We’ve had several threads about how some teemings of the fitness faction use protein as part of their routine, such as this one about whey and certainly protein synthesis and muscle mass is impacted by those choices; we have not however had much discussion about carbs after exercise. The concept that carbs are required to increase insulin and thus anabolism may be debatable (protein drives insulin too) but having adequate glycogen stores in advance of the next work out and being able to thereby give a best effort seems important too.
Does anyone here pay attention to carbs as part of recovery as well?
Always did.
Sports drinks(diluted) during long rides. A soda and glass of milk when I come in the door then a bowl of cereal or two after the shower. Soon to be followed by a meal.
Absolutely. Fast-acting carbs, along with a fast-acting protein, are a staple of my post-workout nutrition. When I’m not dieting, I use dextrose powder at about 40-50 grams; along with about 40 grams of whey protein isolate/hydroyslate. This spares the protein for muscle rebuilding, while the carbs are used for glycogen replenishment.
Not just after exercise, but I think that a good intake of carbs and protein before exercise (not right before, but an hour or so) helps because your body will already have carbs (and protein) around before you digest what you take afterwards (I don’t take any fancy fast-absorbing supplements so this probably helps).
Conversely, if you want to maximize fat loss, some sources say not to eat before exercise (also mentions eating before exercise for the reasons I mentioned) - at all, as in go out first thing in the morning before breakfast (something I’ve never considered; I work out for the strength and muscles but don’t care at all for this look).
I exercise a lot, but I also eat a lot (2-3 good-sized meals per day, and I ‘snack’ tons - eat constantly while I am at work), so it all works out. I rarely feel any sort of muscle fatigue while I am using them, so I assume I’m good re: glycogen stores, even though I probably only get about 100-150g of carbs per day. Back when I counted, that was the average, and I haven’t changed my eating habits significantly. Most of my calories come from fat, and I aim for 100g of protein per day.
I only really pay attention to ‘recovery’ when I’ve done heavy weights or taken an exceptionally long/difficult bike ride; usually do two scoops of lightly sweetened whey protein powder in enough whole milk for it to be fully dissolved. So I’m getting some carbs in there, sure. And if I know I am going to lift, or have a strenuous day generally, I take care to be well-nourished and full of energy beforehand, which involves eating plenty of carbs.
ETA: I have low body fat naturally, and would like to gain significant weight/muscle. If I was trying to reduce body fat I’d do many things completely differently.
That almost sounds like too much. Pop and milk immediately upon returning home, then two bowls of cereal (with more milk I’m assuming) after showering, followed by (another) meal shortly after? This didn’t make you fat?
The insulin theory is flawed, and studies have shown that it is not the limiting factor.
Post exercise you need 1.2g of carbs per kilo body weight per hour, for a couple of hours to get your muscle glycogen stores back up.
You will also need protein to rebuild muscle, and you’ll need a reasonable amount of fat to rebuild cells. All that together should sound like “food.”
I personally consider the 20min window after a workout to still be part of the workout, so I continue consuming electrolytes and carbs as if I was still training. I also make a point of getting something solid like a Mojo bar. Then I aim to have a good quality meal within an hour.
As mentioned above, this usually looks like a can of Coke and a Mojo bar if I’m driving home, some times a banana too. If I left from home, then I usually have chocolate milk when I get back and a bunch of snacks (like cereal). Eventually I’ll have a carb-heavy meal like chicken curry with rice, or pasta with meat sauce.
Specifically addressing carbs post-workout would be most important if you were generally eating low carb, especially if you were doing a glycolytically demanding workout. Avid CrossFitters who are on the paleo diet are particularly prone to inadequate carb re-feeds due to hammering the glycolytic pathway more than most strength athletes do, and doing things at higher intensity than the endurance athletes generally do.
Robb Wolf, one of the main paleo diet guys, suggests that you put most of your carbs into your post-workout meals, and make sure to monitor your mental and physical state. He suggests not doing really low carb if doing CrossFit type workouts or any kind of endurance training, and instead follow an approach more like Cordain’s “Paleo Diet for Athletes”. This also assumes you’re already pretty lean and training at an intermediate to advanced level on a regular basis.
If you’re trying to get lean, then the advice is a bit different, but it’s probably still better to put a significant fraction of your carb allowance into post-workout meals rather than other times. People in the CrossFit community have had generally good success with low-carb to transient ketosis to lose body fat, but this comes at the cost of a temporary performance downtick. Some people don’t adapt well and will need to add more carbs overall, not just post-workout. Some people need more fat and less protein. You kind of need to start out with one of the generally recommended guidelines and then tinker and see what works for you.
In general, just eating a snack with a bit of protein and carbs, with a small to moderate amount of fat seems to be most commonly recommended for a post-workout snack. Depending on your dietary preferences and individual tolerance for dairy, whole milk seems to work just as well, if not better, than virtually all “performance” shakes or protein powders.
If I know it’s going to be longer than 30 minutes between my workout and a real meal, I’ll usually have a couple strips of jerky and some fruit, or milk, or a set-aside portion of lunch. I’m not very strict about my diet, which is why I hover around the low teens in body fat, only sometimes dipping into single digits.
There are lifestyle changes that I’m unable to make right now that would probably make a big difference in my appearance and performance. For example, I probably would go paleo if I had time to cook more often, but as it is my wife makes many of my meals. Since she’s Japanese there’s always rice, often some small breaded and fried things, and occasionally soy; all very much not paleo. I can’t reasonably ask her to change her cooking drastically for me. She has adjusted things somewhat.
I’m looking at trying my first deliberate bulking cycle, just to see what happens, when I get past this busy season (occasional 13 day weeks, average 10–11 hour days) and can actually work out on a regular basis instead of having to sneak in some calisthenics whenever I manage to have 20 minutes free. Looking forward to %&*#ing December and the end of intake season.
As a somewhat intermediate exerciser who keeps carbs on the low side, I guess I’m amazed at how much sugar people are eating. I mean REAL white sugar, not fruit sugar. So much soda, cereal, and “bars”. I think there are much better ways to get a healthy, beneficial carb and protein boost than processed sugar.
What I mean is that there are now dozens of brands of some kind of power bar/meal bar/energy bar/nutritional boost bar on the market designed to enhance your health in some way. There’s Balance Bars, Clif Bars, Luna Bars, Zone Bars, etc. Each of them seems to have anywhere from 180-250 calories and between 15 and 25 grams of sugar in them, and a list of ingredients you need a dictionary to interpret. Yet this wanna-be-health-food bars are just masquerading as a more expensive Snickers Bar, in which you at least know you’re getting real peanuts. It’s concerning that they are replacing real food for a lot of people.
I just so happen to have three ‘bars’ in my desk drawer. The are not just a more expensive Snickers bar. Granted, when people treat them as just another snack that’s what they become: another 250 calories they shouldn’t have eaten.
They’re not, however, intended to be used as a snack. Clif bars, for example, are created and intended for people who need a dense, well-rounded food to sustain outdoor activity.
Just because people think that they’re eating something ‘healthy’ when they grab one doesn’t mean that the ‘bars’ themselves are bad.
As to the undecipherable list of ingredients, let’s examine some:
Clif Bar (White Chocolate Macadamia)- Brown rice syrup, soy rice crisps, so protein, rice flour, barley malt, soybeans, soy flour, rolled oats, white chocolate, toasted oats, cane juice, oat fiver, chocory extract, milled flaxseen, oat bran, macadamie nuts, soy butter, salt, date paste, sea salt. Then, a list of vitamins and minerals. Admittedly, I would have to look up Ergocalciferol, but it says on the package that it’s vitamin D2 so that doesn’t count.
PowerBar ProteinPlus (Dark Chocolate Toffee Nut) - soy protein, when protein, calsium caseinate, glucose syrup, sugar, palm kernel oilk, cocoa, soy lechitin, nonfat milk, vanilla flavor, glycerin, almonds, maltitol syrup, soy nuts, sunflower oil, salt, high oleic canola oil, almond butter, soy lechitin, peanut flour. Then the list of V+M.
Fit&Active Protein Energy Bar (Yogurt honey peanut) - soy protein, milk protein, whey protein, glucose syrup, fructose, peanuts, palm kernel oil, whey powder, milk powder, yogurt powder, soy lechitin, soybeans, dextrose, honey, and V+M.
Ok, so there are lots of sugars. AND I’ll give you that whole foods are a better choice. In fact, I am trying very hard to eat more whole foods, and these few ‘bars’ have been in my drawer for weeks at least. But sometimes they’re handy when I haven’t had time to prepare a good lunch and I need something to complement my can of soup and banana.
Your body doesn’t care where the sugar came from. After an intense workout your body needs glucose to rebuild depleted muscle glycogen. The sooner it gets it the faster it can rebuild meaning the faster you recover, and the sooner you can workout again. Whether it’s from sugar cane, sugar beets, corn, or strawberries, your body doesn’t care.
A can of Coke just so happens to be a perfect little package of carbs, caffeine, and fluid. The “bars” you refer to are all extremely nutritionally dense, and after some trial and error I found the ones that were easiest to digest.
After 4 hours on a bike and 2 hours running in 95+ heat I know I need to get a lot of nutrients in me and can’t always stomach what you think I should be eating.
Likewise, a bowl of cereal with ice cold milk is very easy to eat after a hard work out when I really want a substantial snack. It’s also very easy to have lots of milk and cereal on hand.
I’m pretty sure what Winnie means is getting carbs from actual food, which has other nutrients in it, which is really the whole argument against eating stuff like soda (if your body needs extra energy, doesn’t it also need more vitamins and minerals, especially since you lose some in sweat and need others for repair?). Even one of those “bars” discussed here would be better than a can of soda because they do put other nutrients in them, and why only ingest carbs when you also need protein (caffeine also doesn’t agree well with me)?
Why the quotes around bars?