Card Playing Etiquette

Factual Questions
1

I’m starting this in General Questions, because I’m looking for something specific.

While playing cards at a friends house last night at mutliple tables… we eventually whittled the players down to join tables. It became quickly evident that we were playing with different etiquette. Little things that ordinarily wouldn’t matter, but because each table was a playing by their own table etiquette, it made merging the tables very disruptive.

Two Examples:

  1. we were playing with two decks so that the next person to deal can have their deck ready when the next hand begins. In other words you shuffle the cards that you’re going to deal with. The ‘other’ table played where you shuffled the deck after you dealt the cards!

I’ve also always played that after you shuffle the cards, you let the person to your right cut the cards. This is because you don’t want the person who is to be dealt the first card to have the cut. The other table continually let the person to the left off the dealer have the cut.

So, my General Question is: I’m looking for references to card playing etiquette SPECIFICALLY DEALING WITH SHUFFLING AND CUTTING. The only reference I’ve found is from Wiki, which at least supports the “person to your right cuts the deck”.

So… waddya have, waddya have?

2

…am I the only one who doesn’t know what game it is you’re playing? “Cards” covers a lot of territory.

3

I’ve always played where the person to the dealer’s right gets option of cut. Also, if we are playing with multiple decks, the small blind shuffles the deck to be used for the next hand, and still gives option of cut to the person to his/her right before distributing cards.

Shuffling after dealing/cutting is a big no-no.

There are also various rules/traditions that concern “burning” cards, but that’s another thread.

Hope this helps.

On edit, it is most likely that the OP is playing Poker, probably Hold 'Em, Duck Duck Goose

4

See, I assumed that they were playing a trick-taking game like spades or hearts or bridge–those, especially bridge, have their own complex set of rules for shuffling/cutting. Among other things, it is the dealer’s partner who shuffles.

5

The gold standard for all etiquette and rules regarding poker is Robert’s Rules by Bob Ciaffone (I helped him edit previous versions).

THE SHUFFLE AND CUT

  1. The pack must be shuffled and cut before the cards are dealt. The recommended method to protect the integrity of the game is to have three people involved instead of only two. The dealer on the previous hand takes in the discards and squares up the deck prior to the shuffle. The player on the new dealer’s left shuffles the cards and then slides the pack to the new dealer, who gets them cut by the player on his right.

  2. The deck must be riffled a minimum of four times. The cut must leave a minimum of four cards in each portion.

  3. The bottom of the deck should be protected so nobody can see the bottom card. This is done by using a cut-card. A joker may be used as a cut-card.

  4. Any complaint about the shuffle, cut, or other preparation connected with dealing must be made before the player has looked at his hand or betting action has started.

6

IIRC from my Bridge-playing days…

Two decks are used.

The hand is over, the result is scored and all the cards are thrown in the middle. If it is South’s turn to deal, he reaches to his left and takes a deck that is already shuffled. He does not shuffle it, he moves it across to the player on his right (East) who cuts it. While this is happening, North (across the table from South) gathers in all the cards from the previous deal and starts to shuffle. South deals, and North finishes shuffling and puts the cards down to his right - this is West’s left and things are now set for the next deal.

7

I see two etiquette questions from the OP.

The first is whether, when using two deck at a table, you should shuffle before or after you deal. It’s not uncommon for home games to use two decks, but Robert’s
says nothing about this. Common sense suggest that you follow the same protocol as if you were using one deck… the dealer shuffles his own deck. As with all house rules, the key is consistency and making sure everyone knows the rules ahead of time.

The other question is whether it was proper to have the person to the dealer’s left cut the deck (ie, the person who would receive the first card). Robert’s does speak to this, and I think it’s inappropriate to ever offer the cut to the left.

In may not seem that important in the grand scheme of things, but these are the sort of disputes that kill home games. It’s the responsibility of the host to establish the rules, and if there is any dispute, the host should clarify.

8

While I’ve seen a variety of conventions in two-deck home poker games, the one I see most commonly (including in games with several professionals) goes like this:



time=0'00"
player-A    player-B    player-C    player-D   player-E
shuffling   dealing     blind       blind

time=1'00"
player-A    player-B    player-C    player-D   player-E
            cleaning/   
            cutting A's
            shuffle to C

time=1'05"
player-A    player-B    player-C    player-D   player-E
            shuffling   dealing     blind       blind
9

I’ll add: This is also the convention that I find works best, with minimal reaching over people and getting somebody’s attention. (A problem with “small blind shuffles”, a convention I see used on occasion, is that the small blind may not be paying attention the the hand if he’s not in it, and the previous hand and muck will be sitting there until someone says, “Joe, clean up! It’s your shuffle!” When you shuffle your own deal, you’re cleaning up as you go and are guaranteed to be paying attention, so that’s never a problem. If deck setting is a worry, the cut is there.)

10

I intentionally kept it vague. So; regarding trick taking games… what ARE the complex set off rules for shuffling/cutting?

11

That’s interesting to me… so not only do you play where you shuffle ‘behind’ the dealer, you’re actually shuffling TWO behind the dealer. . I’ve always played poker where you shuffle ‘in front’ of the dealer. in other words you shuffle the cards you’re going to deal. It’s never been a problem with timing since you have an entire hand to get them shuffled (the one being played with the ‘other’ deck).

12

What K364 said. It’s not crazy complex, but it has it’s own pattern and if you are playing with serious bridge types (which I am not), it is a serious thing to disregard it.

13

anson2995, You reposted my OP very well. Thanks. As I said, either way is fine when it’s established at the beginning off the night… (well not really, but I’m low key enough to deal with it :rolleyes: ) but we had a mini-clash of protocol when we joined the tables.

14

It usually goes like this:

While the current dealer is getting ready to deal or dealing, the player two seats to his left is shuffling the other deck. After the round is over, the player with the freshly shuffled deck passes it to his right (to the new dealer) and that dealer offers the cut to the player on his right.

The dealer never shuffles his own deck.

15

Post #6 is really very easy and sensible when you are using two decks.

Just follow this pattern and it works out:

  1. When your partner is dealing, you should shuffle the cards and place them to your right.

  2. When it’s your turn to deal, take the cards that are on your left, pass them to your right for cutting and deal them.

It’s magic! :slight_smile: It’s also expected at a bridge table. I don’t see why you couldn’t use it in hearts, spades, rook

16

I’m a professional poker dealer. Our standard shuffle is a shuffle, shuffle, box, shuffle.

I’m completely lost how you do it in home/other games.

Although I might point out that standardized house rules are a Good Thing. When folks bitch about my ability to shuffle, not only can I point out that I am absolutely following procedure, I’ve whittled it down to about 6 seconds to shuffle a deck, down from 11.

It may seem silly to write out a page of house rules, but if you have enough folks for two tables and that much variation among the tables and presumably at least one person that likes to bitch, it does quiet down the game play a bit and avoid such confusions. Also, getting a Hoyle book on card standards probably wouldn’t be a bad idea for solving issues that come up. (Example: I had a split pot in 7 card stud last night, due to the rake, the pots weren’t even, I had a complete brain fart on how you decide who gets the extra chip. In Hold’em the player closest to the button gets it, since the other player has the advantage of being later to act)

Now, let’s not get into the technicalities of a proper ruffle, because frankly, when you amateurs shuffle, it drives me batty. :wink:

17

Spanish card games. All I know about poker and blackjack is the names (well, not, but almost).

The same deck or double deck is used every time. Dealer shuffles. If the game goes clockwise, the cutter is the person to the right; if the game goes counterclockwise, the person to the left. That is, every time the cutter is whomever will not be getting the first card.

It’s pretty standard practice to ask for “rules clarification” if there’s new players in the group. The usual version of Chinchón (i.e., the one you find in rulebooks) includes a single pack of cards, no jokers, no 8s and 9s (there’s no 10s in Spanish cards); I’ve played in places which used a double pack with all cards (very large table) and where players who had already lost could sign back in by paying a fine. So it’s best to start by asking “ok, how do you play it? Anything I need to know about?”