want something, grind for it or buy/sell it off other players or NPCs. I don’t care how much of a new player you claim to be, begging is not going to get you anywhere, especially not rude begging.
*“Tank for me while I gain a level.” That one I’m a little bit more forgiving about, because I was in the position of woefully unprepared newbie once upon a time. Just be polite and be prepared to offer compensation.
*“Don’t KS me. Go to another screen.” Uh. I’m the only other person on this screen, and I’m on the far end killing stuff. As a matter of fact, by killing stuff on my end I’m usually causing the enemies to regenerate on yours. Now, I’m more willing to accommodate if you’re polite, but otherwise, I’m not actually stealing your kills, go away.
*“Will you be my girlfriend?” No. I’m not in this game to meet people; anybody I’m friends with tends to be people I already know elsewhere. I don’t even know if you’re a guy. However, if the game supports a “marriage” mechanic that gives couples stat bonuses and extra missions, then I’m willing to fake it for adequate compensation.
*Scammers. Why do I have to be paranoid about being robbed in a freaking free-to-play MMO? Should be killed with fire.
Never mind. I’m bowing out, since I’ve never played WoW, and never really intend to, and thus am talking out of my ass.
My impression has been that WoW resembles Diablo in some ways (lots of level grinding, whacking baddies, etc.), and I found Diablo (and II) lethally dull. Not my type of game at all.
Hearing some of these WoW stories makes me glad I have a small guild of people I’d actually hang out with IRL and only group with them. Sure, it keeps us from some endgame content, but at least we have fun and no one whines.
The ones that get me is “You should be X race to play Y class because of the racials or you’re useless” or someone saying a whole spec is useless. What is wrong with playing what you want the way you want?
Well, what I’m saying certainly doesn’t hold true for everyone. I suppose OCD might be the wrong descriptor, although I dislike using ‘hardcore’, since it implies the people who take the games that seriously are the real players.
Yep, that’s how I get the maximum enjoyment out of WoW. Every member is personally IRL known to the couple who founded it. And, since they’ve lived all over the country and we have many IRL friends in common, it’s quite a good way to keep in touch with interstate mates.
OP here. Wow, this thread generated alot of replies since last night.
A few people seem to be saying I’m arguing things that I am most certainly not. I have nothing against screwing around in games. I’ve spent countless hours trying to land jeeps on top of helicopters in Battlefield 1942 and other misc shenaniganry in games.
The main thing that bothers me about the whole thing though is the lack of communication. I shall put for the main rule of online gaming: If you are playing an online game it is expected that you communicate with your teammates! If we are trying to play the game by only using pistols, left handed mice, and singing at the top of our lungs, FINE! But let me know! I don’t like feeling like I am talking to myself. If I am taking the time to type in chat that you forgot some equipment, or that there is something sneaking up behind you, or ask you a question as to how serious we are taking the game, then it is your obligation to respond! If you don’t want to talk to any one else, fine! Play the single player or don’t join teams!
Heck, maybe the guy in my example is a great player. Maybe he was just messing around. Maybe he was drunk! Maybe he was distracted by something happening in his room! I will never know, because he couldn’t take the time to inform the rest of his team what was going on. There is the possibility he was illiterate, but even if that is the case, could he not learn the phrase “I do not speak English or read so well, so please pardon my lack of communication?”
When you don’t communicate with others on your team, you only drag the game down for the rest of us because we don’t know what the heck you are doing! We aren’t psychic! For the poster who stated that he quit WoW because he messed up in a dungeon and his group made fun of him, that is not what I am talking about. Those guys were jerks. If the poster refused to inform his team he didn’t understand something, or refused to inform his team that he just wanted to explore around a bit, then he is exactly what I am talking about.
oooooh, online gaming whilst drunk… yea, that one’s gotten me in trouble a few times. You see your guildmates the next day and they ask “dude, what the hell is wrong with you? What the hell were you doing last night?” and all you can reply with is “wait… I was playing last night?!”
I hate people that join L4D matches, bark orders, call you a terrible player, then rage quit when they die because they’re rushing through the level like it’s a race. Tonight I tried to introduce a friend to L4D. He played through a campaign so we tried versus. Invariably some guy comes in with e-peen issues and bitches at my friend for not getting a hunter off him immediately and not innately knowing the best way to play the boomer. My friend understandably gets frustrated and leaves after our entire team tosses insults and quits out of nerd rage. Thanks you pimply faced fuckwads, that’s one less person I can play L4D with. :mad:
Getting pissed off in WOW I can understand because of the time investment. If you lose in L4D WHO GIVES A SHIT. The next match is three clicks away. No persistent score is kept (not that I know of) so you don’t have to worry about tarnishing your record for something no one takes seriously anyway. This isn’t the NFL, we’re playing a zombie game for christsakes. Lighten up.
I often get into the single player vs. multiplayer argument. The multiplayer enthusiast will always say “The computer is dull and predictable, with multiplayer you’re playing with real live people,” to which I respond, “Yeah, exactly my point!” The computer won’t get nerd rage when it loses. It won’t pull its internet in an RTS game to protect its score and rob me of a win. It won’t purposely teamkill, grief, or exploit. Not that I don’t play and enjoy multiplayer games, but they often give me an intense migraine which is the thing I’m trying to avoid when I’m playing video games.
Well… I’ve been thinking for a long time that I should try one of these multiplayer on-line games, but you guys convinced me in this thread that it’s not for me.
For one, I wouldn’t take that kind of crap from fellow players (I would be the guy who’s slow and don’t have any army after 20 minutes, , the guy who explores and get lost in the dungeon, the guy who goofs and do the “wrong” thing, etc…)
And besides, the whole thing sounds extremely dull and boring, including the language used (Tank pet? I nuke he dies? Sounds real fun). I didn’t think that players knew exactly what the quests were, or exactly what should be done in this or that place, that the role of each player in a group was strictly defined with on-line references guides one would refer to, and so on. And more importantly that you would be yelled at if you didn’t follow the script.
IOW, there’s no surprise, no experiment, no freedom of action, nothing done for fun or for the sake of it, nothing to discover…except apparently if you play solo, but in this case, there’s no point in playing online.
Or if you play with someone who’s never played the game before either. All these statements being made are assuming you’re playing with random people who’ve already milked everything they can out of the game and are trying for juuust a little more. They’ve already experienced the content, so they’re trying to get more replayability by perfecting their game. You get a lot less of that crap when you play with friends or other newbies.
For the sake of people who may or may not be called Timmy IRL, can we squash this term?